- start: 4.6
  end: 10.003
  speaker: barron
  en: 'Either/or in regard to Jesus: either he is who he says he is, or he''s a bad man.'
  zh: 关于耶稣，只能二选一：要么他就是他说的那一位，要么他就是个坏人。
- start: 11.064
  end: 19.508
  speaker: barron
  en: What's ruled out is the middle ground that a lot of people take today, which is, Well, I don't think it's God, but he's a very interesting, inspiring religious teacher.
  zh: 被排除的就是许多人今天所持的中间立场，说：「我不认为他是神，但他是一位非常有趣、能启发人的宗教导师。」
- start: 19.588
  end: 24.591
  speaker: barron
  en: Actually, he's not; he's sort of a dangerous, strange figure.
  zh: 实际上，并非如此；他其实是个颇为危险、古怪的人物。
- start: 24.731
  end: 32.845
  speaker: barron
  en: So, as he himself says, Either you're with me or you're against me; either you gather with me or you scatter with me.
  zh: 正如他自己所说：「不是和我在一起，就是与我作对；不是与我同聚，就是分散。」
- start: 32.845
  end: 37.226
  speaker: barron
  en: He compels a choice the way no other religious founder does.
  zh: 他迫使人做出抉择，这是其他任何宗教创始人都无法相比的。
- start: 112.654
  end: 127.636
  speaker: barron
  en: It all begins really with a joke.
  zh: 一切都真是从一个「玩笑」开始的。
- start: 128.496
  end: 135.45
  speaker: barron
  en: The essence of humor is the coming together of opposites, the meeting of incongruous things.
  zh: 幽默的精髓在于对立面的交融，也就是不协调之事物的相遇。
- start: 138.692
  end: 149.617
  speaker: barron
  en: The central claim of Christianity is that God became human; God became one of us, taking to himself a human nature.
  zh: 基督信仰的核心宣告是：神成为人；神成为我们中的一员，取了人的本性。
- start: 152.438
  end: 158.681
  speaker: barron
  en: And to make the humor even more acute, God didn't first appear in some great cultural center.
  zh: 更令人觉得这种「幽默」加倍强烈的是，神并没有先显现在什么伟大的文化中心。
- start: 159.161
  end: 163.322
  speaker: barron
  en: He didn't appear in Rome; he didn't appear in Athens or Babylon.
  zh: 他没有出现在罗马；也没有在雅典或巴比伦显现。
- start: 164.503
  end: 171.986
  speaker: barron
  en: He appeared here in Bethlehem, even today a simple, humble place, even more so in Jesus' time.
  zh: 他却是在伯利恒出现；就算放到今天，那地方依然朴素卑微，在耶稣的时代更是如此。
- start: 174.327
  end: 187.032
  speaker: barron
  en: St. Paul said of Jesus, Though he was in the form of God, Jesus did not deem equality with God something to be grasped; rather, he emptied himself and took the form of a slave.
  zh: 圣保罗这样谈到耶稣：「他本有神的形像，不以自己与神同等为强夺的；反倒虚己，取了奴仆的形像。」
- start: 190.407
  end: 197.854
  speaker: barron
  en: The master of the universe became, out of love, our slave, and the joke is marvelously on us.
  zh: 统管万有的主，为了爱，竟成为了我们的仆役，而这「玩笑」就这样奇妙地临到了我们。
- start: 221.926
  end: 236.634
  speaker: barron
  en: Jesus grew up in obscurity; we know almost nothing about the first 30 years of his life except that most likely he was trained as a carpenter.
  zh: 耶稣在隐蔽之中长大；他头三十年的生平我们几乎一无所知，只知道他很可能接受了木匠的训练。
- start: 238.576
  end: 241.217
  speaker: barron
  en: He was not a member of a rabbinic school.
  zh: 他并不属于拉比学派的一员。
- start: 242.878
  end: 246.54
  speaker: barron
  en: He was not a scribe or a Pharisee or a temple priest.
  zh: 他既不是文士，也不是法利赛人，也不是圣殿里的祭司。
- start: 247.982
  end: 250.983
  speaker: barron
  en: He was, if you will, a layman.
  zh: 如果你愿意这么说，他不过是个平信徒。
- start: 254.383
  end: 260.825
  speaker: barron
  en: But he emerged on the scene around the year 30 A.D. in the most extraordinary way.
  zh: 可是在公元三十年前后，他却以极其不同寻常的方式公开现身。
- start: 267.368
  end: 279.492
  speaker: barron
  en: In the hills of Galilee, this carpenter began to preach with an unprecedented and unnerving boldness, claiming personal authority over the Torah itself.
  zh: 在加利利的山间，这位木匠以前所未有、令人不安的大胆宣讲，并宣称自己对律法本身拥有个人的权威。
- start: 279.781
  end: 285.262
  speaker: barron
  en: Which was the divine law that was considered the court of final appeal for any faithful rabbi?
  zh: 那可是所有忠实拉比都视为最终依归的神的律法。
- start: 286.863
  end: 295.004
  speaker: barron
  en: He also performed great miracles of healing and demonstrated a mastery over the very forces of nature.
  zh: 他也行了奇妙的医治，并展现了对大自然力量的掌握。
- start: 298.285
  end: 306.927
  speaker: barron
  en: The Gospels tell us that the crowds came at him from all sides, most of them wondering just who this man was.
  zh: 福音书告诉我们，群众从四面八方拥到他面前，大多数人都在猜想这个人究竟是谁。
- start: 314.07
  end: 324.233
  speaker: barron
  en: One of my great fears is that Jesus becomes domesticated—so he's a nice, gentle figure; I understand his moral teaching; he's like many other figures—and then, see, I probably forget about him.
  zh: 我最担心的是人们把耶稣给「圈养」了——说他就是个和善、温柔的人物；他教导的道德我明白；他跟许多其他人物相似——然后你看，大概我就把他给忘了。
- start: 324.233
  end: 328.274
  speaker: barron
  en: So he's like everybody else; he's an echo of a lot of other spiritual figures.
  zh: 如此一来，他就跟别人没什么两样；他不过是许多其他属灵人物的回声。
- start: 328.274
  end: 331.374
  speaker: barron
  en: And the minute that happens, then the whole thing falls apart.
  zh: 而一旦发生这种情形，一切就崩解了。
- start: 331.394
  end: 340.604
  speaker: barron
  en: Jesus was, in his own lifetime and then after the resurrection, a deeply disconcerting figure; he was a subversive figure.
  zh: 在他在世之时，直到复活之后，耶稣都一直是个令人深感不安的人物；他是个颠覆性的存在。
- start: 340.765
  end: 342.886
  speaker: barron
  en: And so I want to recover that.
  zh: 所以我想重新让人看见这一点。
- start: 365.774
  end: 378.723
  speaker: barron
  en: At a certain point after his emergence on the public scene, Jesus traveled with his disciples to the far northern reaches of the Promised Land, to the region of Caesarea Philippi, near the present-day Golan Heights.
  zh: 在他公开现身后不久，耶稣带着门徒前往应许之地的最北端，到该撒利亚腓立比一带，也就是如今的戈兰高地附近。
- start: 379.984
  end: 386.309
  speaker: barron
  en: Today, one can see the ruins of a temple to the god Pan that stood on this site in Jesus' day.
  zh: 如今，人们仍可见到当年耶稣时代在那儿供奉潘神的庙宇遗迹。
- start: 388.731
  end: 398.908
  speaker: barron
  en: It was here that he asked them a very peculiar question, and that question was, Who do people say that I am?
  zh: 就在这里，他问了门徒一个极为特别的问题，那就是：「人们说我是谁？」
- start: 399.429
  end: 402.331
  speaker: barron
  en: Jesus didn't ask, What do people think of my teaching?
  zh: 耶稣没有问：「人们对我的教导怎么看？」
- start: 402.731
  end: 404.653
  speaker: barron
  en: or What impression am I making?—reasonable
  zh: 或者：「我给人留下什么印象？」——这还算合理。
- start: 404.653
  end: 405.753
  speaker: barron
  en: enough questions.
  zh: 问题已经够多了。
- start: 405.874
  end: 408.616
  speaker: barron
  en: He asked, Who do people say that I am?
  zh: 他问：「人们说我是谁？」
- start: 408.616
  end: 413.579
  speaker: barron
  en: It would be hard to imagine another great religious founder asking such a question.
  zh: 很难想象另一位伟大的宗教创始人会问出这样的问题。
- start: 413.879
  end: 416.921
  speaker: barron
  en: The Buddha wouldn't focus on himself, and I say it to his credit.
  zh: 佛陀不会强调他自己，我觉得这是他的高明之处。
- start: 416.921
  end: 419.943
  speaker: barron
  en: He would say, There's a way I've discovered; I want you to know it.
  zh: 他会说：「我发现了一条道路；我希望你能认识它。」
- start: 420.304
  end: 425.107
  speaker: barron
  en: Muhammad wouldn't focus on himself; he'd say, There's a revelation I've received; I want you to know it.
  zh: 穆罕默德不会把焦点放在自己身上；他会说：「我领受了一则启示；我希望你能知道它。」
- start: 425.245
  end: 429.989
  speaker: barron
  en: Confucius wouldn't say, It's about me; he'd say, It's about this path that I found.
  zh: 孔子也不会说：「一切关乎我。」他会说：「关键在于我所发现的这条道路。」
- start: 431.23
  end: 432.471
  speaker: barron
  en: Then there's Jesus.
  zh: 然后就轮到耶稣了。
- start: 432.891
  end: 436.534
  speaker: barron
  en: His question is, Who do you say that I am?
  zh: 他的问题是：「你们说我是谁？」
- start: 437.375
  end: 440.357
  speaker: barron
  en: The whole Gospel really hinges on this point.
  zh: 整个福音确实围绕着这个关键点。
- start: 441.278
  end: 451.967
  speaker: barron
  en: Jesus' identity, personally, is what it's about because throughout the Gospels, he consistently speaks and acts in the very person of God.
  zh: 耶稣的身份本身才是重点，因为在整个福音书当中，他始终以神自己的身份说话并行事。
- start: 460.639
  end: 470.102
  speaker: barron
  en: In the Gospel of Luke, Jesus says, Unless you love me more than your very life, more than your mother and father, you're not worthy of me.
  zh: 在路加福音里，耶稣说：「若不爱我胜过自己的生命，胜过父母，就不配做我的门徒。」
- start: 472.422
  end: 483.505
  speaker: barron
  en: You might imagine a religious teacher saying, Unless you love God more than your very life, but to say Unless you love me more than the highest goods in the world?
  zh: 你或许会想象某位宗教导师会说：「除非你爱神胜过自己的生命」，但耶稣却说：「除非你爱我胜过世界上一切最宝贵的事物」？
- start: 485.066
  end: 489.573
  speaker: barron
  en: Jesus says to the paralyzed man, My son, your sins are forgiven.
  zh: 耶稣对那个瘫痪的人说：「孩子，你的罪赦了。」
- start: 490.554
  end: 494.097
  speaker: barron
  en: Right away, the bystanders say, Who does this man think he is?
  zh: 当下，旁边的人就说：「这个人以为自己是谁？」
- start: 494.157
  end: 495.698
  speaker: barron
  en: Only God can forgive sin.
  zh: 只有神能赦罪。
- start: 495.698
  end: 506.186
  speaker: barron
  en: 'Now here''s the point: Jesus compels a choice the way no other religious founder does.'
  zh: 现在说到重点：耶稣迫使人做出抉择，这在任何其他宗教创始人身上都不曾见到。
- start: 507.407
  end: 510.449
  speaker: barron
  en: Either you're with me, he said, or you're against me.
  zh: 他说：「不是和我在一起，就是与我作对。」
- start: 510.449
  end: 511.75
  speaker: barron
  en: Do you see why?
  zh: 你明白为什么吗？
- start: 512.296
  end: 516.059
  speaker: barron
  en: If he is who he says he is, then we have to give our whole life to him.
  zh: 如果他就是他所宣称的那一位，那么我们必须把整个生命都交给他。
- start: 516.059
  end: 520.201
  speaker: barron
  en: If he is God, then he must be the center of our lives.
  zh: 如果他是神，那他就应当成为我们生命的中心。
- start: 520.882
  end: 528.167
  speaker: barron
  en: If he's not who he says he is, he's not a good man; he's a dangerous, misguided fanatic.
  zh: 如果他并非他所说的那个人，那他就不是好人，而是个危险、误入歧途的狂热分子。
- start: 529.108
  end: 536.393
  speaker: barron
  en: Jesus, more than any other figure, more than any other religious founder, compels us to make a choice.
  zh: 耶稣比任何其他人物、任何其他宗教创始人都更让我们不得不做出抉择。
- start: 556.751
  end: 562.275
  speaker: barron
  en: There's a strange passage in the tenth chapter of Mark's Gospel that's rarely commented upon.
  zh: 在马可福音第十章里有一段奇怪的经文，几乎没人详细评论过。
- start: 562.856
  end: 568.499
  speaker: barron
  en: Jesus and his disciples are making their way from Galilee in the north to Jerusalem in the south.
  zh: 那时，耶稣和他的门徒正从北方的加利利前往南方的耶路撒冷。
- start: 569.521
  end: 582.857
  speaker: barron
  en: 'Mark says this: And they were going up to Jerusalem, and Jesus went before them, and they were amazed, and as they followed, they were afraid.'
  zh: 马可这样记载：「他们往耶路撒冷去，耶稣在前头走；他们希奇，跟随的人也害怕。」
- start: 584.638
  end: 588.259
  speaker: barron
  en: This obscure fragment is, I think, very telling.
  zh: 我想，这段不太引人注意的记载其实很发人深省。
- start: 589.839
  end: 599.562
  speaker: barron
  en: One might be intrigued by a religious teacher; one might be captivated by a spiritual leader, but amazed and afraid?
  zh: 人或许会对一位宗教老师感兴趣，或被一位属灵领袖所吸引，但竟会又惊又怕吗？
- start: 600.803
  end: 608.965
  speaker: barron
  en: Then we recall that in the Old Testament, awe and fear are two standard responses to God.
  zh: 这时我们想起旧约里，对神的常见回应便是敬畏和害怕。
- start: 611.744
  end: 619.292
  speaker: barron
  en: Having grasped this uniqueness of Jesus, we can begin to look at his preaching and action with greater understanding.
  zh: 明白了耶稣的这种独特性，我们就能更深刻地理解他的宣讲和行动。
- start: 620.734
  end: 626.7
  speaker: barron
  en: He was God in the flesh, Yahweh moving among his people.
  zh: 他就是道成肉身的神，耶和华在自己子民中行走。
- start: 631.604
  end: 633.305
  speaker: barron
  en: Jesus is strange.
  zh: 耶稣是一个奇特的存在。
- start: 633.305
  end: 639.827
  speaker: barron
  en: You know, I'm going to resist the tendency to domesticate him and turn him into, Yeah, he's like, you know, an ancient Deepak Chopra.
  zh: 你知道吗，我要抵挡那种把他圈养起来的倾向，不让他变成「对啊，他就好像是个古代的迪帕克·乔普拉」。
- start: 639.827
  end: 645.429
  speaker: barron
  en: You know, he had interesting spiritual insights, and the Gospel writers told these kind of cool stories to exemplify that.
  zh: 你看，他确实有一些有趣的属灵见解，而福音书的作者们就记载了那些很酷的故事来说明这一点。
- start: 645.49
  end: 649.431
  speaker: barron
  en: I think he was strange, and so people say they were amazed and afraid.
  zh: 我觉得他很奇特，所以人们说他们又惊又怕。
- start: 649.431
  end: 652.212
  speaker: barron
  en: I don't think anyone's really amazed and afraid of Deepak Chopra.
  zh: 我不认为有人会对迪帕克·乔普拉感到又惊又怕。
- start: 652.212
  end: 656.634
  speaker: barron
  en: They might find him insightful and helpful, but I doubt they're amazed and afraid.
  zh: 人们或许觉得他富有见地，也颇有帮助，但我怀疑他们会对他又惊又怕。
- start: 656.634
  end: 661.876
  speaker: barron
  en: But when someone takes five loaves and two fish and feeds 5,000, that's a little scary.
  zh: 可要是有人用五个饼和两条鱼就喂饱了五千人，那确实有点吓人。
- start: 662.111
  end: 668.976
  speaker: barron
  en: And I think if we domesticate Jesus too much, we take away that dimension from him.
  zh: 我认为如果我们过度把耶稣给「圈养」起来，就会抹去他身上那种令人震惊的面向。
- start: 668.976
  end: 675.521
  speaker: barron
  en: They were intensely interested in the fact that Jesus drove out demons, that he performed miracles, that he healed people.
  zh: 他们对耶稣赶鬼、行神迹、医治人这一切事实都充满了强烈的兴趣。
- start: 675.521
  end: 681.405
  speaker: barron
  en: Even like the calming of the storm at sea; when that's over, they say, Who is this?
  zh: 就像他平息海上的风暴；等风暴停了之后，人们说：「这是谁啊？」
- start: 681.486
  end: 683.828
  speaker: barron
  en: Who is this man who can calm the...
  zh: 「这是谁，竟然能平静……」
- start: 683.828
  end: 690.012
  speaker: barron
  en: I mean, they knew all about spiritual gurus; they all had rabbis and teachers and insightful people, but he was so far beyond that.
  zh: 我是说，他们对各种属灵导师都很熟悉；他们也有拉比、老师和见识深远的人，但耶稣却远远超越了这些。
- start: 690.132
  end: 691.293
  speaker: barron
  en: Who is this?
  zh: 「这是谁？」
- start: 691.533
  end: 693.294
  speaker: barron
  en: Who's calming the sea?
  zh: 「是谁在平静海面？」
- start: 715.224
  end: 738.246
  speaker: barron
  en: 'The ancient Israelites ardently expected that Yahweh would accomplish four great things: he would gather and shepherd his people, he would purify the holy temple in Jerusalem, he would overcome the enemies of Israel, and he would reign as the Lord of the nations.'
  zh: 古代的以色列人热切期盼耶和华成就四件大事：他会聚集并牧养他的子民、洁净耶路撒冷的圣殿、击败以色列的仇敌，并以万国之主的身份掌权。
- start: 740.467
  end: 749.97
  speaker: barron
  en: What startled the first followers of the Lord was that Jesus himself accomplished precisely these things, but in the most unexpected way.
  zh: 让主最初的门徒惊讶的是，耶稣本人正好成就了这些事，却是以最出人意料的方式在进行。
- start: 756.792
  end: 762.893
  speaker: barron
  en: I'm standing by the shore of the Sea of Galilee; I'm in Jesus' home country.
  zh: 我现在就站在加利利海边；这里是耶稣的家乡。
- start: 762.893
  end: 773.055
  speaker: barron
  en: 'It''s in these hills here that he preached for the first time, and his theme was simple and direct: the Kingdom of God is at hand.'
  zh: 当年他就是在这片山丘中首次传道，他的信息既简单又直接：「神的国近了。」
- start: 773.555
  end: 779.076
  speaker: barron
  en: Now, oceans of ink have been spilled over the centuries by scholars trying to explain what the Kingdom of God meant.
  zh: 几世纪以来，学者们孜孜不倦地写下无数文字，力图阐明「神的国」意味着什么。
- start: 779.476
  end: 783.457
  speaker: barron
  en: 'It might be good to ask: what did people in these hills understand by that term?'
  zh: 或许我们应该问：当时住在这片山丘的人们，会如何理解这个词？
- start: 786.129
  end: 790.672
  speaker: barron
  en: They would have understood the tribes being gathered.
  zh: 他们会想到各支派被重新聚集。
- start: 792.874
  end: 796.836
  speaker: barron
  en: Throughout the Old Testament, God is portrayed as a great gathering force.
  zh: 在整个旧约中，神被描绘成一股宏大的聚集力量。
- start: 797.637
  end: 806.423
  speaker: barron
  en: God forms a people, Israel, after his own heart and then endeavors to use the Israelites as a magnet to gather the rest of the nations.
  zh: 神按着他的心意，塑造了以色列子民，然后要借着他们像磁铁一般，将其余的列国吸引过来。
- start: 808.405
  end: 811.847
  speaker: barron
  en: How did Jesus, Yahweh in the flesh, do this?
  zh: 那么，道成肉身的耶和华——耶稣，是怎样实践这一点的呢？
- start: 814.178
  end: 823.745
  speaker: barron
  en: He practiced open table fellowship, inviting to his festive meals sinners, prostitutes, tax collectors, the sick, and the forgotten.
  zh: 他实行开放的餐桌共融，邀请罪人、妓女、税吏、病患以及被遗忘的人来参加他的宴席。
- start: 824.867
  end: 833.413
  speaker: barron
  en: He was not simply exemplifying the virtue of inclusivity; he was Yahweh gathering in his people.
  zh: 他不仅仅是在彰显包容的美德；他正是耶和华在召聚他的子民。
- start: 835.836
  end: 838.698
  speaker: barron
  en: This also explains why he healed so many.
  zh: 这也说明了为什么他医治了如此多的人。
- start: 839.799
  end: 850.776
  speaker: barron
  en: In the society of his time, physical illness was construed as a kind of curse, and in many cases, sickness or deformity prevented one from worshiping with the rest of the community.
  zh: 在当时的社会中，身体的疾病被视为某种诅咒，许多情况下，病患或肢体残缺会使人无法与社群一同敬拜。
- start: 852.177
  end: 861.721
  speaker: barron
  en: Curing the blind, the deaf, the lame, and the leprous, Jesus was Yahweh binding up the wounds of his people and restoring them to communion.
  zh: 当他医治瞎子、聋子、瘸腿的和麻风病人时，耶稣就是耶和华在抚平子民的创伤，并把他们带回共融当中。
- start: 864.582
  end: 869.524
  speaker: barron
  en: Jesus turned upside down many of the social conventions of his time and place.
  zh: 耶稣颠覆了他所在时代和地域的许多社会规范。
- start: 871.198
  end: 878.864
  speaker: barron
  en: In the Palestine of the first century, men didn't speak to women publicly, but Jesus spoke openly to the woman at the well.
  zh: 在第一世纪的巴勒斯坦，男人一般不会在公共场合跟女人讲话，但耶稣却公开与井边的那位妇人交谈。
- start: 880.126
  end: 891.916
  speaker: barron
  en: A pious Jew of that time would have been rendered ritually unclean by touching a dead body, but Jesus touches the dead body of the daughter of Jairus as he raises her back to life.
  zh: 当时，一位虔诚的犹太人若碰触尸体就会在礼仪上被视为不洁，可耶稣却摸了睚鲁女儿的身体，把她从死里复活。
- start: 893.578
  end: 903.098
  speaker: barron
  en: In Jesus' time, as in ours, places of honor were sought at public banquets, but Jesus told his disciples to take the lowest places.
  zh: 在耶稣的年代，跟我们今天类似，人们在公共宴席上都想占据尊贵席位，但耶稣却告诉他的门徒要坐在最低微的位子上。
- start: 905.762
  end: 912.57
  speaker: barron
  en: All of this was in service of building up the Kingdom, gathering in the tribes.
  zh: 这一切都是为着建立神的国度，聚拢各支派而成就的。
- start: 955.569
  end: 962.798
  speaker: barron
  en: We're looking down at one of the most sacred places on the planet—the Temple Mount, sacred to Jews, Christians, and Muslims.
  zh: 我们正俯瞰地球上最神圣的地点之一——圣殿山，对犹太人、基督徒和穆斯林而言都极其神圣。
- start: 963.038
  end: 975.867
  speaker: barron
  en: It is such a holy place because for a thousand years, right in that spot, where now you see the beautiful Muslim sanctuary of the Dome of the Rock, there was the great Temple to Yahweh, the God of the Israelites.
  zh: 之所以如此神圣，因为在那块地方，也就是如今你所见那庄严的圆顶清真寺所在之处，过去曾有以色列人的神——耶和华——的伟大圣殿，长达一千年之久。
- start: 975.867
  end: 981.131
  speaker: barron
  en: It was the center of Israelite liturgical, religious, and cultural life.
  zh: 那是以色列礼仪、宗教与文化生活的核心。
- start: 981.631
  end: 986.234
  speaker: barron
  en: Well, to that place, at the climax of his life, came Jesus.
  zh: 正是在那地方，耶稣在他生命的高潮时来到那里。
- start: 986.234
  end: 999.575
  speaker: barron
  en: He took a rope of cords, the Gospel said, and he drove out the money changers, turned over the tables, and then he says, I will tear down this place and in three days rebuild it.
  zh: 福音书上说，他拿起绳子作鞭子，把兑换银钱的人赶出去，翻倒他们的桌子，然后他说：「我要拆毁这地方，并在三日内重建它。」
- start: 1000.356
  end: 1008.517
  speaker: barron
  en: Well, it would be hard to imagine in our terms what this was like because religion, society, and culture were so tightly bound in Jesus' time.
  zh: 在我们看来，这景象很难想象，因为在耶稣的时代，宗教、社会和文化是紧密交织在一起的。
- start: 1008.517
  end: 1010.598
  speaker: barron
  en: This was upsetting everything.
  zh: 这事等于是搅乱了一切。
- start: 1010.598
  end: 1017.079
  speaker: barron
  en: This was the most radical sort of thing you could do, and it's probably what led most directly to Jesus' crucifixion.
  zh: 这是能做的最激进的举动，或许也是最直接导致耶稣被钉十字架的原因。
- start: 1017.299
  end: 1019.7
  speaker: barron
  en: Well, what in the world was he doing?
  zh: 那么，他到底在做什么呢？
- start: 1019.92
  end: 1021.26
  speaker: barron
  en: What did these words mean?
  zh: 这些话到底意味着什么？
- start: 1022.031
  end: 1026.653
  speaker: barron
  en: To understand it more fully, we have to understand what the temple meant.
  zh: 若要更透彻地明白，我们就得先理解圣殿的意义。
- start: 1031.335
  end: 1039.858
  speaker: barron
  en: Once again, we recall that ancient Israel expected Yahweh to cleanse the temple, to gather his people in, to write praise.
  zh: 我们再一次回想，古代以色列人期盼耶和华洁净圣殿，聚拢他的子民，并让称颂之声洋溢。
- start: 1041.119
  end: 1047.541
  speaker: barron
  en: 'A simple but very significant spiritual teaching is this: we become what we worship.'
  zh: 有一条简单却极具意义的属灵教训：我们会成为我们所敬拜的对象。
- start: 1048.002
  end: 1051.503
  speaker: barron
  en: We conform ourselves to what we consider the highest good.
  zh: 我们会与自己视为最高善的事物相契合。
- start: 1053.883
  end: 1058.644
  speaker: barron
  en: God wanted his people to praise him so that they might become like him.
  zh: 神渴望他的子民敬拜他，使他们能更加与他相似。
- start: 1060.524
  end: 1067.366
  speaker: barron
  en: This is why the Jerusalem Temple, the place where Yahweh was worshiped, was so central to ancient Israel.
  zh: 这也就是耶路撒冷圣殿之所以对古代以色列如此核心的原因——那里是敬拜耶和华之处。
- start: 1067.766
  end: 1076.568
  speaker: barron
  en: The hope was that all the nations of the world would be attracted to God precisely through the right worship of the Israelites.
  zh: 他们的盼望在于所有世上的民族，都能因以色列人正确的敬拜而被吸引到神面前。
- start: 1077.388
  end: 1089.283
  speaker: barron
  en: 'The prophet Isaiah put it this way: The mountain of the Lord of hosts will be raised above the other mountains, and to it all people will stream.'
  zh: 先知以赛亚这样说：「末后的日子，耶和华殿的山必坚立，超乎诸山，高举过于万岭；万民都要流归这山。」
- start: 1092.365
  end: 1105.115
  speaker: barron
  en: But the Israelites fell again and again into the worship of false gods—sometimes the gods of the surrounding nations, but also the gods of wealth, power, nationalism, and pleasure.
  zh: 然而，以色列人一再陷入对假神的敬拜——有时是周边列国的神祇，也可能是财富、权力、民族主义以及享乐这些偶像。
- start: 1105.575
  end: 1112.2
  speaker: barron
  en: And this is why the great prophets continually summoned the nation back to the worship of the true God.
  zh: 正因为如此，那些伟大的先知才不断召唤这民族回到对真神的敬拜上。
- start: 1112.952
  end: 1119.033
  speaker: barron
  en: The false worship of Israel came to be symbolized for the prophets in the corruption of the Jerusalem Temple.
  zh: 在先知的眼中，以色列的错误崇拜在耶路撒冷圣殿的败坏上表露无遗。
- start: 1119.733
  end: 1132.296
  speaker: barron
  en: Ezekiel imagined that God's glory had left his temple and would one day return when the place was purified, and when it did, water would flow from its side for the renewal of the world.
  zh: 先知以西结所见的异象里，神的荣耀离开了他的圣殿，将来在圣殿得到洁净时才会再次回来；那时殿的旁边要流出活水，为要更新整个世界。
- start: 1135.377
  end: 1141.538
  speaker: barron
  en: Now we can begin to understand some of Jesus' enigmatic sayings and actions in regard to the temple.
  zh: 现在我们就能开始明白，耶稣关于圣殿的一些深奥言语和行动到底意味着什么。
- start: 1142.745
  end: 1156.492
  speaker: barron
  en: When he said in reference to himself, You have a greater than the temple here, he was designating himself as the new place of worship, as the temple where divinity and humanity meet.
  zh: 他曾指着自己说：「在这里有比圣殿更大的。」那是在宣告他自己就是新的敬拜之所，那是神性和人性相遇的圣殿。
- start: 1158.754
  end: 1170.96
  speaker: barron
  en: When he cleansed the temple, he was not simply a 1960s-style radical railing against the establishment; he was pronouncing judgment on the old temple and establishing himself.
  zh: 当他洁净圣殿时，他并不仅仅是像六十年代的激进人士那样抨击体制；他是在宣告对旧圣殿的审判，并在树立他自己。
- start: 1171.221
  end: 1184.991
  speaker: barron
  en: In John's Gospel, Jesus specifies that after destroying the old temple, he would, in three days, rebuild it.
  zh: 在约翰福音中，耶稣明确说，在拆毁了那旧圣殿之后，他要在三日内把它重新建立起来。
- start: 1185.751
  end: 1188.913
  speaker: barron
  en: He was referring to the temple of his body.
  zh: 他指的是他自己身体的圣殿。
- start: 1191.435
  end: 1199.581
  speaker: barron
  en: After Jesus' crucifixion, when the Roman soldier pierced Jesus' side, blood and water flowed out.
  zh: 耶稣被钉十字架后，罗马士兵用枪扎他的肋旁，流出了血和水。
- start: 1201.368
  end: 1214.738
  speaker: barron
  en: This represents the fulfillment of Ezekiel's great prophecy that when the glory of Yahweh would return to the temple, water would flow from its side for the restoration of the world.
  zh: 这象征了以西结那重大预言的应验：当耶和华的荣耀回到圣殿时，将有水从圣殿流出，为整个世界带来复苏。
- start: 1220.123
  end: 1225.587
  speaker: barron
  en: Probably the main point to realize is that Jesus himself is the new temple.
  zh: 或许最关键的是要明白：耶稣就是那崭新的圣殿本身。
- start: 1225.717
  end: 1231.621
  speaker: barron
  en: He says, I'll tear down this old one and in three days rebuild it, talking about the temple of his own body.
  zh: 他所说的「我要拆毁这旧殿，并在三日内重建」，指的正是他自己身体的圣殿。
- start: 1231.641
  end: 1237.825
  speaker: barron
  en: So, Jesus, risen from the dead and now the Lord of the Church, remains the place of right praise.
  zh: 因此，那从死里复活、如今为教会之主的耶稣，仍然是合宜敬拜的所在。
- start: 1237.825
  end: 1243.509
  speaker: barron
  en: Jesus is himself pure; now the Church participates in that.
  zh: 耶稣他自己是纯洁的；如今教会也有分于他的纯洁。
- start: 1243.509
  end: 1255.117
  speaker: barron
  en: The Church shares in the lordship of Jesus, and so in its sacraments, in its saints, and in its essential structures, the Church also remains pure, the place of right praise.
  zh: 教会与耶稣的王权有分，所以在教会的圣事、在圣徒、以及其本质结构之中，教会也保持纯洁，成为合宜敬拜之处。
- start: 1255.214
  end: 1258.775
  speaker: barron
  en: But the Church is also made up of sinful human beings.
  zh: 然而，教会同样由有罪的人所组成。
- start: 1258.775
  end: 1265.138
  speaker: barron
  en: So, up and down the centuries, you're going to see lots of bad behavior, lots of corruption, lots of negativity.
  zh: 因此，在历代之中，你都会看到许多不良行为、许多败坏、许多消极的现象。
- start: 1265.258
  end: 1269.18
  speaker: barron
  en: Paul says we hold this treasure in earthen vessels.
  zh: 保罗说，我们有这宝贝放在瓦器里。
- start: 1269.18
  end: 1273.241
  speaker: barron
  en: So the treasure is Christ, who himself is the new temple.
  zh: 因此，这宝贝就是基督，他自己就是那新的圣殿。
- start: 1273.241
  end: 1280.044
  speaker: barron
  en: The treasure includes the sacraments, the liturgy, and the saints, but they're held in these weak, fragile vessels.
  zh: 这宝贝也包括圣事、礼仪和圣徒，但却存放在这些软弱又易碎的器皿中。
- start: 1280.184
  end: 1285.594
  speaker: barron
  en: That's where the corruption comes in, and yes, that Church always needs to be cleansed.
  zh: 这就是败坏会出现的原因，因此教会也需要不断地被洁净。
- start: 1285.755
  end: 1289.857
  speaker: barron
  en: It's Christ operating within the Church who effectively cleanses it.
  zh: 正是基督在教会内部的运行，使得教会能够真正得洁净。
- start: 1311.656
  end: 1318.379
  speaker: barron
  en: One of the most evocative themes in the Old Testament is the portrayal of God as a warrior.
  zh: 旧约中最引人联想的主题之一，就是将神描绘成战士。
- start: 1319.34
  end: 1322.121
  speaker: barron
  en: Yahweh fights against the enemies of Israel.
  zh: 耶和华为以色列人争战，对抗他们的仇敌。
- start: 1323.923
  end: 1328.245
  speaker: barron
  en: Nevertheless, Israel was not the supreme nation of the world.
  zh: 然而，以色列并非这世界上最强盛的国家。
- start: 1328.445
  end: 1344.566
  speaker: barron
  en: On the contrary, it was, in the course of its history, enslaved by Egypt, attacked by the Philistines, exiled by the Assyrians and the Babylonians, and overrun by the Greeks and the Romans.
  zh: 相反地，在其历史进程中，它曾被埃及奴役，受非利士人攻打，被亚述人与巴比伦人掳去，又遭到希腊人和罗马人的蹂躏。
- start: 1346.328
  end: 1356.295
  speaker: barron
  en: So, Israelites began to dream that one day God would definitively battle the enemies of the nation and make it the dominant power in the world.
  zh: 因此，以色列人开始幻想，有一天神会彻底击败国家的敌人，使以色列成为世界上的主宰。
- start: 1357.396
  end: 1366.362
  speaker: barron
  en: And so we shouldn't be the least bit surprised that when Jesus comes, speaking and acting in the very person of God, he comes to fight.
  zh: 所以，当耶稣来临，以神自己的身份行事说话时，他来是为了战斗，这一点并不令人惊讶。
- start: 1368.404
  end: 1371.406
  speaker: barron
  en: But what a strange warrior he was!
  zh: 然而，他却是多么奇特的一位战士！
- start: 1386.432
  end: 1394.678
  speaker: barron
  en: Our first glimpse of Jesus the fighter is at Bethlehem, in the stable over which the Church of the Nativity stands today.
  zh: 我们对这位战士耶稣的最初一瞥，就在伯利恒，也就是如今主诞教堂所矗立的那间马槽里。
- start: 1398.741
  end: 1408.153
  speaker: barron
  en: The Christmas story is not just a charming tale we tell to children; it's full of this motif of Jesus the warrior, the one who's come to fight.
  zh: 圣诞故事远不只是个讲给孩子听的温馨故事；其中充满了「战士耶稣」的主题，也就是那位来作战的主。
- start: 1410.276
  end: 1423.21
  speaker: barron
  en: C.S. Lewis, the great English writer, said that Jesus came so quietly, in this unobtrusive way, because he was meant to slip clandestinely behind enemy lines.
  zh: 英国作家C·S·刘易斯曾说，耶稣以这样安静、不显眼的方式降临人间，是因为他要悄悄地潜入敌后的阵营。
- start: 1459.514
  end: 1459.514
  speaker: barron
  en: Thank you.
  zh: 谢谢。
- start: 1459.514
  end: 1463.538
  speaker: barron
  en: If we look in Luke's account of the nativity, we see these warrior motifs quite clearly.
  zh: 如果我们翻看路加对耶稣诞生的记载，就能十分清楚地看出这些战士的主题。
- start: 1463.538
  end: 1469.144
  speaker: barron
  en: How did that story open up?
  zh: 那个故事是如何开场的呢？
- start: 1470.313
  end: 1473.034
  speaker: barron
  en: By invoking two of the most powerful people of the time.
  zh: 它一开始就提到了当时最具权势的两个人。
- start: 1473.034
  end: 1482.476
  speaker: barron
  en: They said, While Quirinius was the governor of Syria and when Caesar Augustus was the king of the world, a census was called.
  zh: 记载说，当居里扭作叙利亚巡抚、凯撒·奥古斯都作世界之主之时，下令要进行户口调查。
- start: 1482.956
  end: 1487.858
  speaker: barron
  en: Quirinius and Caesar Augustus—two of the most prominent, powerful people in the ancient world.
  zh: 居里扭和凯撒·奥古斯都——他们是古代世界中最知名、最有权势的两个人物。
- start: 1487.858
  end: 1493.699
  speaker: barron
  en: Well, that's how you'd expect great poems and stories in the ancient world to begin, by invoking the high and mighty.
  zh: 在古代，人们往往就是这样开篇伟大的诗歌和故事，先提及那高高在上的权贵。
- start: 1494.045
  end: 1511.572
  speaker: barron
  en: But then St. Luke pulls the rug out from under us because he says, My story is not primarily about them; my story is about this little couple making their way from one dusty outpost of Augustus' empire to another, about Mary and Joseph coming here to Bethlehem.
  zh: 可接着圣路加却让我们大感意外，因为他说：「我的故事的主角并不是他们；而是这个卑微的小两口，从奥古斯都帝国的一处荒凉之地赶到另一处，说的是马利亚和约瑟来到伯利恒的故事。」
- start: 1511.772
  end: 1522.056
  speaker: barron
  en: 'And the story will unfold now as a tale of two emperors: Augustus in Rome and the true and new emperor, Christ Jesus.'
  zh: 于是，这个故事变成了两位君王的对比：罗马的奥古斯都以及那真正又全新的君王——基督耶稣。
- start: 1526.653
  end: 1528.734
  speaker: barron
  en: We hear that Mary came to Bethlehem.
  zh: 我们听说马利亚来到了伯利恒。
- start: 1528.734
  end: 1538.937
  speaker: barron
  en: To this place, there was no room at the inn, so he was born in a cave, a stable, with the animals around him.
  zh: 来到这里，客店里没有地方，因而他诞生在一个洞穴里，一间马槽之中，周围只有牲畜相伴。
- start: 1539.918
  end: 1543.339
  speaker: barron
  en: Who was the best-protected person in the ancient world?
  zh: 在古代世界里，谁才是受到最严密保护的人呢？
- start: 1543.699
  end: 1545.86
  speaker: barron
  en: It had to be Caesar Augustus in Rome.
  zh: 毫无疑问，那个人一定是罗马的凯撒·奥古斯都。
- start: 1546.881
  end: 1550.942
  speaker: barron
  en: But the true emperor, the new emperor, arrives unprotected.
  zh: 然而，那真正的君王、新的君王，却是在毫无保护的情况下降临。
- start: 1552.002
  end: 1559.619
  speaker: barron
  en: Imagine a newborn baby, too weak even to hold up his own head and now wrapped up in swaddling clothes.
  zh: 想象一个新生的婴孩，甚至连头都抬不起来，还被襁褓裹着。
- start: 1559.619
  end: 1564.342
  speaker: barron
  en: Can you imagine an image of greater weakness and vulnerability?
  zh: 你能想象有比这更软弱、更容易受伤害的情景吗？
- start: 1564.342
  end: 1569.105
  speaker: barron
  en: Who would be the most powerful person in the ancient world?
  zh: 在古代世界中，谁会是最具权势的人？
- start: 1569.526
  end: 1571.346
  speaker: barron
  en: Caesar Augustus in Rome.
  zh: 罗马的凯撒·奥古斯都。
- start: 1573.248
  end: 1582.174
  speaker: barron
  en: The new emperor, the true emperor, is not powerful in that worldly way, but someone who's willing to be wrapped up and vulnerable in love.
  zh: 然而，这新的君王、真正的君王，并非以世俗的方式强大，而是那位甘愿被襁褓包裹、自愿在爱中显出脆弱。
- start: 1585.66
  end: 1587.701
  speaker: barron
  en: Who was the best-fed person in the ancient world?
  zh: 在古代世界中，谁又是吃得最好的？
- start: 1587.701
  end: 1593.084
  speaker: barron
  en: It had to have been Caesar Augustus—snap his fingers, get any sensual pleasure he wanted.
  zh: 那必然是凯撒·奥古斯都——只要他打个响指，就能得到任何他想要的感官享受。
- start: 1593.084
  end: 1595.965
  speaker: barron
  en: Most of us would think that’s essential to the good life.
  zh: 多数人都会觉得，那正是美好生活的必备要素。
- start: 1597.326
  end: 1607.131
  speaker: barron
  en: But the true emperor, the new emperor, is not one who is fed but who becomes food for the world, placed in that manger where the animals eat.
  zh: 但这真正的君王、新的君王，并非被人奉养的那一位，而是成为这世界的粮食，被放在牲畜所吃的马槽里。
- start: 1608.893
  end: 1615.716
  speaker: barron
  en: 'One more detail from that story: we hear that an angel appeared to shepherds in these hills surrounding Bethlehem.'
  zh: 那故事当中还有一个细节：我们听说，在伯利恒周围的山丘上，有天使向牧羊人显现。
- start: 1616.616
  end: 1624.219
  speaker: barron
  en: Don't get romantic about the angels; the typical reaction to an angel in the Bible was fear.
  zh: 别对天使抱着浪漫幻想；在圣经中，人们对天使的典型反应是恐惧。
- start: 1624.719
  end: 1630.982
  speaker: barron
  en: 'Imagine this reality from another dimension: this higher power suddenly breaking into this world.'
  zh: 想象那来自另一个层面的实在，这更高的力量突然闯进我们的世界。
- start: 1630.982
  end: 1632.762
  speaker: barron
  en: Fear is the proper reaction.
  zh: 惧怕是正常的反应。
- start: 1633.343
  end: 1640.425
  speaker: barron
  en: The angel announces the good news, and then it says, “With that angel, there appeared a stratios of angels.”
  zh: 天使报了大好的信息，而后说：「与那天使同在的，还有一支天军（stratios）。」
- start: 1640.485
  end: 1645.047
  speaker: barron
  en: We often translate that word as host angels, but that word means army.
  zh: 我们常把那个词译为天使天军，但它的含义其实是「军队」。
- start: 1645.047
  end: 1648.07
  speaker: barron
  en: Our words strategy and strategic come from that.
  zh: 我们的词「strategy」和「strategic」就是从这个词衍生而来。
- start: 1648.07
  end: 1651.614
  speaker: barron
  en: With that angel, there appeared an army of angels.
  zh: 也就是说，与那天使同在的，是一支天使的军队。
- start: 1653.657
  end: 1656.519
  speaker: barron
  en: Who had the biggest army in the ancient world?
  zh: 在古代世界里，谁拥有最强大的军队？
- start: 1656.88
  end: 1659.363
  speaker: barron
  en: Caesar Augustus, which is why he was able to dominate.
  zh: 是凯撒·奥古斯都，这正是奠定他得以称霸的原因。
- start: 1659.363
  end: 1674.745
  speaker: barron
  en: 'You see what Luke is saying: his army is nothing compared to the army of this baby king, this stratios, this army of angels who will fight not with the puny weapons of the world but will fight with courage, justice, and nonviolence.'
  zh: 你看路加到底在说什么：奥古斯都的军队跟这婴孩之王——这支天使军队（stratios）相比，根本微不足道；他们不是用世上那些微弱的武器来争战，而是以勇气、公义和非暴力来征战。
- start: 1674.745
  end: 1678.127
  speaker: barron
  en: But the baby king has got the bigger army.
  zh: 而那婴孩之王拥有更为强大的军队。
- start: 1682.048
  end: 1688.69
  speaker: barron
  en: There’s a line in the prophet Isaiah that says when the Messiah comes, it will be like Yahweh bearing his holy arm.
  zh: 先知以赛亚里有一句话说，当弥赛亚来到时，就好像耶和华露出他圣洁的膀臂。
- start: 1688.69
  end: 1693.551
  speaker: barron
  en: That meant rolling up his sleeve and bearing his powerful arm for conquest.
  zh: 那意思就是挽起衣袖，展示他强而有力的臂膀来征服。
- start: 1693.932
  end: 1702.134
  speaker: barron
  en: 'Here’s a great detail: that holy arm of Yahweh is the arm of the baby Jesus coming out of the crib.'
  zh: 这里有个绝妙的细节：那耶和华的圣臂，正是从马槽里伸出的婴孩耶稣的手臂。
- start: 1702.274
  end: 1705.935
  speaker: barron
  en: Who would have expected the power of God to arrive in that way?
  zh: 谁能料到神的权能竟会以这样的方式来临？
- start: 1706.755
  end: 1721.052
  speaker: barron
  en: But the battle that begins here, this lining up of the two emperors, comes to its fulfillment on the cross, and it’s there that this baby king, now come of age, will engage in its final battle.
  zh: 然而，这场在此开始的战斗，也就是两位君王的对峙，将在十字架上达到终局；在那里，这位已长大成人的婴孩之王，将进行他最后的战役。
- start: 1726.254
  end: 1730.135
  speaker: barron
  en: Part of the poetry of the Bible is that God is so unexpected.
  zh: 圣经里有一种诗意，那就是神往往出人意料。
- start: 1730.176
  end: 1733.437
  speaker: barron
  en: That God is love—that’s a strange message.
  zh: 「神就是爱」——这是一个多么奇异的信息。
- start: 1733.437
  end: 1735.518
  speaker: barron
  en: That’s not a common message at all.
  zh: 那一点也不寻常。
- start: 1735.518
  end: 1740.98
  speaker: barron
  en: The idea that God would be powerful and lordly and judgmental seems much more natural.
  zh: 人们更容易接受的概念，大多是神拥有权能、尊贵并以审判为主。
- start: 1741.055
  end: 1747.645
  speaker: barron
  en: But the message that God is love and therefore self-emptying, that God would come as a child, is part of the grace and poetry of Christianity.
  zh: 然而，「神就是爱，并因此而自我虚空，神竟以孩童的样式降临」，正是基督信仰的恩典与诗意所在。
- start: 1748.307
  end: 1754.857
  speaker: barron
  en: They got that; the first Christians saw that, and they kind of delighted, I think, in the poetry and the paradox of it.
  zh: 初代基督徒明白了这一点；我想，他们欣赏其中的诗意与张力，也为此感到欣喜。
- start: 1816.764
  end: 1816.764
  speaker: barron
  en: Thank you.
  zh: 谢谢。
- start: 1816.764
  end: 1821.866
  speaker: barron
  en: On Palm Sunday, Jesus entered the holy city hailed as the Son of David.
  zh: 在棕树主日，耶稣被人称作大卫之子，进入了那座圣城。
- start: 1822.667
  end: 1825.428
  speaker: barron
  en: He came as a Davidic warrior.
  zh: 他以大卫王裔的战士之姿前来。
- start: 1827.929
  end: 1833.872
  speaker: barron
  en: Then, as we saw, he went up to the temple precincts, and there he picked a fight.
  zh: 接着，正如我们所见，他上到圣殿的院子里，在那里引发了争端。
- start: 1834.472
  end: 1855.527
  speaker: barron
  en: As Holy Week unfolded, it’s as though all the powers that had opposed him from the time of his birth came out in full force to meet him.
  zh: 圣周的进展仿佛显明，从他出生以来一直与他为敌的各方势力，全都倾巢而出与他对抗。
- start: 1855.527
  end: 1863.21
  speaker: barron
  en: The Church of the Holy Sepulchre in Jerusalem is built over the very site of the crucifixion and burial of Jesus.
  zh: 耶路撒冷的圣墓教堂就建在耶稣被钉十字架和埋葬的确切遗址之上。
- start: 1865.385
  end: 1873.551
  speaker: barron
  en: It commemorates and preserves, therefore, the battlefield where Jesus the warrior engaged in his ultimate struggle.
  zh: 因此，它纪念并保留了那片战场——就是战士耶稣进行最后搏斗的地方。
- start: 1876.014
  end: 1885.641
  speaker: barron
  en: When you read those densely textured Passion narratives in the Gospels, you see all forms of human dysfunction on display.
  zh: 当你阅读福音书中有关耶稣受难的详尽记载，就会看见各式各样的人性扭曲在那里展现。
- start: 1886.422
  end: 1897.148
  speaker: barron
  en: Jesus is met by hatred, by denial, by betrayal, by violence, by stupidity, by institutional injustice, and by incomparable cruelty.
  zh: 耶稣面对的是仇恨、否认、背叛、暴力、愚昧、体制上的不公以及无可比拟的残酷。
- start: 1897.148
  end: 1907.69
  speaker: barron
  en: It’s as though all of human darkness comes out to meet him, and here on Mount Calvary, he does this final battle.
  zh: 仿佛所有人性的黑暗都一齐涌现来对抗他，而他就在加略山上展开了这最后的决战。
- start: 1909.03
  end: 1912.331
  speaker: barron
  en: But he responds not with more violence.
  zh: 可他却并没有以暴力相还。
- start: 1912.631
  end: 1917.597
  speaker: barron
  en: Rather, he allows all of this darkness to wash over him.
  zh: 相反，他任由这一切黑暗向他袭来。
- start: 1917.597
  end: 1929.426
  speaker: barron
  en: He takes upon himself the sins of the world and says, Father, forgive them; they know not what they do.
  zh: 他承担了全世界的罪，并说：「父啊、赦免他们，因为他们所作的，他们不晓得。」
- start: 1931.127
  end: 1945.249
  speaker: barron
  en: It’s as though on the cross, Jesus interrupts that terrible play of violence and counter-violence, of vengeance and counter-vengeance, which has bedeviled the human race from the beginning.
  zh: 仿佛在十字架上，耶稣终止了那自始以来在人类之间循环往复的暴力与反暴力、复仇与反复仇的可怕戏码。
- start: 1945.249
  end: 1953.753
  speaker: barron
  en: It’s as though God the Father takes that cross and puts it in the works to interrupt this terrible process.
  zh: 也好像圣父把十字架插进人类的进程之中，打断这可怕的循环。
- start: 1955.814
  end: 1962.077
  speaker: barron
  en: Jesus takes away the sins of the world, and that’s how he fights.
  zh: 耶稣除去了世人的罪，这正是他作战的方式。
- start: 2043.524
  end: 2043.524
  speaker: barron
  en: Thank you.
  zh: 谢谢。
- start: 2043.524
  end: 2049.627
  speaker: barron
  en: What prevents us from saying that Jesus wasn’t simply a failed revolutionary, an inspiring idealist, but as Albert Schweitzer said, ground under by the wheel of history?
  zh: 是什么使我们不能说，耶稣只不过是个失败的革命者，或是一个能够激发人心的理想主义者，却如阿尔伯特·史怀哲所说，被历史的车轮碾过？
- start: 2052.969
  end: 2061.213
  speaker: barron
  en: What prevents us from saying that is the stubborn and unnerving fact of the resurrection.
  zh: 之所以我们不能那样说，是因为有一个顽强而令人不安的事实：复活。
- start: 2061.914
  end: 2075.397
  speaker: barron
  en: The New Testament scholar N.T. Wright says simply, From an historical standpoint, it’s practically impossible to explain the emergence of Christianity as a messianic movement apart from the resurrection.
  zh: 新约学者N. T. 赖特直言，从历史的角度来看，如果撇开复活，就几乎无法解释基督信仰如何以弥赛亚运动的形式兴起。
- start: 2076.198
  end: 2085.542
  speaker: barron
  en: If you wanted the clearest indication that someone was not the Messiah of Israel, it would be his death at the hands of Israel's enemy.
  zh: 若你想要一个最清楚的证据，证明某人并非以色列的弥赛亚，那就是他死于以色列仇敌之手。
- start: 2085.702
  end: 2091.605
  speaker: barron
  en: We’ve seen that the Messiah was supposed to gather the tribes, lead the nation, and defeat the enemies of Israel.
  zh: 我们知道，弥赛亚本该聚拢各支派、带领这个民族，并击败以色列的仇敌。
- start: 2091.605
  end: 2099.348
  speaker: barron
  en: Therefore, the clearest indication possible that someone was not the Messiah was that he was crucified by the Romans.
  zh: 因此，某人若被罗马人钉在十字架上，那就最能说明他不是真正的弥赛亚。
- start: 2100.419
  end: 2105.482
  speaker: barron
  en: In the year 132, Bar Kokhba led a revolution; many said he was the Messiah.
  zh: 公元132年时，巴尔·科赫巴领导了一场革命；许多人说他是弥赛亚。
- start: 2105.482
  end: 2109.264
  speaker: barron
  en: They minted coins saying Year One of Bar Kokhba.
  zh: 他们还铸造了硬币，上面写道「巴尔·科赫巴元年」。
- start: 2109.824
  end: 2115.988
  speaker: barron
  en: His revolution was put down, and he was put to death by the Romans, and nobody thinks he is the Messiah.
  zh: 他的革命被镇压，他也被罗马人处死，没有人再认为他是弥赛亚了。
- start: 2117.108
  end: 2122.051
  speaker: barron
  en: Yet these first Christians proclaim precisely that.
  zh: 然而，初代基督徒却恰恰宣告了这个真理。
- start: 2122.932
  end: 2131.288
  speaker: barron
  en: Paul says, Jesus Christos—Jesus Christ, simply his Greek version of Yeshua Mashiach, Jesus the Messiah.
  zh: 保罗宣告：「耶稣·基督（Jesus Christos）」，正是「耶稣·弥赛亚（Yeshua Mashiach）」的希腊说法，也就是「耶稣·弥赛亚」。
- start: 2131.509
  end: 2137.954
  speaker: barron
  en: The first disciples went to their deaths; they went to the ends of the world proclaiming that he is the Messiah of the Jews.
  zh: 这些最初的门徒为此牺牲生命，走遍天涯海角，宣扬他正是犹太人的弥赛亚。
- start: 2138.175
  end: 2144.82
  speaker: barron
  en: How can you explain that, apart from this fact of the resurrection of Jesus from the dead?
  zh: 如果撇开耶稣从死里复活的事实，又该如何解释这一切呢？
- start: 2147.663
  end: 2159.522
  speaker: barron
  en: Far too many contemporary scholars try to explain away the resurrection—oh, it’s a myth, it’s a legend, it’s a symbol, it’s a sign that Jesus’ cause goes on, that he’s a great man who now lives with God.
  zh: 许多当代学者想方设法要为复活找借口——「哦，那是个神话、一个传说、一个象征，或者只是在表明耶稣的事业还在继续，他是个伟人，现在和神同在。」
- start: 2161.283
  end: 2161.283
  speaker: barron
  en: Come on!
  zh: 得了吧！
- start: 2161.283
  end: 2164.804
  speaker: barron
  en: Nobody in the first century would have found any of that the least bit convincing.
  zh: 在第一世纪，没有人会觉得这些说法有丝毫说服力。
- start: 2164.804
  end: 2171.967
  speaker: barron
  en: Can you imagine Paul tearing into Corinth and saying, I want to proclaim a dead man who’s very inspiring?
  zh: 你能想象保罗冲进哥林多，说：「我想宣讲一位十分振奋人心的死人」吗？
- start: 2172.207
  end: 2173.768
  speaker: barron
  en: No one would have taken him seriously.
  zh: 没人会当回事。
- start: 2173.768
  end: 2180.79
  speaker: barron
  en: Instead, what Paul said in Corinth, over and over again, was anastasis, anastasis—resurrection, resurrection.
  zh: 相反，保罗在哥林多不断宣讲的，是「复活、复活」——希腊文anastasis。
- start: 2180.79
  end: 2184.251
  speaker: barron
  en: That was the first great Christian message.
  zh: 这就是最初伟大的基督信仰信息。
- start: 2186.087
  end: 2190.949
  speaker: barron
  en: The Gospels tell us that the risen Jesus appeared to the disciples in the upper room.
  zh: 福音书告诉我们，复活的耶稣向门徒显现在那楼房里。
- start: 2190.949
  end: 2204.675
  speaker: barron
  en: 'He did two things: first, he showed his wounds—don’t forget what the sin of the world did—but then he says, Shalom.'
  zh: 他做了两件事：首先让他们看他身上的伤痕——别忘了这世界的罪孽都加在他身上——然后他说：「愿你们平安。」
- start: 2204.675
  end: 2207.796
  speaker: barron
  en: Peace!
  zh: 「平安！」
- start: 2208.757
  end: 2211.878
  speaker: barron
  en: This is the peace that the world can't give.
  zh: 这是世人所不能给予的平安。
- start: 2212.208
  end: 2217.429
  speaker: barron
  en: God's love is more powerful than our greatest enemies, which are sin and death.
  zh: 神的爱比我们最强大的敌人——也就是罪和死亡——更为有力。
- start: 2218.09
  end: 2234.234
  speaker: barron
  en: This is precisely why Paul, once he had seen the risen Christ, could say, I am certain that neither death nor life, neither angels nor principalities, neither height nor depth, nor any other power can ever separate us from the love of God.
  zh: 正因如此，保罗在见到复活的基督后，才可以说：「我深信无论是死，是生，是天使，是执政的，是高处，是深处，是别的受造之物，都不能叫我们与神的爱隔绝。」
- start: 2234.234
  end: 2235.674
  speaker: barron
  en: How does Paul know that?
  zh: 保罗怎么知道这一点？
- start: 2235.674
  end: 2244.05
  speaker: barron
  en: Because we killed God, and God returned in forgiving love.
  zh: 因为我们把神杀了，而神却带着饶恕的爱再次归来。
- start: 2265.584
  end: 2278.629
  speaker: barron
  en: You're witnessing the installation of the Latin Patriarch, the one who’s the bishop of this church, which in some ways is the mother church of all of Christianity—Jerusalem—and they’re marching in in this military way into this church of nonviolence.
  zh: 你正在目睹拉丁礼宗主教就任的仪式，他是这座教会的主教，而从某种角度来说，这里是整个基督信仰的母教会——耶路撒冷。他们正以这种带点军队仪式的方式进入这座宣扬非暴力的教会。
- start: 2278.629
  end: 2283.01
  speaker: barron
  en: So, Jesus the warrior won in battle, but by fighting sin and death.
  zh: 因此，战士耶稣在战斗中得胜，却是以对抗罪与死的方式获胜。
- start: 2283.23
  end: 2294.234
  speaker: barron
  en: It’s kind of beautiful or appropriate that we accompany that with a military march, but it's not the customary manner; it’s this new way of fighting that was won right here on this spot.
  zh: 我们用军乐队来伴随这一场面，也算别具美感或恰如其分，但这并非传统的作法；这里展现的，是一条崭新的征战之道，而正是在这片地方取得胜利。
- start: 2294.234
  end: 2310.161
  speaker: barron
  en: I just love that image of Jesus the warrior because he’s a weird warrior—a very unusual warrior, not in the expected way.
  zh: 我很喜爱「战士耶稣」这个形象，因为他真是个奇特的战士——出人意表的战士，不符合我们惯常的期望。
- start: 2310.161
  end: 2311.122
  speaker: barron
  en: But he’s come to fight.
  zh: 然而，他确实是来作战的。
- start: 2311.122
  end: 2316.446
  speaker: barron
  en: He’s come to fight the power of evil, the power of violence, and the power of hatred.
  zh: 他要对抗那邪恶的势力、暴力的势力以及仇恨的势力。
- start: 2316.546
  end: 2319.849
  speaker: barron
  en: The great revelation is that he fights with the weapon of the cross.
  zh: 奥秘在于，他是以十字架作为武器来作战。
- start: 2322.311
  end: 2324.994
  speaker: barron
  en: He’s mano a mano with Pontius Pilate, going on.
  zh: 他和本丢·彼拉多「一对一」地在交锋。
- start: 2324.994
  end: 2330.618
  speaker: barron
  en: And we saw that from the very beginning; it’s Jesus and the Roman Emperor kind of going mano a mano.
  zh: 我们从一开始就看见了；也可以说是耶稣与罗马帝王之间的「一对一」较量。
- start: 2330.979
  end: 2336.059
  speaker: barron
  en: At the end, Pilate thinks he’s won, but in fact, it’s Pilate who’s been overwhelmed by the power of the cross.
  zh: 最后，彼拉多自以为得胜，但实际上，正是彼拉多被十字架的力量彻底压倒。
- start: 2336.119
  end: 2339.259
  speaker: barron
  en: And that’s proclaimed all over the world whenever the cross is held up.
  zh: 而这就是当十字架被高举时，向全世界宣告的真理。
- start: 2339.399
  end: 2340.36
  speaker: barron
  en: Because a cross?
  zh: 为什么是十字架？
- start: 2340.36
  end: 2341.78
  speaker: barron
  en: Why would you hold up a cross?
  zh: 你为何要高举十字架？
- start: 2341.96
  end: 2344.92
  speaker: barron
  en: If you’re in the first century and you’re holding up a cross, they think you’re out of your mind.
  zh: 如果你在第一世纪举起一座十字架，人们会觉得你疯了。
- start: 2344.92
  end: 2347.221
  speaker: barron
  en: They think you’re a lunatic.
  zh: 他们会认为你是个疯子。
- start: 2347.221
  end: 2351.342
  speaker: barron
  en: You’re holding up this brutal instrument of torture, but that’s just an irony.
  zh: 你所举的分明是一个残酷的刑具，但这正是一个带着强烈反讽意味的标志。
- start: 2351.342
  end: 2352.802
  speaker: barron
  en: It’s an in-your-face statement of love and victory over death.
  zh: 这是一个公然宣告的爱与对死亡的胜利。
- start: 2352.802
  end: 2354.162
  speaker: barron
  en: And it's a taunt.
  zh: 这其实是一种嘲弄。
- start: 2354.322
  end: 2356.163
  speaker: barron
  en: It's a taunt like, You think death scares us?
  zh: 就像是在嘲笑：「你以为死亡会吓到我们吗？」
- start: 2356.163
  end: 2357.483
  speaker: barron
  en: You think we're afraid of that?
  zh: 「你以为我们会惧怕它吗？」
- start: 2357.617
  end: 2360.038
  speaker: barron
  en: The whole world is afraid of that; that’s the most frightening thing you can imagine.
  zh: 整个世界都害怕死亡；那是人能想象到最可怕的东西。
- start: 2360.038
  end: 2363.2
  speaker: barron
  en: And we’re saying, I’m not afraid of it because God conquered it.
  zh: 而我们却在说：「我不怕它，因为神已经战胜了它。」
- start: 2405.0
  end: 2411.342
  speaker: barron
  en: In the light of the resurrection, the first Christians understood that there was a new king of the nations.
  zh: 在复活的光照下，初代基督徒意识到有一位新君王正统管万邦。
- start: 2411.862
  end: 2417.404
  speaker: barron
  en: They therefore saw their task as announcing this fact to all the world.
  zh: 因此，他们认为自己的使命就是向全世界宣告这一事实。
- start: 2423.307
  end: 2431.85
  speaker: barron
  en: If someone today had a message that he wanted to get out as widely as possible, he would head for New York, or Los Angeles, or London.
  zh: 假如今天有人想要让自己的讯息尽可能广传，他会前往纽约、洛杉矶或伦敦。
- start: 2434.691
  end: 2439.393
  speaker: barron
  en: The first believers in Jesus went with a similar hope to Rome.
  zh: 当初，信耶稣的第一批信徒也带着类似的盼望，前往罗马。
- start: 2456.532
  end: 2472.456
  speaker: barron
  en: In the Roman Forum stands the Arch of Titus, which was built to commemorate the destruction of Jerusalem by the Romans in 70 A.D. You can see on the inside of the arch a depiction of Roman soldiers carrying the menorah from the temple.
  zh: 在罗马广场上矗立着提图斯凯旋门，那是在公元七十年罗马摧毁耶路撒冷后，为纪念此事而建的。你可以在凯旋门内壁看见罗马士兵扛着圣殿里那灯台的浮雕。
- start: 2473.43
  end: 2481.995
  speaker: barron
  en: Those soldiers and those who made the arch probably thought, “That’s the end of the Jewish religion; that’s the end of the God of Israel.”
  zh: 那些士兵以及建造凯旋门的人也许以为：「犹太人的宗教就此终结；以色列的神也就告终了。」
- start: 2486.819
  end: 2503.409
  speaker: barron
  en: The supreme irony was that at that very moment, as people like Peter and Paul and their Christian companions came here to Rome, the God of Israel was coming in the person of Jesus to Rome, and through Rome, to all the world.
  zh: 最具讽刺意味的是，正在那时，像彼得、保罗以及他们的基督徒同伴来到罗马时，以色列的神却借着耶稣的身份来到罗马，并且通过罗马传向全世界。
- start: 2504.747
  end: 2516.816
  speaker: barron
  en: 'St. Paul, once he had seen the risen Christ, understood this immediately, and that’s why in all his letters we find this phrase: “Jesus Kyrios,” Jesus is the Lord.'
  zh: 圣保罗在看见复活的基督后，立刻明白了这一点，所以在他所有的书信里，我们都能找到这句话：「耶稣 Kyrios」——耶稣是主。
- start: 2516.857
  end: 2529.787
  speaker: barron
  en: Now, to us, that sounds like a rather bland spiritual statement, but in Jesus' time, those were fighting words because a watchword of the era was Kaiser Kyrios, Caesar is the Lord.
  zh: 对我们而言，这似乎只是一句平常的属灵表述，可在耶稣的时代，这却是挑衅的话，因为当时的口号是「Kaiser Kyrios」——「该撒是主」。
- start: 2529.787
  end: 2532.649
  speaker: barron
  en: Caesar is the one to whom final allegiance is due.
  zh: 该撒被视为值得最高效忠的那一位。
- start: 2532.901
  end: 2539.502
  speaker: barron
  en: 'The message Paul had to the world was: No, not Caesar, Jesus Kyrios, Jesus is the Lord.'
  zh: 但保罗向世界宣告的信息是：「不，不是该撒，而是耶稣 Kyrios——耶稣才是主。」
- start: 2542.603
  end: 2550.025
  speaker: barron
  en: On the slopes of the Capitoline Hill, St. Mark lived and Mark wrote around the year 70, the first Gospel.
  zh: 在卡比托利欧山的山坡上，圣马可曾住在此处，并在公元七十年前后写下了第一部福音书。
- start: 2550.785
  end: 2556.506
  speaker: barron
  en: It was written a few years after Mark's friends Peter and Paul had been brutally put to death.
  zh: 那成书于马可的朋友彼得、保罗被残酷处死后不久。
- start: 2556.966
  end: 2564.925
  speaker: barron
  en: 'Mark wrote this in the opening line of his Gospel: The good news about Jesus Christ, the Son of God.'
  zh: 马可在他福音书的开篇就写道：「耶稣基督，神的儿子的福音。」
- start: 2565.285
  end: 2569.927
  speaker: barron
  en: Again, it sounds spiritual enough to us, but those two were fighting words.
  zh: 再一次，对我们而言听起来颇具属灵意味，但在当时，那却是具挑战性的言语。
- start: 2570.548
  end: 2577.651
  speaker: barron
  en: Euangelion, that’s the Greek he used; glad tidings was a word used to describe an imperial victory.
  zh: 「Euangelion」是他用的希腊词，意为「佳音」，原是用来描述帝王胜利的消息。
- start: 2578.011
  end: 2584.094
  speaker: barron
  en: When Caesar won a great battle, he sent messengers ahead with the word euangelion—there's good news about this victory.
  zh: 当该撒大获全胜，他会派使者先行通报euangelion——也就是那个胜利的佳音。
- start: 2584.094
  end: 2586.735
  speaker: barron
  en: See what Mark is saying and how subversive it was?
  zh: 你看马可在说什么，以及那是多么颠覆的言论吗？
- start: 2587.196
  end: 2595.622
  speaker: barron
  en: The real good news has nothing to do with Caesar’s victories; it has to do with someone that Caesar put to death and that God raised from the dead.
  zh: 真正的佳音与该撒的胜利毫无关系；它所关乎的，是那位被该撒处死却被神从死里复活的人。
- start: 2595.622
  end: 2597.582
  speaker: barron
  en: It has to do with Jesus Christ.
  zh: 那正是耶稣基督。
- start: 2597.582
  end: 2603.544
  speaker: barron
  en: And then just to rub it in, he calls him the Son of God.
  zh: 更进一步，他还称耶稣为「神的儿子」。
- start: 2604.065
  end: 2608.406
  speaker: barron
  en: That was an imperial title; Caesar was the Son of God.
  zh: 那原本是帝王的称号；该撒被视为神的儿子。
- start: 2608.406
  end: 2611.447
  speaker: barron
  en: Mark is saying, Not Caesar, but rather Christ.
  zh: 马可在这里说：「不是该撒，而是基督。」
- start: 2611.607
  end: 2620.299
  speaker: barron
  en: Imagine now; he’s in the belly of the beast, he’s in the heart of the empire that killed his friends, and he says these subversive, revolutionary things.
  zh: 你想想看，他置身于猛兽的腹中，也就是杀害他朋友的帝国核心，却大胆说出这些颠覆性、革命性的话语。
- start: 2622.84
  end: 2626.902
  speaker: barron
  en: In April of 2005, Pope Benedict XVI was elected.
  zh: 2005年4月，教宗本笃十六世当选。
- start: 2627.243
  end: 2633.987
  speaker: barron
  en: He came out here on the front loggia of St. Peter's, and then gathering around him came all the cardinals who had just elected him.
  zh: 他走到圣伯多禄大教堂的正面阳台上，随后，那些刚刚选出他来的枢机们也都簇拥在他身旁。
- start: 2634.087
  end: 2639.91
  speaker: barron
  en: The cameras caught the remarkably pensive expression of Francis Cardinal George of Chicago.
  zh: 摄影机捕捉到了芝加哥的方济·乔治枢机沉思不语的神情。
- start: 2640.771
  end: 2659.036
  speaker: barron
  en: 'When Cardinal George got home, the reporters asked him, What were you thinking of as you were looking out from the loge of St. Peter''s? Here’s what he said: I was gazing over toward the Circus Maximus, toward the Palatine Hills where the Roman Emperors once reigned, where they looked down upon the persecution of Christians.'
  zh: 当乔治枢机回到家后，记者问他：「当你站在圣伯多禄教堂的阳台眺望时，你在想些什么呢？」他回答说：「我望向大竞技场的方向，看向帕拉蒂尼山，当年罗马皇帝曾在那儿掌权，他们曾俯瞰对基督徒的迫害。
- start: 2659.377
  end: 2662.418
  speaker: barron
  en: And I thought, where are their successors?
  zh: 然后我想：「他们的继任者如今何在？」
- start: 2662.839
  end: 2665.12
  speaker: barron
  en: Where is the successor of Julius Caesar?
  zh: 「尤里乌斯·凯撒的继任者在哪里？」
- start: 2665.14
  end: 2667.021
  speaker: barron
  en: Where is the successor of Marcus Aurelius?
  zh: 「马可·奥勒留的继任者在哪里？」
- start: 2667.021
  end: 2669.122
  speaker: barron
  en: And finally, who cares?
  zh: 「最后，谁又在意呢？」
- start: 2669.323
  end: 2671.744
  speaker: barron
  en: But if you want to see the successor of Peter...
  zh: 「可若你想看看圣彼得的继任者……」
- start: 2672.048
  end: 2676.329
  speaker: barron
  en: He’s standing right next to me, smiling and waving at the crowd.
  zh: 「他就站在我身旁，正微笑着，向人群挥手。」
- start: 2683.431
  end: 2686.091
  speaker: barron
  en: Jesus Christ is Lord!
  zh: 「耶稣基督是主！」
- start: 2686.311
  end: 2687.852
  speaker: barron
  en: That means Caesar isn't Lord.
  zh: 这就意味着该撒不再是主。
- start: 2687.852
  end: 2690.572
  speaker: barron
  en: That means none of Caesar's descendants are Lord.
  zh: 也意味着该撒的后裔都不再是主。
- start: 2690.572
  end: 2696.514
  speaker: barron
  en: Jesus Christ, risen from the dead, is the one to whom we owe final allegiance.
  zh: 从死里复活的耶稣基督，才是我们最终要效忠的那一位。
- start: 2699.958
  end: 2721.467
  speaker: barron
  en: 'And so, Jesus fulfilled the four tasks of the Messiah: he gathered the tribes, he cleansed the temple, he dealt with the enemies of Israel, and now he is reigning as Lord of the nations.'
  zh: 因此，耶稣完成了弥赛亚的四大使命：他聚拢了支派，洁净了圣殿，解决了以色列的敌人，如今他正以万国之主的身份掌权。
- start: 2739.083
  end: 2741.145
  speaker: barron
  en: Yeah, I always move when I come in here to the Coliseum.
  zh: 是啊，每当我走进这座角斗场时，我总会心生感慨。
- start: 2741.145
  end: 2743.987
  speaker: barron
  en: I always think, We won.
  zh: 我总在想：「我们赢了。」
- start: 2744.567
  end: 2753.554
  speaker: barron
  en: This was a place where Christians—though not the earliest Christians, since this didn’t exist until the second century—were tortured to death in later persecutions.
  zh: 这地方曾是基督徒被折磨至死的所在——虽然并非最早的基督徒，因为这角斗场要到二世纪才建成——但在后期的逼迫中，许多信徒在此受难。
- start: 2753.554
  end: 2758.978
  speaker: barron
  en: I mean, the spiritual is always more powerful than what’s in the world.
  zh: 我的意思是，属灵的力量总是比世俗的力量更强大。
- start: 2758.978
  end: 2763.121
  speaker: barron
  en: It doesn’t seem that way; it always looks like, Oh, we can handle that.
  zh: 表面看来似乎并非如此，看起来总像：「哦，我们能应付那一切。」
- start: 2763.266
  end: 2769.672
  speaker: barron
  en: Like Pius XII, you know, said something critical of Stalin, and Stalin said, Pius XII? How many divisions does he have?
  zh: 就像庇护十二世曾批评过斯大林，斯大林便说：「庇护十二世？他手里有多少师团呢？」
- start: 2769.672
  end: 2777.86
  speaker: barron
  en: Well, of course, the great irony is that the successor of Pius XII defeated the successor of Stalin and without a single division, but with the power of the Spirit.
  zh: 但具有讽刺意味的是，庇护十二世的继任者击败了斯大林的继任者，而且一兵一卒也没用，却依靠着圣灵的力量。
- start: 2777.861
  end: 2780.243
  speaker: barron
  en: And that’s what this place, to me, sort of speaks.
  zh: 在我看来，这正是此处所彰显的意义。
- start: 2783.727
  end: 2790.259
  speaker: barron
  en: Every Good Friday, the Pope comes in here carrying the cross because the cross was the symbol of Roman power.
  zh: 每逢圣周五，教宗都会带着十字架来到这里，因为十字架曾是罗马权力的象征。
- start: 2790.259
  end: 2794.259
  speaker: barron
  en: It meant, If you cross us, pun intended, that’s where we’ll put you.
  zh: 它的含义是：「如果你冒犯了我们（双关地说），我们就会把你钉在那里。」
- start: 2794.259
  end: 2798.84
  speaker: barron
  en: That’s how you know secular power tends to maintain itself through threats of violence.
  zh: 这就是我们所见的，世俗政权往往靠暴力威胁来维持自身。
- start: 2798.84
  end: 2809.843
  speaker: barron
  en: But then we use the symbol of the cross to taunt Rome and all of Rome’s successors because from that cross came forth the victory of God, which is a victory of nonviolence and compassion and love.
  zh: 然而，我们如今却借着十字架这个标示，来嘲弄罗马及其后继者，因为正是从那十字架上展现出了神的胜利，那是非暴力、怜悯与爱的胜利。
- start: 2810.343
  end: 2815.084
  speaker: barron
  en: And that’s more powerful than anything in the world because that’s the power by which the world was created.
  zh: 这比世界上任何东西都更有力，因为正是这力量创造了世界。
- start: 2815.154
  end: 2817.515
  speaker: barron
  en: God made the world not in violence but in love.
  zh: 神创造世界时，不靠暴力，而是出于爱。
- start: 2817.556
  end: 2824.08
  speaker: barron
  en: And so love is always more enduring and powerful than hatred, even though it seems otherwise.
  zh: 因此，爱总比恨更持久、更强大，尽管表面看来可能并不如此。
- start: 2824.08
  end: 2825.441
  speaker: barron
  en: 'That’s the great lesson of the Church: the Lord of Light, who art thyself, thou didst be, thou canst be our God.'
  zh: 这就是教会给我们的重大启示：「光之主，你本就是，你曾存在，也能成为我们的神。」
- start: 2825.441
  end: 2825.441
  speaker: barron
  en: It seems you've entered a placeholder or a special character.
  zh: 看来你输入了一个占位符或某个特殊字符。
- start: 2825.441
  end: 2825.441
  speaker: barron
  en: If you have any specific questions or need further content, feel free to let me know!
  zh: 如果你有什么具体问题或需要更多内容，尽管告诉我！
- start: 2825.441
  end: 2825.741
  speaker: barron
  en: I'm here to help.
  zh: 我随时准备提供帮助。
