- start: 2.233
  end: 8.603
  speaker: unknown
  en: Okay, so we are moving on now, and today we're going to talk about the Cappadocians.
  zh: 好，现在我们继续前进，今天我们要谈论的是卡帕多细亚教父。
- start: 9.935
  end: 24.501
  speaker: unknown
  en: We have already covered the Council of Nicaea and then we went kind of ahead of ourselves to talk about the Council of Constantinople so that we could finish our conversation on the Creed, just so that we could do the Creed all at once.
  zh: 我们已经讨论了尼西亚会议，然后我们提前谈到了君士坦丁堡会议，以便完成我们对信经的讨论，这样我们就可以一次性完成信经的讨论。
- start: 24.501
  end: 31.843
  speaker: unknown
  en: But in reality we have to back up a little bit and talk about some of the things that took place between those first two ecumenical councils.
  zh: 但实际上，我们需要稍微倒退一下，谈谈在这两个大公会议之间发生的一些事情。
- start: 31.843
  end: 33.664
  speaker: unknown
  en: So we're still in the fourth century.
  zh: 所以我们仍然在四世纪。
- start: 33.924
  end: 39.872
  speaker: unknown
  en: And we are going to talk about the Cappadocians, or as some people pronounce it, the Cappadocians.
  zh: 我们要谈论的是卡帕多细亚教父，或者有些人发音为卡帕多细亚教父。
- start: 39.872
  end: 43.175
  speaker: unknown
  en: And actually that's probably more right, but I don't care.
  zh: 实际上那可能更正确，但我不在乎。
- start: 44.317
  end: 49.443
  speaker: unknown
  en: The Cappadocians, or alternately the Cappadocian Fathers.
  zh: 卡帕多细亚教父，或者称为卡帕多细亚教父。
- start: 50.01
  end: 62.854
  speaker: unknown
  en: Now, we're talking about a place, Cappadocia is a Roman province in Asia Minor, and so by calling them the Cappadocians, we're saying this is where they're from.
  zh: 现在，我们谈论的是一个地方，卡帕多细亚是小亚细亚的一个罗马省，所以称他们为卡帕多细亚教父，是说他们来自这里。
- start: 62.854
  end: 73.411
  speaker: unknown
  en: And specifically, we're talking about three theologians, Basil,  Caesarea.
  zh: 具体来说，我们谈论的是三位神学家，巴西尔，凯撒利亚。
- start: 74.132
  end: 77.474
  speaker: unknown
  en: Now, by the way, this is Caesarea in Cappadocia.
  zh: 顺便说一下，这是卡帕多细亚的凯撒利亚。
- start: 77.474
  end: 86.098
  speaker: unknown
  en: This is not the same as the Caesarea on the coast of Palestine that we saw, like with, for example, Eusebius and Caesarea.
  zh: 这与我们看到的巴勒斯坦海岸的凯撒利亚不同，例如优西比乌和凯撒利亚。
- start: 86.098
  end: 87.499
  speaker: unknown
  en: It's a different city.
  zh: 这是一个不同的城市。
- start: 87.499
  end: 92.582
  speaker: unknown
  en: And unfortunately, you know, this one also named after Caesar, so it can be a little confusing.
  zh: 不幸的是，这个城市也以凯撒命名，所以可能有点混淆。
- start: 92.582
  end: 94.883
  speaker: unknown
  en: But at any rate, we're talking about Basil.
  zh: 但无论如何，我们谈论的是巴西尔。
- start: 94.883
  end: 97.544
  speaker: unknown
  en: We're talking about Basil's brother, Gregory.
  zh: 我们谈论的是巴西尔的兄弟，格雷戈里。
- start: 100.701
  end: 113.395
  speaker: unknown
  en: Gregory of Missa and their friend, also named Gregory, Gregory of Nazianzus.
  zh: 米萨的格雷戈里和他们的朋友，也叫格雷戈里，纳齐安祖的格雷戈里。
- start: 116.658
  end: 125.922
  speaker: unknown
  en: Okay, so these three theologians are the ones that we refer to as the Cappadocians or the Cappadocian Fathers.
  zh: 好的，这三位神学家就是我们所称的卡帕多细亚教父。
- start: 127.724
  end: 135.307
  speaker: unknown
  en: They become extremely important in that time period between the Council of Nicaea and the Council of Constantinople.
  zh: 他们在尼西亚会议和君士坦丁堡会议之间的那段时间变得极为重要。
- start: 136.224
  end: 155.611
  speaker: unknown
  en: By the way, Cappadocian Caesarea is the capital of the region of Cappadocia, and if you think of it on the route from Constantinople to Antioch, it becomes an important city because it's on that route.
  zh: 顺便说一下，卡帕多细亚的凯撒利亚是卡帕多细亚地区的首府，如果你想到从君士坦丁堡到安提阿的路线，它成为一个重要的城市，因为它在那条路线上。
- start: 155.611
  end: 163.134
  speaker: unknown
  en: Now all three of these theologians come from wealthy families, which means they have access to the best education.
  zh: 这三位神学家都来自富裕家庭，这意味着他们可以接受最好的教育。
- start: 163.766
  end: 167.329
  speaker: unknown
  en: It also means they are open to philosophy.
  zh: 这也意味着他们对哲学持开放态度。
- start: 167.57
  end: 172.936
  speaker: unknown
  en: Now, in the West, we've seen people like Irenaeus and Tertullian.
  zh: 在西方，我们见过像爱任纽和特土良这样的人。
- start: 172.936
  end: 176.72
  speaker: unknown
  en: Tertullian famously said, you know, what does Athens have to do with Jerusalem?
  zh: 特土良著名地说，雅典与耶路撒冷有什么关系？
- start: 176.72
  end: 179.483
  speaker: unknown
  en: Meaning, what does philosophy have to do with theology?
  zh: 意思是，哲学与神学有什么关系？
- start: 179.483
  end: 181.184
  speaker: unknown
  en: And making that distinction.
  zh: 并做出这种区分。
- start: 181.565
  end: 195.693
  speaker: unknown
  en: But the older tradition, going all the way back to the Apologists,  It was to see philosophy as at least potentially a positive thing and maybe not make so much of a distinction between philosophy and theology.
  zh: 但较早的传统，可以追溯到护教士，认为哲学至少可能是一件积极的事情，或许不需要在哲学和神学之间做太多区分。
- start: 195.693
  end: 197.134
  speaker: unknown
  en: Now we're kind of back to that.
  zh: 现在我们有点回到了那种状态。
- start: 197.134
  end: 200.475
  speaker: unknown
  en: Or in some ways maybe the Eastern Church never really lost it.
  zh: 或者在某些方面，东方教会可能从未真正失去它。
- start: 203.628
  end: 228.843
  speaker: unknown
  en: These theologians are educated in Greco-Roman thought, philosophy, and also interestingly enough,  Because they were from wealthy families and because they were meant to be given a good education, the best education possible, they postponed their baptisms until adulthood.
  zh: 这些神学家受过希腊罗马思想和哲学的教育，而且有趣的是，因为他们来自富裕家庭，并且他们应该接受良好的教育，最好的教育，他们推迟到成年才受洗。
- start: 229.164
  end: 237.388
  speaker: unknown
  en: And this is a decision that their parents would have made to sort of leave their options open for secular careers.
  zh: 这是他们的父母做出的决定，以便为世俗职业留有选择的余地。
- start: 238.408
  end: 244.631
  speaker: unknown
  en: In the end, they all chose monastic or church careers and so they all chose to get baptized.
  zh: 最终，他们都选择了修道或教会的职业，因此他们都选择了受洗。
- start: 245.922
  end: 252.227
  speaker: unknown
  en: They knew Athanasius, who died in 373. Athanasius had a long career.
  zh: 他们认识亚他拿修，亚他拿修于373年去世。亚他拿修有着漫长的职业生涯。
- start: 252.227
  end: 264.816
  speaker: unknown
  en: He died in 373, and so these guys sort of pick up from Athanasius as the defenders of Nicene orthodoxy.
  zh: 他于373年去世，因此这些人继承了亚他拿修的衣钵，成为尼西亚正统的捍卫者。
- start: 265.016
  end: 268.599
  speaker: unknown
  en: And so they're heavily influenced by Athanasius.
  zh: 因此，他们深受亚他拿修的影响。
- start: 269.478
  end: 273.744
  speaker: unknown
  en: They're all aesthetics, and they all supported monasticism.
  zh: 他们都是禁欲主义者，并且都支持修道主义。
- start: 273.744
  end: 278.029
  speaker: unknown
  en: And we're going to talk a little bit about monasticism in the next hour.
  zh: 我们将在接下来的一个小时里谈论一些关于修道主义的内容。
- start: 278.049
  end: 287.872
  speaker: unknown
  en: But just to point out that the monastic tradition often has a lot to do with  Well, you know, being alone, right?
  zh: 但要指出的是，修道传统往往与独处有很大关系，对吧？
- start: 287.992
  end: 292.633
  speaker: unknown
  en: You're a hermit, you live out in the desert by yourself, so being alone means there's really nobody to talk to.
  zh: 你是一个隐士，独自生活在沙漠中，所以独处意味着真的没有人可以交谈。
- start: 292.633
  end: 296.434
  speaker: unknown
  en: So it has a lot to do with finding God in the silence.
  zh: 所以这与在寂静中寻找神有很大关系。
- start: 296.694
  end: 300.715
  speaker: unknown
  en: You know, in academic worlds, we try to find God in all the words.
  zh: 在学术界，我们试图在所有的言语中找到神。
- start: 301.736
  end: 324.266
  speaker: unknown
  en: But they understood about finding God in the silence, which meant that they are proponents of what we call the apophatic  Or the via negativa, the negative way, the way of negation.
  zh: 但他们理解在寂静中寻找神，这意味着他们是我们所称的否定神学或否定之道的支持者。
- start: 324.266
  end: 335.248
  speaker: unknown
  en: In other words, sometimes the best you can say about what God is, is really just to say what God is not.
  zh: 换句话说，有时你能说的关于神的最好话语，其实只是说神不是。
- start: 335.968
  end: 343.89
  speaker: unknown
  en: Sometimes all we know about God is to admit that God is mystery, to admit our humility before the unknowable.
  zh: 有时我们对神所知道的一切就是承认神是奥秘，承认我们在不可知的面前的谦卑。
- start: 346.105
  end: 349.368
  speaker: unknown
  en: As monastics, they really just wanted a life of study.
  zh: 作为修道士，他们真正想要的是一种学习的生活。
- start: 365.646
  end: 376.695
  speaker: unknown
  en: to live a life that wealth can afford, a life of privilege, a life of contemplative study.
  zh: 过一种财富可以负担的生活，一种特权的生活，一种沉思学习的生活。
- start: 376.716
  end: 381.219
  speaker: unknown
  en: But in one way or another, they are all pressed into service as clergy.
  zh: 但无论如何，他们都被迫成为神职人员。
- start: 382.841
  end: 391.929
  speaker: unknown
  en: Now, one of the greatest contributions that they make to the church is in clarifying the theological language.
  zh: 现在，他们对教会最大的贡献之一是澄清神学语言。
- start: 393.141
  end: 394.382
  speaker: unknown
  en: The Council of Nicaea.
  zh: 尼西亚会议。
- start: 394.382
  end: 403.809
  speaker: unknown
  en: You remember that when we were talking about the Council of Nicaea, we ran into a word, this word homoousios, right?
  zh: 你记得当我们谈论尼西亚会议时，我们遇到了一个词，这个词是homoousios，对吧？
- start: 403.809
  end: 408.592
  speaker: unknown
  en: Homoousios, same essence.
  zh: Homoousios，同一实质。
- start: 408.633
  end: 415.978
  speaker: unknown
  en: And this essence language was exactly the thing that some of the bishops were not comfortable with.
  zh: 而这种实质的语言正是一些主教不舒服的地方。
- start: 416.199
  end: 420.942
  speaker: unknown
  en: This question of the father and son being of the same essence.
  zh: 关于圣父和圣子同一实质的问题。
- start: 421.833
  end: 425.075
  speaker: unknown
  en: Sounded like modalism to some people.
  zh: 对一些人来说，这听起来像是形态论。
- start: 425.075
  end: 426.937
  speaker: unknown
  en: Sounded like too much unity.
  zh: 听起来像是过于统一。
- start: 426.937
  end: 432.28
  speaker: unknown
  en: Sounded like confusing the father with the son, like as if you're saying they're one and the same.
  zh: 听起来像是把圣父和圣子混为一谈，好像你在说他们是同一个。
- start: 432.781
  end: 436.983
  speaker: unknown
  en: And so a lot of people were uncomfortable with this Lucia language.
  zh: 因此，许多人对这种实质的语言感到不舒服。
- start: 437.804
  end: 453.831
  speaker: unknown
  en: And in fact, in the Creed of Nicaea, the original one with the anathemas, the language used in that was not very precise, because you have this Lucia language  For essence.
  zh: 事实上，在尼西亚信经中，原始的带有诅咒的信经中使用的语言并不十分精确，因为你有这种实质的语言。
- start: 453.831
  end: 458.093
  speaker: unknown
  en: But you also have this word, hupostasis.
  zh: 但你也有这个词，hupostasis。
- start: 460.375
  end: 461.316
  speaker: unknown
  en: Hupostasis.
  zh: Hupostasis。
- start: 461.316
  end: 464.018
  speaker: unknown
  en: Hupo as in under, like a hypodermic needle.
  zh: Hupo，意思是“在……之下”，就像皮下注射针一样。
- start: 464.018
  end: 466.459
  speaker: unknown
  en: Hypodermis goes under the skin, right?
  zh: 皮下组织在皮肤下，对吧？
- start: 466.459
  end: 467.26
  speaker: unknown
  en: Under.
  zh: 在……之下。
- start: 467.54
  end: 471.262
  speaker: unknown
  en: And stasis is a state of being.
  zh: 而stasis是存在的状态。
- start: 471.343
  end: 474.465
  speaker: unknown
  en: So, hupostasis is that which stands under.
  zh: 所以，hupostasis是指在……之下的东西。
- start: 474.465
  end: 476.086
  speaker: unknown
  en: It doesn't mean understanding.
  zh: 它不是指理解。
- start: 476.086
  end: 480.809
  speaker: unknown
  en: It means that which stands under, like as an underlying reality.
  zh: 它是指在……之下的东西，就像一种潜在的现实。
- start: 481.584
  end: 488.008
  speaker: unknown
  en: So, you know, in some sense, the Council of Nicaea was using these words interchangeably.
  zh: 所以，从某种意义上说，尼西亚会议是交替使用这些词的。
- start: 489.01
  end: 502.66
  speaker: unknown
  en: The problem is, is that some people in the East were using this word to talk about the oneness of God and they were using this word to talk about the threeness of God.
  zh: 问题是，东方的一些人用这个词来谈论神的独一性，也用这个词来谈论神的三位一体。
- start: 502.66
  end: 507.063
  speaker: unknown
  en: So the Trinity was one Hosea and three Hupostases.
  zh: 所以三位一体是一个本质和三个位格。
- start: 508.12
  end: 517.029
  speaker: unknown
  en: Some people, though, were using this word to talk about the oneness of God, and saying God is one, hupostasis.
  zh: 然而，有些人用这个词来谈论神的独一性，说神是一个，hupostasis。
- start: 517.71
  end: 542.122
  speaker: unknown
  en: Well, all that is to say that these words, this semantic issue, had to be nailed down, and the Cappadocians were instrumental in clarifying  Before the Council of Constantinople in 381, clarifying that the standard Greek terminology in the church was going to be one usia, three hypostases.
  zh: 总之，这些词语，这个语义问题，必须明确下来，卡帕多细亚教父在381年的君士坦丁堡会议之前澄清了教会的标准希腊术语将是一个本质，三个位格。
- start: 542.122
  end: 547.728
  speaker: unknown
  en: So, this is the equivalent of Tertullian's one substance, three persons.
  zh: 所以，这相当于特土良的一个本质，三个位格。
- start: 549.139
  end: 551.52
  speaker: unknown
  en: But it took a long time actually for that to catch on.
  zh: 但实际上，这花了很长时间才被接受。
- start: 551.52
  end: 564.605
  speaker: unknown
  en: In fact, even by the time of Augustine, we haven't talked about Augustine yet, but if you read some of Augustine's works, he will say that when it comes time to translate between Greek and Latin, we're not sure what words mean what, right?
  zh: 事实上，即使到了奥古斯丁的时代，我们还没有谈到奥古斯丁，但如果你读一些奥古斯丁的作品，他会说，当涉及希腊语和拉丁语之间的翻译时，我们不确定哪些词是什么意思，对吧？
- start: 564.605
  end: 569.807
  speaker: unknown
  en: People are using the same words to mean different things, and people are using different words to mean the same things.
  zh: 人们用相同的词来表示不同的意思，用不同的词来表示相同的意思。
- start: 569.807
  end: 579.231
  speaker: unknown
  en: And so in the debates that we're going to talk about, actually over the next couple of weeks,  This semantic issue plays a big part.
  zh: 所以在我们接下来几周要讨论的辩论中，这个语义问题起了很大的作用。
- start: 579.752
  end: 587.097
  speaker: unknown
  en: And unfortunately, there's going to be a lot of problems because people are talking past each other and they're not agreeing on the definitions of words.
  zh: 不幸的是，会有很多问题，因为人们在交谈时彼此不理解，他们对词语的定义不一致。
- start: 588.278
  end: 600.107
  speaker: unknown
  en: But anyway, as it's going to play out, usia or essence, essence becomes the word that is equivalent with Tertullian substance.
  zh: 但无论如何，随着事情的发展，本质或实质成为与特土良的本质相同的词。
- start: 600.848
  end: 603.29
  speaker: unknown
  en: So there's one essence in the Trinity.
  zh: 所以三位一体中有一个本质。
- start: 604.584
  end: 613.551
  speaker: unknown
  en: And then hupostasis is going to be the word that becomes the equivalent of Tertullian's persona or person.
  zh: 然后hupostasis将成为与特土良的位格或人相同的词。
- start: 616.654
  end: 620.137
  speaker: unknown
  en: So this is the same as three persons.
  zh: 所以这与三个位格相同。
- start: 621.378
  end: 624.719
  speaker: unknown
  en: I don't know if you can even see that down there, sorry about that, but you get the idea.
  zh: 我不知道你是否能看到下面的内容，对不起，但你明白了。
- start: 624.799
  end: 633.242
  speaker: unknown
  en: One essence, three gluco-staces, and that's the language that the Cappadocians will begin to clarify and solidify for the church.
  zh: 一个本质，三个位格，这是卡帕多细亚教父将开始为教会澄清和巩固的语言。
- start: 633.242
  end: 648.623
  speaker: unknown
  en: And what that does for the church is,  It allows a lot of people who were uncomfortable with the Creed of Nicaea to start to get on board with it and to start to accept Nicene theology as acceptable.
  zh: 这对教会的作用是，它使许多对尼西亚信经感到不舒服的人开始接受它，并开始接受尼西亚神学。
- start: 648.804
  end: 665.393
  speaker: unknown
  en: And so that in the time period between the Council of Nicaea and the Council of Constantinople in 381, Nicene Orthodoxy sort of comes around to be accepted by most of the bishops in the East.
  zh: 因此，在尼西亚会议和381年的君士坦丁堡会议之间的那段时间，尼西亚正统逐渐被东方的大多数主教接受。
- start: 666.937
  end: 672.321
  speaker: unknown
  en: Some even who had supported Arius would be able to get on board with it and accept it.
  zh: 甚至一些支持亚略的人也能够接受它并接受它。
- start: 674.723
  end: 697.679
  speaker: unknown
  en: Now, at the same time though, there were those bishops who had opposed the idea of homoousios, who had opposed the idea of essence language, who started to come on board and say, okay, we'll give you that the Father and Son are of the same essence,  But not the Holy Spirit.
  zh: 然而，同时，也有一些主教反对同质的概念，反对本质语言的概念，他们开始接受并说，好吧，我们承认圣父和圣子是同一实质，但不是圣灵。
- start: 698.159
  end: 701.561
  speaker: unknown
  en: You know, they'll say, we'll give you the divinity of the Son.
  zh: 他们会说，我们承认圣子的神性。
- start: 701.561
  end: 702.782
  speaker: unknown
  en: We'll accept that.
  zh: 我们接受这一点。
- start: 702.962
  end: 703.922
  speaker: unknown
  en: But not the Spirit.
  zh: 但不是圣灵。
- start: 703.922
  end: 705.343
  speaker: unknown
  en: The Spirit's not divine.
  zh: 圣灵不是神。
- start: 705.343
  end: 713.628
  speaker: unknown
  en: And so there was a group that emerges after the Council of Nicaea that wants to deny the divinity of the Holy Spirit.
  zh: 因此，在尼西亚会议之后出现了一群人，他们想否认圣灵的神性。
- start: 713.628
  end: 723.708
  speaker: unknown
  en: And in fact, pretty much all of the debate that centered around the Son at Nicaea  is now projected on the Spirit.
  zh: 事实上，几乎所有在尼西亚围绕圣子的辩论现在都投射到了圣灵上。
- start: 723.708
  end: 727.971
  speaker: unknown
  en: And the same sorts of questions are being asked about the Holy Spirit.
  zh: 同样的问题也被问到圣灵身上。
- start: 727.971
  end: 736.257
  speaker: unknown
  en: Is the Holy Spirit created, like an angelic spirit, or is the Holy Spirit creator, divine?
  zh: 圣灵是被造的，像天使的灵，还是圣灵是创造者，神圣的？
- start: 736.998
  end: 741.38
  speaker: unknown
  en: Is the Holy Spirit co-eternal with the Father and the Son?
  zh: 圣灵是否与圣父和圣子同为永恒？
- start: 743.966
  end: 753.288
  speaker: unknown
  en: The people who are asking those questions, and the people who are denying the divinity of the Holy Spirit, are given a name.
  zh: 那些提出这些问题并否认圣灵神性的人被赋予了一个名字。
- start: 753.288
  end: 760.429
  speaker: unknown
  en: Pneumatomachians.
  zh: 灵斗者。
- start: 761.309
  end: 763.429
  speaker: unknown
  en: Yeah, I'm sorry, I don't make these things up.
  zh: 是的，对不起，我没有编造这些东西。
- start: 763.449
  end: 766.01
  speaker: unknown
  en: But it means spirit fighters.
  zh: 但它的意思是灵斗者。
- start: 766.01
  end: 767.87
  speaker: unknown
  en: Pneuma, spirit.
  zh: Pneuma，灵。
- start: 767.87
  end: 772.871
  speaker: unknown
  en: Spirit fighters in the sense that these are the ones who supposedly fight against the Spirit.
  zh: 灵斗者的意思是这些人据说是与圣灵作斗争的人。
- start: 773.519
  end: 780.88
  speaker: unknown
  en: So they're labeled people who fight against the Holy Spirit because they deny the divinity of the Spirit.
  zh: 所以他们被贴上与圣灵作斗争的人的标签，因为他们否认圣灵的神性。
- start: 780.88
  end: 789.042
  speaker: unknown
  en: They're also referred to as Macedonians after one of their leaders.
  zh: 他们也被称为马其顿派，以他们的一个领袖命名。
- start: 789.482
  end: 798.564
  speaker: unknown
  en: So they become a faction of sorts or group of factions after the Council of Nicaea and in that period between Nicaea and Constantinople.
  zh: 所以他们在尼西亚会议之后以及尼西亚和君士坦丁堡之间的那段时间成为了一种派别或派别群体。
- start: 800.391
  end: 812.286
  speaker: unknown
  en: Alright, so what I'm going to do now is I'm going to talk about the three Cappadocians, kind of in order, and tell you what their contribution is, and we'll see where that takes us.
  zh: 好的，现在我要做的是按顺序谈谈这三位卡帕多细亚教父，告诉你他们的贡献是什么，我们看看这会带我们到哪里。
- start: 812.286
  end: 819.094
  speaker: unknown
  en: The one thing I want to say at the beginning is you are going to read a document called The Life of Macrina.
  zh: 我想在一开始说的是，你将阅读一份名为《马克里娜的生平》的文件。
- start: 819.78
  end: 829.467
  speaker: unknown
  en: Macrina is the older sister of Basil and Gregory, and she is really their first teacher of theology.
  zh: 马克里娜是巴西尔和格雷戈里的姐姐，她实际上是他们的第一位神学老师。
- start: 831.824
  end: 839.788
  speaker: unknown
  en: There is a strong tradition of the women in this family learning theology from important theologians in the East.
  zh: 这个家族的女性从东方的重要神学家那里学习神学有着悠久的传统。
- start: 839.788
  end: 849.812
  speaker: unknown
  en: And so Macrina becomes the first teacher of Babylon Gregory, and she is the one who encourages them into the monastic life.
  zh: 因此，马克里娜成为巴比伦格雷戈里的第一位老师，她是鼓励他们进入修道生活的人。
- start: 849.812
  end: 855.575
  speaker: unknown
  en: Which, when you read the life of Macrina, the monastic life is called the life of philosophy.
  zh: 当你阅读《马克里娜的生平》时，修道生活被称为哲学生活。
- start: 855.695
  end: 863.441
  speaker: unknown
  en: So the word philosophy comes to be kind of a code for the monastic life, so watch for that.
  zh: 所以哲学这个词成为修道生活的一种代号，所以要注意这一点。
- start: 863.741
  end: 866.403
  speaker: unknown
  en: Alright, so let's talk about Basil of Caesarea.
  zh: 好的，现在我们来谈谈凯撒利亚的巴西尔。
- start: 866.883
  end: 892.094
  speaker: unknown
  en: Basil is born somewhere around 329 or 330, and he died in 379. And so you'll notice right there that he did not quite make it to the Council of Constantinople in 381.  He is one of four so-called Eastern Doctors of the Church.
  zh: 巴西尔大约出生于329年或330年，他于379年去世。所以你会注意到，他没有赶上381年的君士坦丁堡会议。他是所谓的四位东方教会圣师之一。
- start: 892.094
  end: 896.999
  speaker: unknown
  en: The Doctors of the Church are theologians who are designated as especially important.
  zh: 教会圣师是被指定为特别重要的神学家。
- start: 897.019
  end: 899.382
  speaker: unknown
  en: He is also known as Basil the Great.
  zh: 他也被称为大巴西尔。
- start: 907.228
  end: 917.297
  speaker: unknown
  en: Even though it was Macrina who convinces Basil to go into the monastic life, because she went there first.
  zh: 尽管是马克里娜说服巴西尔进入修道生活，因为她先去了那里。
- start: 918.479
  end: 922.723
  speaker: unknown
  en: In fact, Macrina convinced all of her brothers to become ascetics.
  zh: 事实上，马克里娜说服了她所有的兄弟成为禁欲主义者。
- start: 922.723
  end: 934.517
  speaker: unknown
  en: When they had all sort of trained for these careers as basically the ancient world's equivalent of a lawyer, she's the one who convinced them to  To become ascetics.
  zh: 当他们都接受了这些职业的训练，基本上相当于古代世界的律师时，她是说服他们成为禁欲主义者的人。
- start: 934.697
  end: 959.554
  speaker: unknown
  en: And she seems to have been the real pioneer in the family, creating a family monastery on their estate where they took in homeless people, homeless women, and created this monastery with their mother and really sort of took Paul's words in Galatians to heart, this idea that there's no longer slave or free.
  zh: 她似乎是家族中的真正先驱，在他们的庄园上创建了一个家庭修道院，收留无家可归的人，无家可归的妇女，并与他们的母亲一起创建了这个修道院，真正将保罗在加拉太书中的话铭记于心，即不再有奴隶或自由人。
- start: 959.554
  end: 974.519
  speaker: unknown
  en: And so basically,  The people that were, up until that point, servants in that household became monastics alongside of the mistress of the house and the sisters.
  zh: 基本上，直到那时为止，那些家庭中的仆人和女主人及姐妹们一起成为了修道士。
- start: 975.44
  end: 978.543
  speaker: unknown
  en: So Macrina is the one who really pioneers all this.
  zh: 所以，马克里娜是真正开创这一切的人。
- start: 978.543
  end: 987.31
  speaker: unknown
  en: But then Basil will come along and he will write a rule, a rule of life, that will influence all of monasticism after him.
  zh: 但随后巴西尔出现了，他写了一条规则，一条生活规则，这将影响他之后的所有修道主义。
- start: 988.812
  end: 998.062
  speaker: unknown
  en: After his studies, he traveled around to Egypt, Palestine, and Syria to meet the desert hermits in person.
  zh: 在学习之后，他游历了埃及、巴勒斯坦和叙利亚，亲自会见了沙漠隐士。
- start: 998.062
  end: 1003.427
  speaker: unknown
  en: By their example and Macrina's persistence, he eventually accepted the monastic life.
  zh: 通过他们的榜样和马克里娜的坚持，他最终接受了修道生活。
- start: 1005.829
  end: 1018.802
  speaker: unknown
  en: Eventually, because of him, in a large part because of him, the Eastern Church will come to the point where it's pretty much assumed that the bishops ought to be monks.
  zh: 最终，很大程度上因为他，东方教会将达到一个几乎默认主教应该是修道士的地步。
- start: 1019.083
  end: 1038.308
  speaker: unknown
  en: Now you already know that one of the differences between the Eastern and the Western Church is that in the Western Church,  The celibacy of the priesthood develops relatively early and eventually kind of sticks, more or less, to the point where now Western Roman Catholic priests are celibate, right?
  zh: 你已经知道东方教会和西方教会之间的一个区别是，在西方教会，神职人员的独身制相对较早发展，并最终或多或少地坚持下来，现在西方罗马公教会的神父是独身的，对吧？
- start: 1038.609
  end: 1043.032
  speaker: unknown
  en: But you may know that the Eastern Orthodox priests are not necessarily celibate.
  zh: 但你可能知道，东正教的神父不一定是独身的。
- start: 1043.032
  end: 1046.175
  speaker: unknown
  en: So an Eastern Orthodox priest can be married and have a family.
  zh: 所以东正教的神父可以结婚并有家庭。
- start: 1046.175
  end: 1047.776
  speaker: unknown
  en: However, the bishops cannot.
  zh: 然而，主教不能。
- start: 1047.776
  end: 1053.759
  speaker: unknown
  en: To be a bishop in the East still means to be celibate because the bishops come from the monasteries.
  zh: 在东方成为主教仍然意味着独身，因为主教来自修道院。
- start: 1053.759
  end: 1057.401
  speaker: unknown
  en: So the idea is that the best bishops are the monastics.
  zh: 所以，最好的主教是修道士。
- start: 1057.401
  end: 1063.024
  speaker: unknown
  en: And this tradition really goes all the way back to the time of Basil.
  zh: 而这个传统实际上可以追溯到巴西尔的时代。
- start: 1066.546
  end: 1077.451
  speaker: unknown
  en: The interesting thing about this is that  A lot of what we've done so far has assumed that Christianity is an illegal, persecuted sect, right?
  zh: 有趣的是，到目前为止，我们所做的很多事情都假设基督教是一个非法的、受迫害的教派，对吧？
- start: 1077.792
  end: 1082.338
  speaker: unknown
  en: And so, once we hit Constantine though, Christianity is legalized.
  zh: 所以，一旦我们谈到君士坦丁，基督教就合法化了。
- start: 1083.299
  end: 1091.243
  speaker: unknown
  en: And after the legalization of Christianity, a lot of people become Christians for all the wrong reasons.
  zh: 在基督教合法化之后，很多人因为各种错误的原因成为基督徒。
- start: 1091.343
  end: 1098.706
  speaker: unknown
  en: Because, you know, imitating the emperor, or for networking, or upward mobility, whatever.
  zh: 因为，模仿皇帝，或者为了建立人脉，或者为了向上流动，等等。
- start: 1099.427
  end: 1109.591
  speaker: unknown
  en: You all of a sudden have a situation in the church that you didn't really have before, and that is that people could become Christian and join the church for reasons other than actual faith.
  zh: 你突然在教会中遇到了一种以前没有的情况，那就是人们可以因为实际信仰以外的原因成为基督徒并加入教会。
- start: 1111.155
  end: 1129.981
  speaker: unknown
  en: So now that Christianity is legal, to be converted in the Christian sense now is going to come to mean something more than just joining the church.
  zh: 所以现在基督教是合法的，在基督教意义上的皈依现在将意味着不仅仅是加入教会。
- start: 1130.268
  end: 1144.136
  speaker: unknown
  en: And so when you read the writings of the likes of the Cappadocians, you get the sense that, well, anybody can get baptized and join the church, but to really be converted is to sort of take on another whole level of commitment.
  zh: 所以当你阅读卡帕多细亚教父之类的著作时，你会感觉到，任何人都可以受洗并加入教会，但真正的皈依是承担另一种层次的承诺。
- start: 1145.144
  end: 1149.289
  speaker: unknown
  en: And that often means taking on the life of philosophy or the ascetic life.
  zh: 而这通常意味着过哲学生活或禁欲生活。
- start: 1149.289
  end: 1155.675
  speaker: unknown
  en: And so conversion is not anymore simply from paganism to Christianity.
  zh: 所以皈依不再仅仅是从异教到基督教。
- start: 1155.675
  end: 1156.976
  speaker: unknown
  en: That's too easy.
  zh: 那太容易了。
- start: 1157.076
  end: 1162.722
  speaker: unknown
  en: Conversion is now from nominal Christianity to true philosophy, meaning the ascetic life.
  zh: 现在的皈依是从名义上的基督教到真正的哲学，意味着禁欲生活。
- start: 1163.082
  end: 1180.172
  speaker: unknown
  en: One of the issues the church has to deal with is whether it wants to promote this idea of two classes of Christians, the everyday Christian and the really committed Christian who has committed to a life of asceticism.
  zh: 教会必须处理的一个问题是，它是否想要推广这种基督徒的两种阶层的概念，即普通基督徒和真正致力于禁欲生活的基督徒。
- start: 1184.356
  end: 1194.601
  speaker: unknown
  en: Basil is going to be the one, though, who will sort of critique the life of a hermit and say, you know, if you always live alone, whose feet will you wash?
  zh: 然而，巴西尔将是那个批评隐士生活的人，他会说，如果你总是独自生活，你会洗谁的脚？
- start: 1194.601
  end: 1207.246
  speaker: unknown
  en: So, in other words, how can you obey the second most important commandment, to love your neighbor, if you have completely withdrawn from society and you have no neighbor?
  zh: 换句话说，如果你完全脱离社会，没有邻居，你如何遵守第二条最重要的诫命，爱你的邻舍？
- start: 1207.246
  end: 1208.507
  speaker: unknown
  en: So that's going to be an issue.
  zh: 所以这将是一个问题。
- start: 1208.507
  end: 1211.408
  speaker: unknown
  en: We'll talk a little bit about that in the next hour, too.
  zh: 我们将在接下来的一个小时里也谈谈这个问题。
- start: 1213.8
  end: 1230.193
  speaker: unknown
  en: So, Basil was eventually coerced into being ordained a priest by the previous bishop of Caesarea, but when the previous bishop died in the year 370, it was not necessarily clear that Basil would be elected the next bishop.
  zh: 所以，巴西尔最终被前任凯撒利亚主教强迫成为神父，但当前任主教在370年去世时，并不一定明确巴西尔会被选为下一任主教。
- start: 1230.193
  end: 1247.493
  speaker: unknown
  en: Now, if you've been following along in the story,  There are plenty of instances where a famous theologian becomes the deacon, right-handed man to the bishop, and when the bishop dies, the famous theologian becomes the next bishop.
  zh: 现在，如果你一直在跟随这个故事，有很多例子是著名的神学家成为主教的执事和得力助手，当主教去世时，著名的神学家成为下一任主教。
- start: 1247.493
  end: 1250.396
  speaker: unknown
  en: And you almost expect that story to play out here.
  zh: 你几乎期待这个故事在这里上演。
- start: 1250.496
  end: 1263.203
  speaker: unknown
  en: And it does, but it almost didn't.  Basil almost didn't get elected because too many people feared that he would insist on too strict of a life for all Christians.
  zh: 确实如此，但几乎没有。巴西尔几乎没有当选，因为太多人担心他会坚持对所有基督徒过于严格的生活。
- start: 1263.203
  end: 1267.344
  speaker: unknown
  en: In other words, if he's our bishop, is he going to make us all be ascetics?
  zh: 换句话说，如果他是我们的主教，他会让我们都成为禁欲主义者吗？
- start: 1267.504
  end: 1268.704
  speaker: unknown
  en: That was the fear.
  zh: 这是他们的担忧。
- start: 1270.485
  end: 1280.566
  speaker: unknown
  en: And he actually had to enlist the help of the father of Gregory of Nazianzus, who was the current bishop of Nazianzus, to help get him elected.
  zh: 他实际上不得不求助于纳齐安祖的格雷戈里的父亲，现任纳齐安祖主教，来帮助他当选。
- start: 1281.047
  end: 1296.085
  speaker: unknown
  en: And this begins  Basil on a path that his career has often been criticized as being sort of opportunistic and maybe overly aggressive in terms of working toward his own goals.
  zh: 这开启了巴西尔的职业生涯，这条道路常常被批评为有点机会主义，可能在追求自己的目标方面过于激进。
- start: 1296.085
  end: 1304.494
  speaker: unknown
  en: In fact, even the Gregory's will be annoyed with him at times for ways in which they felt they were manipulated by him.
  zh: 事实上，甚至格雷戈里有时也会对他感到恼火，因为他们觉得自己被他操纵了。
- start: 1305.451
  end: 1315.254
  speaker: unknown
  en: At any rate, he does become the next bishop and he becomes the successor to Athanasius as the great defender of Nicene orthodoxy.
  zh: 无论如何，他确实成为了下一任主教，并成为亚他拿修的继任者，成为尼西亚正统的大捍卫者。
- start: 1315.574
  end: 1318.295
  speaker: unknown
  en: Now remember, Arianism hasn't gone away.
  zh: 现在记住，亚略主义并没有消失。
- start: 1318.335
  end: 1330.979
  speaker: unknown
  en: So one of the first things Basil does when he gets elected as bishop of Caesarea is he works to get other orthodox or Nicene bishops elected in other cities.
  zh: 所以巴西尔当选为凯撒利亚主教后做的第一件事就是努力在其他城市选举其他正统或尼西亚主教。
- start: 1331.764
  end: 1338.09
  speaker: unknown
  en: He got Gregory of Nazianzus elected as bishop of a little town called Sassima.
  zh: 他让纳齐安祖的格雷戈里当选为一个叫萨西马的小镇的主教。
- start: 1338.09
  end: 1347.358
  speaker: unknown
  en: A little sort of border town that was really only significant because it was on a trade route.
  zh: 一个小边境小镇，实际上只有因为它在贸易路线上才重要。
- start: 1347.358
  end: 1354.403
  speaker: unknown
  en: Gregory of Nazianzus was annoyed with this to the point that he never set foot in that town, ever.
  zh: 纳齐安祖的格雷戈里对此感到非常恼火，以至于他从未踏足那个小镇。
- start: 1356.91
  end: 1362.937
  speaker: unknown
  en: And then Basil also got his brother elected as bishop of Nyssa.
  zh: 然后巴西尔还让他的兄弟当选为尼撒的主教。
- start: 1363.138
  end: 1376.033
  speaker: unknown
  en: And Basil himself would admit that those appointments were out of political convenience rather than because either of these two guys was ready to be bishop.
  zh: 巴西尔自己也承认这些任命是出于政治方便，而不是因为这两个人中的任何一个准备好成为主教。
- start: 1376.986
  end: 1381.229
  speaker: unknown
  en: So, Basil was kind of annoyed with them for not being good bishops.
  zh: 所以，巴西尔对他们不是好主教感到有点恼火。
- start: 1381.27
  end: 1386.995
  speaker: unknown
  en: They were annoyed with him for sort of forcing them to be bishops in these places that were supposedly strategic.
  zh: 他们对他感到恼火，因为他强迫他们在这些据说是战略性的地方成为主教。
- start: 1386.995
  end: 1399.006
  speaker: unknown
  en: At any rate, Gregory would later take over as acting bishop in Nazianzus after his father, and that's why we know him as Gregory of Nazianzus.
  zh: 无论如何，格雷戈里后来在他父亲之后接任纳齐安祖的代理主教，这就是为什么我们称他为纳齐安祖的格雷戈里。
- start: 1399.986
  end: 1408.269
  speaker: unknown
  en: But in spite of Basil's flaws, he makes a huge contribution to the church, especially to monasticism.
  zh: 但尽管巴西尔有缺点，他对教会，尤其是对修道主义做出了巨大贡献。
- start: 1408.269
  end: 1416.171
  speaker: unknown
  en: I already mentioned that he came to an awareness that a solitary life was too much about individual salvation.
  zh: 我已经提到他意识到独居生活过于关注个人的救赎。
- start: 1416.851
  end: 1420.092
  speaker: unknown
  en: And that was too individualistic for him.
  zh: 这对他来说太个人主义了。
- start: 1420.092
  end: 1424.593
  speaker: unknown
  en: He said you can't love your neighbor, you can't feed the hungry if you live as a hermit.
  zh: 他说，如果你作为隐士生活，你不能爱你的邻舍，不能喂饱饥饿的人。
- start: 1425.374
  end: 1429.955
  speaker: unknown
  en: So the monastic life can't be all about withdrawal from society.
  zh: 所以修道生活不能完全是脱离社会。
- start: 1430.499
  end: 1440.67
  speaker: unknown
  en: Rather, it should be like what we read of in the second chapter of Acts, where the apostles and all of the disciples sort of live communally, sharing what they had.
  zh: 相反，它应该像我们在《使徒行传》第二章中读到的那样，使徒和所有门徒共同生活，分享他们所拥有的。
- start: 1440.67
  end: 1443.892
  speaker: unknown
  en: That should be the model for the ascetic life.
  zh: 这应该是禁欲生活的典范。
- start: 1445.682
  end: 1465.473
  speaker: unknown
  en: While up until the time of Basil, the monks have been moving farther and farther out into the desert, Basil brings them back to the outskirts of the city and reorients the focus of the monastery outward in the sense of ministry, ministry to the poor.
  zh: 在巴西尔之前，修道士们一直在向沙漠深处迁移，巴西尔将他们带回城市的郊区，并将修道院的重点重新定位为向外的事工，向穷人事工。
- start: 1466.574
  end: 1475.306
  speaker: unknown
  en: One of the classic  Vows of the monastic life is poverty, but it's voluntary poverty.
  zh: 修道生活的经典誓愿之一是贫穷，但这是自愿的贫穷。
- start: 1475.787
  end: 1483.013
  speaker: unknown
  en: Voluntary poverty, Basil would say, is for the purpose of helping the poor, not just to be the poor.
  zh: 巴西尔会说，自愿贫穷是为了帮助穷人，而不仅仅是成为穷人。
- start: 1483.153
  end: 1490.139
  speaker: unknown
  en: If you just take on a life of poverty to be in solidarity with the poor, the poor will say, gee, thanks.
  zh: 如果你只是过贫穷的生活以与穷人团结一致，穷人会说，天哪，谢谢。
- start: 1491.34
  end: 1499.922
  speaker: unknown
  en: But voluntary poverty should mean a self-sacrificial life so that one can  Help the poor.
  zh: 但自愿贫穷应该意味着一种自我牺牲的生活，以便能够帮助穷人。
- start: 1499.922
  end: 1501.708
  speaker: unknown
  en: Give to the poor.
  zh: 施舍给穷人。
- start: 1502.615
  end: 1508.216
  speaker: unknown
  en: Also, Basil said, you cannot learn humility and obedience if you answer to no one.
  zh: 此外，巴西尔说，如果你不向任何人负责，你就无法学习谦卑和顺服。
- start: 1508.216
  end: 1511.497
  speaker: unknown
  en: This is the other problem with a totally solitary life.
  zh: 这是完全独居生活的另一个问题。
- start: 1511.497
  end: 1514.718
  speaker: unknown
  en: If you live a solitary life, you are your own boss.
  zh: 如果你过着独居生活，你就是自己的老板。
- start: 1514.718
  end: 1523.539
  speaker: unknown
  en: Which sounds like a good idea, but how will you grow in spiritual maturity if there is no one there to keep you humble?
  zh: 这听起来是个好主意，但如果没有人让你保持谦卑，你如何在灵性上成熟？
- start: 1523.599
  end: 1529.261
  speaker: unknown
  en: And so, one of the other classic vows of the monastic life is obedience.
  zh: 因此，修道生活的另一个经典誓愿是顺服。
- start: 1529.341
  end: 1534.711
  speaker: unknown
  en: The rule of obedience  Brings the monks under the bishop's authority.
  zh: 顺服的规则将修道士置于主教的权威之下。
- start: 1534.711
  end: 1540.494
  speaker: unknown
  en: Now, Brandon, he's the bishop, so you can see why he'd want to bring the monks under the bishop's authority.
  zh: 现在，布兰登是主教，所以你可以理解为什么他想把修道士置于主教的权威之下。
- start: 1540.494
  end: 1541.815
  speaker: unknown
  en: So there is some of that.
  zh: 所以有一些这样的因素。
- start: 1541.815
  end: 1554.04
  speaker: unknown
  en: But also, he truly believed that there was an advantage in terms of spiritual maturity here, that monks ought to be under the authority of someone else.
  zh: 但他也真正相信，在灵性成熟方面，这里有一个优势，即修道士应该在他人的权威之下。
- start: 1555.121
  end: 1563.951
  speaker: unknown
  en: On the other hand,  Basil always maintained that one can live as an ascetic without actually being a monk.
  zh: 另一方面，巴西尔始终认为，一个人可以过禁欲生活而不必成为修道士。
- start: 1563.951
  end: 1567.337
  speaker: unknown
  en: So he did not require that everyone should be a monk.
  zh: 所以他不要求每个人都成为修道士。
- start: 1569.882
  end: 1577.628
  speaker: unknown
  en: In fact, he did not require that everyone should be celibate, obviously, because the struggle, asceticism means striving, struggling, working.
  zh: 事实上，他显然不要求每个人都独身，因为禁欲主义意味着努力、奋斗、工作。
- start: 1577.628
  end: 1579.089
  speaker: unknown
  en: The struggle is an inner struggle.
  zh: 这种奋斗是内在的奋斗。
- start: 1579.089
  end: 1580.951
  speaker: unknown
  en: It's not an external struggle.
  zh: 这不是外在的奋斗。
- start: 1581.671
  end: 1590.578
  speaker: unknown
  en: You know, the old school thinking that you went out to the desert to meet the demons and fight with the demons, well, really it's about an internal struggle.
  zh: 你知道，旧派的想法是你去沙漠见恶魔并与恶魔战斗，但实际上这是关于内在的奋斗。
- start: 1590.899
  end: 1595.042
  speaker: unknown
  en: And anyone can be involved in that as a Christian.
  zh: 作为基督徒，任何人都可以参与其中。
- start: 1595.042
  end: 1598.144
  speaker: unknown
  en: Anyone can practice works of compassion.
  zh: 任何人都可以实践慈悲的行为。
- start: 1599.46
  end: 1611.629
  speaker: unknown
  en: And so, Basil rejects this idea that there are levels of Christianity, that somehow the monks are better than everybody else, that the celibates are on a higher spiritual plane.
  zh: 因此，巴西尔拒绝了这种基督教有等级的观点，即修道士比其他人更好，独身者在更高的灵性层面上。
- start: 1611.629
  end: 1617.093
  speaker: unknown
  en: He actually rejects that idea, and he really doesn't even call his monks, monks.
  zh: 他实际上拒绝了这种观点，他甚至不称他的修道士为修道士。
- start: 1617.113
  end: 1619.935
  speaker: unknown
  en: He just calls everybody brothers and sisters.
  zh: 他只是称每个人为兄弟姐妹。
- start: 1621.746
  end: 1630.692
  speaker: unknown
  en: And he rejects the idea that non-celibate or non-ascetic Christians are somehow second-class citizens or should be criticized.
  zh: 他拒绝认为非独身或非禁欲的基督徒是二等公民或应该受到批评的观点。
- start: 1630.692
  end: 1636.255
  speaker: unknown
  en: He rejects any idea that marriage should be condemned as unworthy or anything like that.
  zh: 他拒绝任何认为婚姻应该被谴责为不值得的观点或类似的观点。
- start: 1637.659
  end: 1649.526
  speaker: unknown
  en: He has all these ideas about monasticism and what it's supposed to be like, but he was never really able to live it out because he was pulled into the administrative office of the episcopacy.
  zh: 他对修道主义及其应有的样子有很多想法，但他从未真正能够实现这些想法，因为他被拉入了主教的行政办公室。
- start: 1649.846
  end: 1672.019
  speaker: unknown
  en: Instead, he planned to build a city,  A city on the outskirts of the town that was going to be like a little complex with a hospital with a lever wing and a hostel for pilgrims and a monastery and a school and shops and a welfare office and it was going to do all of this stuff.
  zh: 相反，他计划建造一座城市，一座位于城镇郊区的小综合体，有一个带有杠杆翼的医院，一个朝圣者旅馆，一个修道院，一个学校，商店和一个福利办公室，它将做所有这些事情。
- start: 1672.019
  end: 1683.385
  speaker: unknown
  en: And that ideal for monasticism as being a part of a community that reaches out is really the basis for medieval monasticism.
  zh: 这种作为一个伸出援手的社区一部分的修道主义理想实际上是中世纪修道主义的基础。
- start: 1683.744
  end: 1688.828
  speaker: unknown
  en: Even though it's not clear that he ever really actually built this thing, but that was the idea, he wrote about it.
  zh: 尽管不清楚他是否真的建造了这个东西，但那是他的想法，他写了下来。
- start: 1690.349
  end: 1702.118
  speaker: unknown
  en: Now as far as theology, Basil's main contribution to theology is in this conversation about the divinity of the Holy Spirit.
  zh: 现在就神学而言，巴西尔对神学的主要贡献在于关于圣灵神性的讨论。
- start: 1703.259
  end: 1711.005
  speaker: unknown
  en: Basil is the one to propose that the Spirit proceeds from the Father, he'll say from the Father, through the Son.
  zh: 巴西尔提出圣灵从圣父而出，他会说从圣父，通过圣子。
- start: 1711.744
  end: 1717.466
  speaker: unknown
  en: He doesn't go so far as to say that the Holy Spirit is homoousios, or consubstantial.
  zh: 他没有说圣灵是同质的，或同一本质的。
- start: 1718.266
  end: 1726.128
  speaker: unknown
  en: But he does say that the Holy Spirit is the giver of life, and is to be worshipped and glorified.
  zh: 但他说圣灵是生命的赐予者，应当被敬拜和荣耀。
- start: 1726.128
  end: 1727.989
  speaker: unknown
  en: Words that find their way into the Creed.
  zh: 这些话进入了信经。
- start: 1727.989
  end: 1730.33
  speaker: unknown
  en: Now why is that significant?
  zh: 这为什么重要？
- start: 1730.33
  end: 1731.17
  speaker: unknown
  en: Think about it.
  zh: 想一想。
- start: 1731.17
  end: 1735.111
  speaker: unknown
  en: The Holy Spirit is giver of life, not receiver of life.
  zh: 圣灵是生命的赐予者，而不是生命的接受者。
- start: 1735.496
  end: 1738.118
  speaker: unknown
  en: So that speaks to the Spirit's divinity.
  zh: 这说明了圣灵的神性。
- start: 1738.378
  end: 1745.442
  speaker: unknown
  en: The Holy Spirit is not the recipient of life, but a source of life.
  zh: 圣灵不是生命的接受者，而是生命的源头。
- start: 1745.463
  end: 1751.767
  speaker: unknown
  en: And the Holy Spirit is being worshipped and glorified along with the Father and Son, so also that speaks to the Spirit's divinity as well.
  zh: 圣灵与圣父和圣子一起被敬拜和荣耀，这也说明了圣灵的神性。
- start: 1751.767
  end: 1762.714
  speaker: unknown
  en: So, you know, he doesn't go quite as far as maybe, you know, Gregory of Nazianzus would want him to, but we're going to see each one takes it a little bit farther.
  zh: 所以，他没有像纳齐安祖的格雷戈里希望的那样走得那么远，但我们会看到每个人都走得更远一点。
- start: 1763.624
  end: 1767.846
  speaker: unknown
  en: You are going to read Basil's document on the Holy Spirit.
  zh: 你将阅读巴西尔关于圣灵的文献。
- start: 1768.627
  end: 1777.571
  speaker: unknown
  en: And when you read that, especially look for the doctrine of inseparable operation as an argument for the divinity of the Spirit.
  zh: 当你阅读那篇文章时，特别要注意不可分割的运作教义，作为圣灵神性的论据。
- start: 1777.571
  end: 1784.675
  speaker: unknown
  en: In other words, all divine activity is the result of all three persons of the Trinity acting together.
  zh: 换句话说，所有的神圣活动都是三位一体的三个位格共同作用的结果。
- start: 1784.795
  end: 1789.097
  speaker: unknown
  en: All three persons of the Trinity are involved in all divine activity.
  zh: 三位一体的三个位格都参与了所有的神圣活动。
- start: 1790.178
  end: 1792.799
  speaker: unknown
  en: Inseparable operation, yeah.
  zh: 不可分割的运作，是的。
- start: 1793.099
  end: 1808.348
  speaker: unknown
  en: This stuff should be kind of old hat to you by now, but inseparable operation has been something that came up in the discussion about the relationship between the Father and the Son, but now Basil extends that to the Spirit as well.
  zh: 这些东西对你来说应该已经很熟悉了，但不可分割的运作在讨论圣父和圣子的关系时已经出现过，但现在巴西尔将其扩展到圣灵。
- start: 1808.348
  end: 1814.271
  speaker: unknown
  en: Inseparable operation means all three persons of the Trinity are involved in all divine activity.
  zh: 不可分割的运作意味着三位一体的三个位格都参与了所有的神圣活动。
- start: 1814.271
  end: 1818.433
  speaker: unknown
  en: And if that's the case, then that means the Holy Spirit is divine.
  zh: 如果是这样，那就意味着圣灵是神圣的。
- start: 1819.213
  end: 1823.396
  speaker: unknown
  en: So that becomes the argument, or an argument, for the divinity of the Spirit.
  zh: 所以这成为了圣灵神性的论据之一。
- start: 1825.237
  end: 1828.219
  speaker: unknown
  en: In 379, Basil was only 49 years old.
  zh: 在379年，巴西尔只有49岁。
- start: 1829.54
  end: 1833.182
  speaker: unknown
  en: Which occurs to me that's how old I am right now.
  zh: 我意识到我现在也是这个年龄。
- start: 1834.043
  end: 1839.847
  speaker: unknown
  en: But I have not yet ruined my health through extreme asceticism.
  zh: 但我还没有通过极端的禁欲主义毁掉我的健康。
- start: 1839.847
  end: 1842.648
  speaker: unknown
  en: In fact, I'd probably go to the other extreme.
  zh: 事实上，我可能会走向另一个极端。
- start: 1842.648
  end: 1866.488
  speaker: unknown
  en: So, Basil was such  An extreme ascetic that he ruined his health and he lived only to be 49. After he died, the two Gregories were kind of out from under his shadow, which allowed them then to come into their own as theologians.
  zh: 所以，巴西尔是一个极端的禁欲主义者，以至于他毁了自己的健康，只活到了49岁。他去世后，两位格雷戈里摆脱了他的阴影，这使他们能够作为神学家崭露头角。
- start: 1866.488
  end: 1872.33
  speaker: unknown
  en: Not that they didn't write anything before his death, but you get the idea, especially the brother, Gregory of Nyssa, the younger brother.
  zh: 并不是说他们在他去世前没有写任何东西，但你明白了，特别是他的弟弟，尼撒的格雷戈里。
- start: 1875.58
  end: 1878.084
  speaker: unknown
  en: So let's talk about this.
  zh: 所以我们来谈谈这个。
- start: 1878.084
  end: 1881.108
  speaker: unknown
  en: But first let me see if there are any questions about Babylon.
  zh: 但首先让我看看是否有关于巴比伦的问题。
- start: 1881.249
  end: 1882.271
  speaker: unknown
  en: Yes?
  zh: 是吗？
- start: 1882.271
  end: 1888.841
  speaker: unknown
  en: When you say aesthetics, are you talking about a very personal life, like the apostles' life?
  zh: 当你说禁欲主义时，你是在谈论一种非常个人的生活，像使徒的生活吗？
- start: 1890.598
  end: 1893.62
  speaker: unknown
  en: With Basil, especially, it's more than that.
  zh: 尤其是对巴西尔来说，不仅仅是这样。
- start: 1893.62
  end: 1895.541
  speaker: unknown
  en: It's more than just living simply.
  zh: 这不仅仅是简单地生活。
- start: 1895.541
  end: 1903.927
  speaker: unknown
  en: It's actually denying oneself things that we might consider necessities.
  zh: 实际上是拒绝我们可能认为是必需品的东西。
- start: 1903.927
  end: 1907.649
  speaker: unknown
  en: Eating very little, sleeping very little, not sleeping on anything soft.
  zh: 吃得很少，睡得很少，不睡在任何柔软的东西上。
- start: 1907.649
  end: 1910.051
  speaker: unknown
  en: He's not even sleeping laying down.
  zh: 他甚至不躺着睡觉。
- start: 1910.051
  end: 1916.555
  speaker: unknown
  en: Never mind, I guess this is a vision that's not involved, so that was a big talk there.
  zh: 算了，我想这是一个不相关的愿景，所以那是一个大话题。
- start: 1934.181
  end: 1936.542
  speaker: unknown
  en: Well, you know, that's exactly right.
  zh: 嗯，你知道，那完全正确。
- start: 1936.542
  end: 1944.246
  speaker: unknown
  en: I don't want to make it sound like he could just simply appoint them, because he doesn't have that kind of authority.
  zh: 我不想让它听起来像他可以简单地任命他们，因为他没有那种权力。
- start: 1944.246
  end: 1948.308
  speaker: unknown
  en: What he has to do is work behind the scenes and lobby for their election.
  zh: 他必须在幕后工作并游说他们的选举。
- start: 1949.458
  end: 1957.148
  speaker: unknown
  en: But yes, theoretically, if Gregory is from Danseanzis,  How does he get elected in Sassouma?
  zh: 但理论上，如果格雷戈里来自纳齐安祖，他怎么会在萨西马当选？
- start: 1957.148
  end: 1960.929
  speaker: unknown
  en: It shouldn't happen, but he's bending the rules.
  zh: 这不应该发生，但他在曲解规则。
- start: 1961.469
  end: 1967.71
  speaker: unknown
  en: And certainly there would have been people who would have said something about it, but eventually he was able to make it happen.
  zh: 当然，肯定会有人对此说些什么，但最终他还是成功了。
- start: 1967.79
  end: 1981.654
  speaker: unknown
  en: Now, you use the phrase for his own political gain, and certainly that is true, although if we were to ask Basil, he would say it's not for himself, it's for the cause of Nicene Orthodoxy.
  zh: 现在，你用“为了他自己的政治利益”这个短语，这当然是对的，尽管如果我们问巴西尔，他会说这不是为了他自己，而是为了尼西亚正统的事业。
- start: 1981.734
  end: 1989.86
  speaker: unknown
  en: It's to get the Aryans out  Okay, so let's talk about Gregory of Nyssa.
  zh: 这是为了赶走亚略派。好的，我们来谈谈尼撒的格雷戈里。
- start: 1989.86
  end: 1997.025
  speaker: unknown
  en: He's born somewhere around 330, or depending on who you ask, 330, 334, 340, somewhere in the 330s.
  zh: 他大约出生于330年，或者根据你问的人不同，330年、334年、340年，大约在330年代。
- start: 2010.3
  end: 2017.422
  speaker: unknown
  en: He died in 385, or 386, or 394, depending who he asked.
  zh: 他于385年、386年或394年去世，取决于你问谁。
- start: 2017.482
  end: 2020.843
  speaker: unknown
  en: So, you know, we're not exactly sure.
  zh: 所以，我们不太确定。
- start: 2021.163
  end: 2027.824
  speaker: unknown
  en: But let's say, just for the sake of argument, that he died in the late 80s, maybe the late 380s.
  zh: 但为了讨论起见，我们假设他在80年代末，也许是380年代末去世。
- start: 2032.6
  end: 2045.812
  speaker: unknown
  en: So, as I said, Basil had gotten him elected as Bishop of Nyssa, but there were a lot of Aryans in that city, and they immediately started trying to get rid of him.
  zh: 所以，正如我所说，巴西尔让他当选为尼撒的主教，但那座城市有很多亚略派，他们立即开始试图摆脱他。
- start: 2045.912
  end: 2057.302
  speaker: unknown
  en: They got him accused of all kinds of trumped up charges, including theft, you know, like he was accused of stealing money from the church.
  zh: 他们指控他各种捏造的罪名，包括盗窃，比如他被指控从教会偷钱。
- start: 2058.123
  end: 2062.926
  speaker: unknown
  en: He almost got thrown in jail, but  Gregory of Nyssa fled, took off, left the city.
  zh: 他差点被关进监狱，但尼撒的格雷戈里逃跑了，离开了城市。
- start: 2063.306
  end: 2075.25
  speaker: unknown
  en: At the end of the day though, Gregory of Nyssa is really the only one of the three to be influential at the council of Constantinople in 381. He was there.
  zh: 不过，最终，尼撒的格雷戈里是三人中唯一在381年的君士坦丁堡会议上有影响力的人。他在那里。
- start: 2075.25
  end: 2080.812
  speaker: unknown
  en: Now, I'm going to tell you in a few minutes that Nantianzus actually starts out as the chair of the council, but he quit.
  zh: 现在，我要告诉你，纳齐安祖实际上是以会议主席的身份开始的，但他辞职了。
- start: 2082.492
  end: 2089.295
  speaker: unknown
  en: Nyssa is the one who is sort of the theologian at the Council of Constantinople.
  zh: 尼撒是君士坦丁堡会议上的神学家。
- start: 2089.295
  end: 2093.636
  speaker: unknown
  en: He wrote documents for the Council, became the lead theologian there.
  zh: 他为会议撰写文件，成为那里的首席神学家。
- start: 2093.896
  end: 2099.098
  speaker: unknown
  en: After the Council, he became an advisor to the Emperor, Theodosius.
  zh: 会议结束后，他成为皇帝狄奥多西的顾问。
- start: 2099.818
  end: 2104.379
  speaker: unknown
  en: And he also wrote the Life of Macrina that you're going to read.
  zh: 他还写了你将要阅读的《马克里娜的生平》。
- start: 2106.427
  end: 2112.648
  speaker: unknown
  en: When you read the life of Macrina, remember your rules about how to read each document, right?
  zh: 当你阅读《马克里娜的生平》时，记住你如何阅读每个文件的规则，对吧？
- start: 2112.729
  end: 2114.349
  speaker: unknown
  en: There's an agenda here.
  zh: 这里有一个议程。
- start: 2114.469
  end: 2122.371
  speaker: unknown
  en: What do you think Gregory of Nyssa's agenda is in writing the story of his sister?
  zh: 你认为尼撒的格雷戈里写他姐姐的故事的目的是什么？
- start: 2126.132
  end: 2127.612
  speaker: unknown
  en: Say that louder, please.
  zh: 请大声说出来。
- start: 2130.073
  end: 2132.873
  speaker: unknown
  en: Yes, right, to promote Nicene Orthodoxy.
  zh: 是的，对，推广尼西亚正统。
- start: 2132.873
  end: 2134.394
  speaker: unknown
  en: That's a big part of it.
  zh: 这是其中的重要部分。
- start: 2134.454
  end: 2136.034
  speaker: unknown
  en: And anything else?
  zh: 还有其他的吗？
- start: 2138.993
  end: 2140.994
  speaker: unknown
  en: To promote monasticism.
  zh: 推广修道主义。
- start: 2140.994
  end: 2147.377
  speaker: unknown
  en: She's held up as a pioneer of the aesthetic life, the life of philosophy.
  zh: 她被视为禁欲生活、哲学生活的先驱。
- start: 2147.458
  end: 2154.201
  speaker: unknown
  en: Anyway, it's not too long and it's definitely good to read.
  zh: 无论如何，它不太长，绝对值得一读。
- start: 2155.742
  end: 2161.645
  speaker: unknown
  en: The theological document that you're going to read from Nyssa is called On Not Three Gods.
  zh: 你将要阅读的尼撒的神学文献叫做《论非三神》。
- start: 2162.981
  end: 2163.722
  speaker: unknown
  en: I'm not three gods.
  zh: 我不是三神。
- start: 2163.722
  end: 2169.945
  speaker: unknown
  en: Or, you know, a better translation might be something like, concerning the fact that we do not believe in three gods.
  zh: 或者，更好的翻译可能是关于我们不相信三神的事实。
- start: 2170.586
  end: 2187.623
  speaker: unknown
  en: And this comes up because, you know, after Basil's On the Holy Spirit, some people were bound to say, well look, if you're talking about the divinity of the Father and the divinity of the Son and the divinity of the Holy Spirit,  That sounds like three gods.
  zh: 这是因为，在巴西尔的《论圣灵》之后，有些人必然会说，如果你谈论圣父的神性、圣子的神性和圣灵的神性，那听起来像是三神。
- start: 2187.623
  end: 2189.344
  speaker: unknown
  en: That sounds like tritheism.
  zh: 那听起来像是三神论。
- start: 2189.344
  end: 2192.067
  speaker: unknown
  en: It sounds like you're worshipping three divinities.
  zh: 听起来像是你在敬拜三位神。
- start: 2192.327
  end: 2197.072
  speaker: unknown
  en: And so Gregory comes along and says, here's how it's not three gods.
  zh: 于是格雷戈里出现了，说，这就是为什么这不是三神。
- start: 2197.072
  end: 2198.774
  speaker: unknown
  en: Here's how it's one God.
  zh: 这就是为什么这是一个神。
- start: 2198.774
  end: 2207.563
  speaker: unknown
  en: Talking about the unity of God in spite of the fact that there are three divine persons.
  zh: 尽管有三个位格，但谈论神的统一性。
- start: 2209.324
  end: 2211.286
  speaker: unknown
  en: And the argument goes kind of like this.
  zh: 论点大致如下。
- start: 2211.286
  end: 2214.109
  speaker: unknown
  en: I'll give you the overview so you can have this in your head when you read it.
  zh: 我会给你一个概述，这样你在阅读时可以记住这些。
- start: 2214.109
  end: 2216.13
  speaker: unknown
  en: The argument goes kind of like this.
  zh: 论点大致如下。
- start: 2218.513
  end: 2222.116
  speaker: unknown
  en: And it has a lot to do with inseparable operation again.
  zh: 这再次与不可分割的运作有很大关系。
- start: 2222.994
  end: 2234.48
  speaker: unknown
  en: Inseparable operation, the fact that all three persons of the Trinity are involved in all divine activity, inseparable operation is a function of divine simplicity.
  zh: 不可分割的运作，三位一体的三个位格都参与所有的神圣活动，不可分割的运作是神圣单纯性的一个功能。
- start: 2234.58
  end: 2238.382
  speaker: unknown
  en: We've talked about divine simplicity before, but maybe not a lot, so I'll remind you.
  zh: 我们以前谈过神圣单纯性，但可能不多，所以我会提醒你。
- start: 2238.382
  end: 2243.325
  speaker: unknown
  en: Divine simplicity is the doctrine that says that God is simplex.
  zh: 神圣单纯性是指神是单一的教义。
- start: 2243.705
  end: 2250.412
  speaker: unknown
  en: In some translations it says God is simple, but that makes it sound like God is dumb, so I don't like that term.
  zh: 在一些翻译中，它说神是简单的，但这听起来像神是愚蠢的，所以我不喜欢这个词。
- start: 2250.553
  end: 2258.041
  speaker: unknown
  en: God is simplex, and by simplex we mean not composite, not composed of parts.
  zh: 神是单一的，单一的意思是非复合的，不是由部分组成的。
- start: 2258.162
  end: 2266.757
  speaker: unknown
  en: God doesn't have parts, because  Anything that has parts can then be taken apart or broken down into its parts.
  zh: 神没有部分，因为任何有部分的东西都可以被拆开或分解成其部分。
- start: 2266.938
  end: 2271.322
  speaker: unknown
  en: Anything that is made of parts can disintegrate into its parts.
  zh: 任何由部分组成的东西都可以分解成其部分。
- start: 2271.583
  end: 2273.825
  speaker: unknown
  en: And God cannot disintegrate.
  zh: 而神不能分解。
- start: 2273.946
  end: 2277.57
  speaker: unknown
  en: There are no parts into which God can be broken down.
  zh: 神没有可以分解的部分。
- start: 2277.57
  end: 2281.534
  speaker: unknown
  en: So you can't call the three persons of the Trinity three parts of God.
  zh: 所以你不能称三位一体的三个位格为神的三个部分。
- start: 2281.634
  end: 2282.775
  speaker: unknown
  en: It doesn't work like that.
  zh: 事情不是那样运作的。
- start: 2282.775
  end: 2284.156
  speaker: unknown
  en: God is one.
  zh: 神是一位。
- start: 2284.156
  end: 2289.959
  speaker: unknown
  en: So the oneness of God is understood as God's simplicity.
  zh: 所以神的独一性被理解为神的单纯性。
- start: 2289.959
  end: 2294.481
  speaker: unknown
  en: That God is one throughout, the one divinity, without any division.
  zh: 神始终是一位，唯一的神性，没有任何分割。
- start: 2294.481
  end: 2295.662
  speaker: unknown
  en: Question here?
  zh: 这里有问题吗？
- start: 2295.662
  end: 2305.547
  speaker: unknown
  en: Yeah, so did Gregory of Nazareth believe that all three parts of the Trinity were pretty resistant to creation as well?
  zh: 是的，那么纳齐安祖的格雷戈里是否认为三位一体的所有三个部分也对创造持抵制态度？
- start: 2306.007
  end: 2318.491
  speaker: unknown
  en: All three persons of the Trinity are co-eternal, because that's part and parcel with divinity.
  zh: 三位一体的三个位格是共存的，因为这是神性的组成部分。
- start: 2318.491
  end: 2335.297
  speaker: unknown
  en: If you start with the assumption of divine simplicity, that naturally leads you to inseparable operation, because if the Trinity doesn't have parts, you can't talk about the three persons of the Trinity off doing their own thing separately.
  zh: 如果你从神圣单纯性的假设开始，那自然会引导你到不可分割的运作，因为如果三位一体没有部分，你就不能谈论三个位格各自独立地做自己的事情。
- start: 2335.962
  end: 2341.604
  speaker: unknown
  en: So, the three persons of the Trinity work together.
  zh: 所以，三位一体的三个位格一起工作。
- start: 2343.085
  end: 2347.407
  speaker: unknown
  en: This also rules out the possibility of degrees of divinity.
  zh: 这也排除了神性等级的可能性。
- start: 2347.407
  end: 2354.73
  speaker: unknown
  en: There are no degrees of divinity such that the Father is the most divine, the Son is a little less divine, the Holy Spirit is a little less divine.
  zh: 没有神性等级，圣父是最神圣的，圣子稍微少一点，圣灵再少一点。
- start: 2354.73
  end: 2356.19
  speaker: unknown
  en: None of that.
  zh: 没有这些。
- start: 2356.19
  end: 2361.893
  speaker: unknown
  en: There is one divinity, and the three persons share the one divinity.
  zh: 只有一个神性，三个位格共享一个神性。
- start: 2361.893
  end: 2365.054
  speaker: unknown
  en: But not share as in divvy up.
  zh: 但不是分割的共享。
- start: 2365.454
  end: 2369.757
  speaker: unknown
  en: Share as in equally own the one divinity.
  zh: 共享是指平等地拥有一个神性。
- start: 2369.937
  end: 2376.942
  speaker: unknown
  en: And so this is how then we are not talking about three gods, we're talking about the one God.
  zh: 所以这就是为什么我们不是在谈论三位神，而是在谈论一位神。
- start: 2379.824
  end: 2396.915
  speaker: unknown
  en: Okay, so when we talk about the language then, remember that this word, hupostasis,  Some people were using that word to mean the same thing as essence.
  zh: 好的，当我们谈论语言时，记住这个词，hupostasis，有些人用这个词来表示与本质相同的意思。
- start: 2397.33
  end: 2407.496
  speaker: unknown
  en: So, if you say in Greek, three hupostasis, that the Trinity is three hupostasis, some people are hearing that as if you're saying three substances.
  zh: 所以，如果你用希腊语说，三个位格，三位一体是三个位格，有些人听起来像你在说三种本质。
- start: 2407.856
  end: 2410.578
  speaker: unknown
  en: And that's why it sounds like three gods to some people.
  zh: 这就是为什么对一些人来说听起来像三位神。
- start: 2410.578
  end: 2421.084
  speaker: unknown
  en: So, Gregory of Nyssa has to emphasize the meaning of hupostasis, as in to say, three hupostasis does not mean three gods.
  zh: 所以，尼撒的格雷戈里必须强调hupostasis的意思，即说，三个位格并不意味着三位神。
- start: 2421.524
  end: 2423.385
  speaker: unknown
  en: Yes, question over here.
  zh: 是的，这里有问题。
- start: 2423.385
  end: 2426.027
  speaker: unknown
  en: Yeah, sorry, I'm trying to follow through.
  zh: 是的，对不起，我在试图跟上。
- start: 2426.267
  end: 2432.031
  speaker: unknown
  en: Was he still going with the whole hierarchy model of the Trinity?
  zh: 他还在坚持三位一体的整个层级模型吗？
- start: 2432.212
  end: 2439.037
  speaker: unknown
  en: Well, there's always a hierarchy in the Trinity, but he will say that the hierarchy cannot be ontological.
  zh: 嗯，三位一体中总是有一个层级，但他会说这个层级不能是本体论的。
- start: 2439.037
  end: 2448.864
  speaker: unknown
  en: In other words, it's not a hierarchy of being where the Father is something and the Son is something else on a lower scale, and then the Spirit.
  zh: 换句话说，这不是一个存在的层级，圣父是某物，圣子是较低层次的某物，然后是圣灵。
- start: 2448.864
  end: 2450.665
  speaker: unknown
  en: It's not that kind of a hierarchy.
  zh: 这不是那种层级。
- start: 2450.686
  end: 2461.611
  speaker: unknown
  en: There's a hierarchy that maintains the distinction between the three persons,  In this case, the hierarchy is described in terms of the proceeding.
  zh: 有一个层级保持三个位格之间的区别，在这种情况下，层级是根据进程来描述的。
- start: 2462.091
  end: 2473.475
  speaker: unknown
  en: The Holy Spirit proceeds from the Father through the Son, but it's not an ontological hierarchy, because ontologically, in terms of ethics, the three are one.
  zh: 圣灵从圣父通过圣子而出，但这不是一个本体论的层级，因为在本体论上，在伦理上，三位是一体的。
- start: 2475.596
  end: 2478.177
  speaker: unknown
  en: Any other questions about Gregory of Nyssa?
  zh: 还有关于尼撒的格雷戈里的问题吗？
- start: 2480.863
  end: 2484.345
  speaker: unknown
  en: Alright, so let me talk about Gregory of Nazianzus then.
  zh: 好的，那么让我来谈谈纳齐安祖的格雷戈里。
- start: 2484.426
  end: 2494.413
  speaker: unknown
  en: Born around 325, or some say 329. It's always interesting to me that you can read different books and they can differ that much.
  zh: 大约出生于325年，或者有些人说是329年。我总是觉得有趣的是，你可以读不同的书，它们的说法可以有这么大的差异。
- start: 2494.413
  end: 2510.564
  speaker: unknown
  en: I mean, it's four years, it doesn't sound like a lot, but why pick 329 if somebody else has picked 325?  I don't know, and I don't claim to know, but born in the 320s, shortly after the Council of Nicaea, died 389 or 390, somewhere around that.
  zh: 我的意思是，四年听起来不多，但为什么选择329年，如果其他人选择了325年？我不知道，也不敢说知道，但他出生于320年代，尼西亚会议后不久，死于389年或390年，大约在那个时候。
- start: 2514.625
  end: 2527.573
  speaker: unknown
  en: So I'll just say 390, just for the sake of argument here, but somewhere around 389 or 390. Gregory of Nantianzus is actually another one of the four so-called Eastern Doctors of the Church.
  zh: 所以我就说390年，为了讨论方便，但大约在389年或390年。纳齐安祖的格雷戈里实际上是所谓的四位东方教会圣师之一。
- start: 2527.633
  end: 2539.66
  speaker: unknown
  en: I don't know why Gregory of Nantia gets passed over as one of the Doctors of the Church, especially since he seems to have been the more important one at the Council of Constantinople.
  zh: 我不知道为什么纳齐安祖的格雷戈里被忽略为教会圣师之一，特别是因为他似乎在君士坦丁堡会议上更重要。
- start: 2539.66
  end: 2546.125
  speaker: unknown
  en: But at any rate, Gregory of Nantianzus, the one we're talking about now,  Gregory of Nazianzus.
  zh: 但无论如何，纳齐安祖的格雷戈里，就是我们现在谈论的这个，纳齐安祖的格雷戈里。
- start: 2546.125
  end: 2552.568
  speaker: unknown
  en: His father was actually the bishop of Nazianzus, and his father ordained him priest to assist him.
  zh: 他的父亲实际上是纳齐安祖的主教，他的父亲任命他为神父来协助他。
- start: 2569.601
  end: 2577.95
  speaker: unknown
  en: And Gregory didn't want to be ordained, and so the story is that he ran away for a short time and eventually came back.
  zh: 格雷戈里不想被任命，所以故事是他逃跑了一段时间，最终回来了。
- start: 2577.95
  end: 2599.405
  speaker: unknown
  en: And actually, he would spend part of his life going back and forth, you know, sort of  Getting out of town, and then his father would get sick, and so he'd have to go back and help his father, and then he'd get out of town, and then his father would pass away, so he had to go back and put things in order, and I think he's the one who first said, just when I think I'm out, they pull me back in.
  zh: 实际上，他会花一部分时间来回奔波，你知道，离开城镇，然后他的父亲生病了，所以他不得不回去帮助他的父亲，然后他离开城镇，然后他的父亲去世了，所以他不得不回去整理事情，我想他是第一个说“就在我以为我脱身时，他们又把我拉回去”的人。
- start: 2599.405
  end: 2600.565
  speaker: unknown
  en: I think I'm pretty sure.
  zh: 我想我很确定。
- start: 2600.926
  end: 2603.107
  speaker: unknown
  en: Or that might have been Michael Corleone, yeah.
  zh: 或者那可能是迈克尔·柯里昂，是的。
- start: 2603.107
  end: 2609.408
  speaker: unknown
  en: So now, was he doing all this along with the Bishop of Salsima?
  zh: 那么，他是在与萨西马的主教一起做这些事情吗？
- start: 2609.408
  end: 2611.248
  speaker: unknown
  en: Well, yeah, but he did.
  zh: 嗯，是的，但他确实做了。
- start: 2611.248
  end: 2617.93
  speaker: unknown
  en: He never actually physically accepted that role because he never showed up there.
  zh: 他实际上从未正式接受那个角色，因为他从未出现在那里。
- start: 2617.93
  end: 2621.771
  speaker: unknown
  en: So yeah, technically he is.
  zh: 所以，是的，技术上他是。
- start: 2621.771
  end: 2628.832
  speaker: unknown
  en: And actually that will come back to haunt him because when he is in Constantinople, someone's going to say, hey, wait a minute.
  zh: 实际上，这会回来困扰他，因为当他在君士坦丁堡时，有人会说，嘿，等一下。
- start: 2629.092
  end: 2631.653
  speaker: unknown
  en: Aren't you supposed to be the bishop of that little town?
  zh: 你不是应该是那个小镇的主教吗？
- start: 2631.653
  end: 2650.533
  speaker: unknown
  en: Actually, at one point when his father had died, I believe, another heretical group  The Apollinarians.
  zh: 实际上，我相信在他父亲去世时，另一个异端团体阿波里纳派。
- start: 2650.533
  end: 2653.035
  speaker: unknown
  en: I think we're going to get to them next week.
  zh: 我想我们下周会谈到他们。
- start: 2666.085
  end: 2680.07
  speaker: unknown
  en: But in this time period between the Council of Nicaea and the Council of Constantinople, yet another heresy will emerge based on the teachings of a guy named Apollinarius.
  zh: 但在尼西亚会议和君士坦丁堡会议之间的这段时间里，基于一个名叫阿波里纳留的人的教义，又会出现另一个异端。
- start: 2680.07
  end: 2680.79
  speaker: unknown
  en: And so we'll get to that.
  zh: 所以我们会谈到那个。
- start: 2680.79
  end: 2682.151
  speaker: unknown
  en: I don't want to get off track.
  zh: 我不想偏离主题。
- start: 2682.631
  end: 2693.258
  speaker: unknown
  en: But they're around as well, and so Gregory of Nazianzus keeps having to go back and forth, back to Nazianzus, and when his father died, he became the acting bishop of Nazianzus.
  zh: 但他们也在那，所以纳齐安祖的格雷戈里不得不来回奔波，回到纳齐安祖，当他父亲去世时，他成为纳齐安祖的代理主教。
- start: 2693.258
  end: 2703.225
  speaker: unknown
  en: So there's some debate about whether he was ever officially the bishop of Nazianzus, but we call him that, so I guess that means he was.
  zh: 所以关于他是否曾正式成为纳齐安祖的主教存在一些争议，但我们称他为纳齐安祖的主教，所以我猜这意味着他是。
- start: 2704.746
  end: 2719.982
  speaker: unknown
  en: But in 379,  In the year 379, he was invited by the Nicenes, the Orthodox, the pro-Nicenes, in Constantinople to come to be their bishop.
  zh: 但在379年，在379年，他被君士坦丁堡的尼西亚派、正统派、亲尼西亚派邀请来做他们的主教。
- start: 2720.023
  end: 2728.748
  speaker: unknown
  en: Now look, in the capital city of Constantinople, the official bishop was Arian.
  zh: 现在看，在君士坦丁堡的首都，官方主教是亚略派。
- start: 2729.628
  end: 2743.619
  speaker: unknown
  en: And so there's this minority party of Nicenes who occupy this little chapel  And so they invited Gregory of Nazianzus to come and be their bishop, which would have meant two bishops in the city.
  zh: 所以有一小部分尼西亚派占据了这个小教堂，所以他们邀请纳齐安祖的格雷戈里来做他们的主教，这意味着城市里有两个主教。
- start: 2745.841
  end: 2747.622
  speaker: unknown
  en: And he did.
  zh: 他做了。
- start: 2747.982
  end: 2753.085
  speaker: unknown
  en: And again, you know, this is where it's going to come up that, hey, aren't you supposed to be the bishop somewhere else?
  zh: 再一次，你知道，这就是问题所在，嘿，你不是应该在别的地方做主教吗？
- start: 2755.347
  end: 2759.73
  speaker: unknown
  en: But eventually, a new emperor comes to the throne, Theodosius.
  zh: 但最终，一位新皇帝登基，狄奥多西。
- start: 2760.211
  end: 2763.493
  speaker: unknown
  en: And Theodosius is Orthodox.
  zh: 狄奥多西是正统派。
- start: 2764.449
  end: 2777.174
  speaker: unknown
  en: He's pro-Nicene, and so he is going to be instrumental in putting an end to the back and forth between the Nicenes and the Arians.
  zh: 他是亲尼西亚派的，所以他将在结束尼西亚派和亚略派之间的来回争斗中起到关键作用。
- start: 2780.476
  end: 2782.096
  speaker: unknown
  en: Emperor Theodosius.
  zh: 皇帝狄奥多西。
- start: 2782.096
  end: 2825.479
  speaker: unknown
  en: This is Theodosius I.  In the year 380, Theodosius issues an edict  The Edict of Thessalonica says this.
  zh: 这是狄奥多西一世。在380年，狄奥多西发布了一道法令，塞萨洛尼卡法令是这样说的。
- start: 2838.41
  end: 2840.631
  speaker: unknown
  en: What Constantine never did.
  zh: 这是君士坦丁从未做过的。
- start: 2840.631
  end: 2854.596
  speaker: unknown
  en: You know, the Emperor Constantine has a reputation for creating a marriage of church and state, and for making Christianity the official religion of the Roman Empire, but by now you know that's not the case.
  zh: 你知道，皇帝君士坦丁以创建教会与国家的结合而闻名，并使基督教成为罗马帝国的官方宗教，但现在你知道事实并非如此。
- start: 2854.596
  end: 2856.376
  speaker: unknown
  en: Constantine never did that.
  zh: 君士坦丁从未这样做过。
- start: 2856.376
  end: 2863.479
  speaker: unknown
  en: What Constantine did was issue an edict giving freedom of religion to all religions.
  zh: 君士坦丁所做的是发布一道法令，给予所有宗教信仰自由。
- start: 2864.319
  end: 2892.125
  speaker: unknown
  en: Now Theodosius comes along, and he's in a bit of a different position, because after all the back and forth with Arianism, and actually after a brief stint with a pagan emperor, Julian,  Theodosius wants to solidify the position of Christianity within the Empire, and specifically 19 Christianity.
  zh: 现在狄奥多西出现了，他的处境有点不同，因为在与亚略主义的来回争斗之后，实际上在与异教皇帝朱利安短暂的统治之后，狄奥多西想要巩固基督教在帝国内的地位，特别是尼西亚基督教。
- start: 2892.125
  end: 2899.51
  speaker: unknown
  en: So he is going to say, by the way folks, Christianity is now the official religion of the Roman Empire.
  zh: 所以他要说，顺便说一下，大家，基督教现在是罗马帝国的官方宗教。
- start: 2899.67
  end: 2911.02
  speaker: unknown
  en: And he's going to go so far as to say, and here's what I mean by Christianity, because that Arian stuff won't do,  The true faith is the Nicene faith.
  zh: 他甚至会说，这就是我所说的基督教，因为亚略派的东西不行，真正的信仰是尼西亚信仰。
- start: 2911.06
  end: 2915.103
  speaker: unknown
  en: And the edict of Thessalonica in 380 basically says this.
  zh: 380年的塞萨洛尼卡法令基本上是这样说的。
- start: 2915.103
  end: 2928.009
  speaker: unknown
  en: It says that the faith of the Roman Empire that everyone is expected to accept is the faith that Peter delivered to the Romans.
  zh: 它说，罗马帝国的信仰是彼得传给罗马人的信仰，每个人都应该接受。
- start: 2929.17
  end: 2935.171
  speaker: unknown
  en: So notice, an eastern emperor  Putting Rome in first place.
  zh: 所以注意，一个东方皇帝把罗马放在第一位。
- start: 2935.531
  end: 2947.414
  speaker: unknown
  en: Now, he also goes on to say, which is also taught in the city of Alexandria,  But Alexandria is mentioned in the sense that it agrees with Rome.
  zh: 现在，他还继续说，这也是在亚历山大城教导的，但提到亚历山大是因为它与罗马一致。
- start: 2947.454
  end: 2956.88
  speaker: unknown
  en: So, again, we're going to get around to a lecture on the development of the office of bishop of Rome, the bishop of Rome as the papacy.
  zh: 所以，再次，我们将讲到罗马主教职位的发展，罗马主教作为教宗。
- start: 2957.02
  end: 2961.223
  speaker: unknown
  en: And along the way I was pointing out the sort of stepping stones on that road.
  zh: 在此过程中，我指出了那条道路上的一些垫脚石。
- start: 2961.223
  end: 2977.668
  speaker: unknown
  en: And this is another one of those stepping stones where  The Christian faith is now defined by the Emperor as the faith that Peter delivered to the Romans.
  zh: 这是另一个垫脚石，基督教信仰现在被皇帝定义为彼得传给罗马人的信仰。
- start: 2977.848
  end: 2984.789
  speaker: unknown
  en: Gregory of Nazianzus was probably behind this, at least instrumental in defining this.
  zh: 纳齐安祖的格雷戈里可能在背后，至少在定义这一点上起到了重要作用。
- start: 2985.15
  end: 2990.131
  speaker: unknown
  en: You are going to read a section from his Theological Orations.
  zh: 你将阅读他《神学演讲》中的一部分。
- start: 2991.05
  end: 2993.672
  speaker: unknown
  en: specifically the bit on the Holy Spirit.
  zh: 特别是关于圣灵的部分。
- start: 2993.672
  end: 2997.593
  speaker: unknown
  en: So continuing the discussion on pneumatology of the Holy Spirit.
  zh: 所以继续讨论圣灵的灵学。
- start: 2999.374
  end: 3008.139
  speaker: unknown
  en: In his writing, Gregory solidifies the term procession as the specific term that refers to the Holy Spirit.
  zh: 在他的著作中，格雷戈里巩固了“出发”这个术语，作为指圣灵的特定术语。
- start: 3008.459
  end: 3012.04
  speaker: unknown
  en: The Son is begotten, the Holy Spirit proceeds.
  zh: 圣子是被生的，圣灵是出发的。
- start: 3012.361
  end: 3026.297
  speaker: unknown
  en: And so here we get, again, I've talked about this a little bit in the past, but  When we talk about the doctrine of appropriation, where anything you can say about one person of the Trinity, you have to be able to say about the others.
  zh: 所以在这里，我们再次谈到这个问题，我过去谈过一点，但当我们谈论归属教义时，任何你可以说三位一体中的一个位格的事情，你必须能够说其他位格。
- start: 3026.958
  end: 3033.184
  speaker: unknown
  en: Or anything you can say about the Trinity as a whole, you have to be able to say about each person of the Trinity.
  zh: 或者任何你可以说关于三位一体整体的事情，你必须能够说每个位格。
- start: 3033.184
  end: 3042.247
  speaker: unknown
  en: With those few exceptions,  And so here, again, Gregory is solidifying the exception word that relates to the Holy Spirit.
  zh: 除了少数例外，所以在这里，格雷戈里再次巩固了与圣灵相关的例外词。
- start: 3042.247
  end: 3056.17
  speaker: unknown
  en: So, the Father is the only one who can be said to be unbegotten, the Son is the only one who can be said to be begotten, as generated, and the Holy Spirit proceeds.
  zh: 所以，圣父是唯一可以说是未生的，圣子是唯一可以说是被生的，作为生成的，圣灵是出发的。
- start: 3056.39
  end: 3059.65
  speaker: unknown
  en: That's the specific word about the Spirit.
  zh: 这是关于圣灵的特定词。
- start: 3059.65
  end: 3062.771
  speaker: unknown
  en: And then he says, beyond this is a mystery, so don't ask.
  zh: 然后他说，除此之外是一个奥秘，所以不要问。
- start: 3063.704
  end: 3087.872
  speaker: unknown
  en: Okay, so as Bishop of Constantinople now, we come to the year 381 and the Council of Constantinople and so, naturally, Gregory of Nazianzus was chosen by the Emperor to be the chair of the Council of Constantinople.
  zh: 好的，作为君士坦丁堡的主教，现在我们来到381年和君士坦丁堡会议，所以，纳齐安祖的格雷戈里自然被皇帝选为君士坦丁堡会议的主席。
- start: 3087.872
  end: 3089.092
  speaker: unknown
  en: So here we are.
  zh: 所以我们在这里。
- start: 3094.398
  end: 3099.039
  speaker: unknown
  en: 381, the Second Ecumenical Council, the Council of Constantinople.
  zh: 381年，第二次大公会议，君士坦丁堡会议。
- start: 3101.64
  end: 3107.001
  speaker: unknown
  en: And like I said, this is one of those dates that everyone should have memorized, whether they care or not.
  zh: 正如我所说，这是每个人都应该记住的日期之一，无论他们是否在意。
- start: 3107.762
  end: 3119.445
  speaker: unknown
  en: Nicaea 325, Constantinople 381. And if I meet you 30 years from now, I'd better be able to say, what year was the Council of Constantinople?
  zh: 尼西亚325年，君士坦丁堡381年。如果我30年后见到你，我最好能说，君士坦丁堡会议是哪一年？
- start: 3119.445
  end: 3121.185
  speaker: unknown
  en: You'd be like, 381, of course.
  zh: 你会说，当然是381年。
- start: 3123.166
  end: 3135.435
  speaker: unknown
  en: So the problem is that Gregory of Nazianzus did not remain chair of the council for very long because he was disillusioned by what he considered to be the politics of it all.
  zh: 问题是，纳齐安祖的格雷戈里没有长时间担任会议主席，因为他对他认为的政治感到幻灭。
- start: 3135.922
  end: 3150.214
  speaker: unknown
  en: Now, by politics, though, part of the politics was the attempt on the part of many of the bishops of trying not to alienate too many people, but instead looking for as much consensus as possible.
  zh: 现在，所谓的政治，部分是许多主教试图不疏远太多人的努力，而是寻求尽可能多的共识。
- start: 3150.214
  end: 3166.299
  speaker: unknown
  en: Because think about it, if you're going to be defining the boundaries of Orthodox or correct theology, you really want to define those boundaries as widely as possible  Why did you constand it so that you don't alienate too many people?
  zh: 因为想一想，如果你要定义正统或正确神学的边界，你真的想尽可能广泛地定义这些边界，为什么你要这样做，以免疏远太多人？
- start: 3166.299
  end: 3173.621
  speaker: unknown
  en: Because if you define the boundaries too narrowly, you won't get a majority to vote for it at the council, right?
  zh: 因为如果你定义的边界太狭窄，你就不会在会议上获得多数票，对吧？
- start: 3177.127
  end: 3193.698
  speaker: unknown
  en: The vibe at the Council was to draw those boundaries a little wider to try and bring in some of these people who maybe used to be Aryans or were semi-Aryans and get them on board with Nicene's theology.
  zh: 会议的氛围是将这些边界画得更宽一些，试图吸引一些曾经是亚略派或半亚略派的人，让他们接受尼西亚神学。
- start: 3195.851
  end: 3197.852
  speaker: unknown
  en: Not in the sense of compromise.
  zh: 不是妥协的意义。
- start: 3197.852
  end: 3207.695
  speaker: unknown
  en: It's not that orthodoxy can be compromised in that sense, because the understanding is that there are right answers and there are wrong answers.
  zh: 不是说正统可以在那个意义上妥协，因为理解是有正确答案和错误答案。
- start: 3207.695
  end: 3221.525
  speaker: unknown
  en: It's not like if I say,  2 plus 2 is 6. You say 2 plus 2 is 4. It's not as though we can agree on 5 and I'll be happy with that because that's not how it works.
  zh: 这不像我说2加2等于6，你说2加2等于4，我们可以同意5，我会对此感到满意，因为事情不是那样运作的。
- start: 3221.525
  end: 3222.646
  speaker: unknown
  en: There's still a right answer.
  zh: 仍然有一个正确答案。
- start: 3222.646
  end: 3224.487
  speaker: unknown
  en: So it's not about compromise.
  zh: 所以这不是妥协的问题。
- start: 3224.487
  end: 3226.388
  speaker: unknown
  en: It's about saying less.
  zh: 这是关于少说。
- start: 3226.963
  end: 3228.484
  speaker: unknown
  en: To include more.
  zh: 以包含更多。
- start: 3228.804
  end: 3235.509
  speaker: unknown
  en: It's about saying as little as you have to, to get the job done, that you include as many people as possible.
  zh: 这是关于尽量少说，以完成工作，尽可能多地包括人。
- start: 3236.13
  end: 3241.513
  speaker: unknown
  en: And so that you don't alienate the semi-Aryans whom they hoped would get on board.
  zh: 这样你就不会疏远他们希望加入的半亚略派。
- start: 3241.513
  end: 3242.354
  speaker: unknown
  en: Yeah, question here.
  zh: 是的，这里有问题。
- start: 3242.354
  end: 3248.098
  speaker: unknown
  en: Yeah, realistically, like, how many Aryans and semi-Aryans would have been at this council?
  zh: 是的，实际上，有多少亚略派和半亚略派会出席这次会议？
- start: 3248.098
  end: 3248.819
  speaker: unknown
  en: Ah, good question.
  zh: 啊，好问题。
- start: 3248.819
  end: 3250.64
  speaker: unknown
  en: How many are we talking about?
  zh: 我们在谈论多少人？
- start: 3250.64
  end: 3252.781
  speaker: unknown
  en: I don't offhand know the answer to that.
  zh: 我不知道这个问题的答案。
- start: 3252.781
  end: 3253.341
  speaker: unknown
  en: But...
  zh: 但是……
- start: 3256.046
  end: 3266.148
  speaker: unknown
  en: Again, it's not as though they went into the council  I'm absolutely sure of a victory for Nicene Orthodoxy.
  zh: 再一次，这并不是说他们进入会议时绝对确定尼西亚正统会胜利。
- start: 3266.148
  end: 3277.693
  speaker: unknown
  en: Because I think there's a sense that if they just came back to the council with the creed from Nicaea, slapped it on the table and said, well, sign up, that might not have worked.
  zh: 因为我认为，如果他们只是带着尼西亚的信经回到会议上，把它拍在桌子上说，好吧，签字，那可能行不通。
- start: 3277.713
  end: 3292.24
  speaker: unknown
  en: And in fact, you remember when we were talking about the creed, that in the original creed of Nicaea, there were two instances of Ussia language, two spots that had that essence language,  And when you look at the creeds after Constantinople, one of them is gone.
  zh: 事实上，你记得当我们谈论信经时，在尼西亚的原始信经中，有两处使用了本质语言，当你看君士坦丁堡之后的信经时，其中一个消失了。
- start: 3292.62
  end: 3300.143
  speaker: unknown
  en: So there, you know, a concession is made to the semi-Arians.
  zh: 所以，你知道，向半亚略派做出了让步。
- start: 3300.143
  end: 3301.944
  speaker: unknown
  en: I have to look up the actual numbers.
  zh: 我必须查一下实际数字。
- start: 3301.944
  end: 3306.726
  speaker: unknown
  en: Theodosius who's against Arianism and Gregory who's against Arianism.
  zh: 狄奥多西反对亚略主义，格雷戈里也反对亚略主义。
- start: 3308.407
  end: 3312.99
  speaker: unknown
  en: If they're in charge of this council, it would be easier for them just to not invite the Aryans.
  zh: 如果他们负责这个会议，不邀请亚略派会更容易。
- start: 3313.251
  end: 3315.352
  speaker: unknown
  en: Ah, I see.
  zh: 啊，我明白了。
- start: 3315.352
  end: 3316.373
  speaker: unknown
  en: That would be fair.
  zh: 那样是公平的。
- start: 3316.373
  end: 3320.676
  speaker: unknown
  en: Then it wouldn't be ecumenical.
  zh: 那样就不是大公会议了。
- start: 3320.676
  end: 3322.157
  speaker: unknown
  en: It wouldn't be an ecumenical council.
  zh: 那就不会是大公会议。
- start: 3322.157
  end: 3323.458
  speaker: unknown
  en: You have to invite everybody.
  zh: 你必须邀请所有人。
- start: 3323.458
  end: 3325.64
  speaker: unknown
  en: Now, the problem becomes...
  zh: 现在，问题变成了……
- start: 3327.013
  end: 3333.219
  speaker: unknown
  en: With the first two ecumenical councils, we don't have a lot of good records in terms of who was there and who wasn't there.
  zh: 对于前两次大公会议，我们没有很多关于谁在场和谁不在场的好记录。
- start: 3333.219
  end: 3341.568
  speaker: unknown
  en: So like with Nicaea, for example, depending on who you read, some say there were over 300 bishops there, some say there were 200 and something.
  zh: 例如，尼西亚会议，根据你读的资料，有些人说有300多位主教在场，有些人说有200多位。
- start: 3341.908
  end: 3378.208
  speaker: unknown
  en: If Gregory of Nazianzus had had his way,  The Creed would have proclaimed the Holy Spirit also homousios with the Father and Son, but you'll notice it doesn't do that.
  zh: 如果纳齐安祖的格雷戈里得逞，信经会宣布圣灵与圣父和圣子同质，但你会注意到它没有这样做。
- start: 3378.919
  end: 3383.68
  speaker: unknown
  en: The Son is homousios with the Father, but it doesn't use that word of the Holy Spirit.
  zh: 圣子与圣父同质，但它没有用这个词来形容圣灵。
- start: 3384.94
  end: 3395.183
  speaker: unknown
  en: In fact, Gregory of Nazianzus, as I hinted earlier, criticized Basil for not going farther in talking about the consubstantiality of the Spirit.
  zh: 事实上，正如我之前暗示的那样，纳齐安祖的格雷戈里批评巴西尔没有进一步谈论圣灵的同一本质。
- start: 3395.183
  end: 3405.845
  speaker: unknown
  en: So when you read the theological orations, you'll see that Nazianzus goes the farthest of the three of them in terms of explicitly talking about the divinity of the Holy Spirit.
  zh: 所以当你阅读神学演讲时，你会看到纳齐安祖在明确谈论圣灵的神性方面走得最远。
- start: 3407.321
  end: 3428.636
  speaker: unknown
  en: But, the creed itself, the bishops' self could not go any farther than it did, it couldn't say any more on the spirit than it did because they were afraid of alienating the homoiousians, or whomever, and so they took out that phrase from the ousia of the Father, from the essence of the Father.
  zh: 但是，信经本身，主教们不能走得更远，不能在圣灵上说得更多，因为他们害怕疏远同质派或其他人，所以他们从圣父的本质中删除了那个短语。
- start: 3431.098
  end: 3446.346
  speaker: unknown
  en: Gregory resigned over this kind of stuff, and went back to his home to be Bishop of Nazianzus again, and in the end the Creed does not go so far as to say that the Holy Spirit is consubstantial, or homousios, with the Father and Son.
  zh: 格雷戈里因这些事情辞职，回到家乡再次成为纳齐安祖的主教，最终信经没有说圣灵与圣父和圣子同质或同一本质。
- start: 3447.147
  end: 3490.874
  speaker: unknown
  en: So, he quit, turned in his resignation as both Chair of the Council and Bishop of Constantinople, went back to be Bishop of Nazianzus, and  When you read the Fifth Theological Oration on the Holy Spirit, notice also that there's another argument that pops up, that some people were apparently saying that the Holy Spirit  is not a substance, but is an accident.
  zh: 所以，他辞职了，辞去了会议主席和君士坦丁堡主教的职务，回去做纳齐安祖的主教，当你阅读《第五神学演讲》关于圣灵的部分时，还要注意另一个论点，有些人显然在说圣灵不是本质，而是偶然的。
- start: 3490.874
  end: 3495.456
  speaker: unknown
  en: Do you know what I mean by an accident, philosophically?
  zh: 你知道我在哲学上说的偶然是什么意思吗？
- start: 3495.456
  end: 3501.138
  speaker: unknown
  en: I don't mean that it was a mistake or that something suddenly and unexpectedly happened.
  zh: 我不是说这是一个错误或突然发生了什么意外的事情。
- start: 3501.138
  end: 3506.6
  speaker: unknown
  en: An accident is something that is sort of tangential to the essence.
  zh: 偶然是指与本质有点关系的东西。
- start: 3508.58
  end: 3510.082
  speaker: unknown
  en: I'm trying to think of a good example.
  zh: 我在试图想一个好的例子。
- start: 3510.082
  end: 3516.227
  speaker: unknown
  en: But I am a human being, so my humanity is essential to who I am.
  zh: 但我是一个人，所以我的人性对我是至关重要的。
- start: 3516.227
  end: 3520.95
  speaker: unknown
  en: The fact that I'm wearing a red striped shirt is not essential to who I am.
  zh: 我穿着红色条纹衬衫的事实对我来说并不重要。
- start: 3520.95
  end: 3523.372
  speaker: unknown
  en: It is accidental to who I am.
  zh: 这对我来说是偶然的。
- start: 3523.372
  end: 3524.533
  speaker: unknown
  en: So it's an accident.
  zh: 所以这是一个偶然。
- start: 3524.533
  end: 3532.7
  speaker: unknown
  en: Now what that might mean for the Trinity is that some people seem to be arguing that the Holy Spirit is not of the same substance as the Father and Son.
  zh: 现在，这对三位一体可能意味着，有些人似乎在争论圣灵与圣父和圣子不是同一本质。
- start: 3532.7
  end: 3542.464
  speaker: unknown
  en: but is an accident, is accidental to the Trinity, as in maybe the Holy Spirit is an energy of the Father and Son.
  zh: 而是偶然的，是三位一体的偶然，就像圣灵可能是圣父和圣子的能量。
- start: 3542.744
  end: 3553.388
  speaker: unknown
  en: Or in some cases, even the analogy that the Holy Spirit could be the love that's shared by the Father and Son makes the Holy Spirit sound accidental to the Trinity.
  zh: 或者在某些情况下，甚至圣灵可能是圣父和圣子之间共享的爱的类比，使圣灵听起来像是三位一体的偶然。
- start: 3555.033
  end: 3571.665
  speaker: unknown
  en: And so, you will also notice in the theological oration that he's arguing against that too, that the Holy Spirit is not accidental to the Trinity, but that the Holy Spirit is substance and is consubstantial with the Father and Son.
  zh: 所以，你还会注意到在神学演讲中，他也在反对这一点，即圣灵不是三位一体的偶然，而是本质，并且与圣父和圣子同一本质。
- start: 3573.127
  end: 3577.47
  speaker: unknown
  en: Okay, now, any questions about Gregory of Nazianzus?
  zh: 好的，现在，有关于纳齐安祖的格雷戈里的问题吗？
- start: 3577.47
  end: 3583.434
  speaker: unknown
  en: Alright, let me just say a couple more things and then we'll be ready to take a break.
  zh: 好的，让我再说几句话，然后我们准备休息一下。
- start: 3583.829
  end: 3595.715
  speaker: unknown
  en: Alright, so we talked about the idea of divine simplicity and how divine simplicity naturally leads to inseparable operation.
  zh: 好的，我们谈到了神圣单纯性的概念，以及神圣单纯性如何自然地导致不可分割的运作。
- start: 3595.715
  end: 3604.559
  speaker: unknown
  en: In other words, if God is simplex, then the three persons of God can't be off doing separate things, but must be working together.
  zh: 换句话说，如果神是单一的，那么神的三个位格不能各自做不同的事情，而必须一起工作。
- start: 3606.84
  end: 3613.203
  speaker: unknown
  en: So divine simplicity sort of logically leads to inseparable operation.
  zh: 所以神圣单纯性在逻辑上导致不可分割的运作。
- start: 3613.98
  end: 3618.403
  speaker: unknown
  en: Inseparable operation logically leads to appropriation.
  zh: 不可分割的运作在逻辑上导致归属。
- start: 3618.863
  end: 3625.347
  speaker: unknown
  en: And all of this logically leads to a concept called perichoresis.
  zh: 所有这些在逻辑上导致一个叫做互渗的概念。
- start: 3627.008
  end: 3628.009
  speaker: unknown
  en: Put it up here.
  zh: 把它写在这里。
- start: 3633.332
  end: 3634.213
  speaker: unknown
  en: Perichoresis.
  zh: 互渗。
