好的，感谢你们回来，上节课我们谈到了尼西亚会议。 Alright, thanks for coming back, and in our last hour we talked about the Council of Nicaea.
现在这一节课我们要谈论尼西亚信经、君士坦丁堡会议，以及最终称为尼西亚信经的信经。 And now in this hour we're going to talk about the Creed of Nicaea, and the Council of Constantinople, and then the Creed that we've finally come to call the Nicene Creed.
所以，如果你们还没有的话，应该在你们面前有一份讲义，上 面有三栏，分别是优西比乌信经、尼西亚信经和尼西亚信经。 So, if you don't already, you should have in front of you the handout that has three columns, the Creed of Eusebius, the Creed of Nicaea, and then the Nicene Creed.
我没有在第三栏称它为尼西亚君士坦丁堡信经的唯一原因是因为这个名字太长，放不下。 And the only reason I didn't call it the Nicene Constantinopolitan Creed in that third column is because that wouldn't all fit at the top.
所以，这一节课我们要看看信经的发展。 So, in this hour we're going to look at the development of the Creed.
我们所称的尼西亚信经实际上是尼西亚君士坦丁堡信经。 What we call the Nicene Creed is really the Nicene Constantinopolitan Creed.
它始于325年的第一次尼西亚大公会议，并在381年的第二次君士坦丁堡大 公会议上完成。正如我所说，你们都应该知道这个日期，325年尼西亚会议。 It was begun at the First Ecumenical Council of Nicaea in 325. And it was finished at the Second Ecumenical Council of Constantinople in 381. And as I said, you should all know the date, 325 for the Council of Nicaea.
你们也应该知道381年第二次君士坦丁堡大公会议的日期。 You should also know the date of 381 for the Second Ecumenical Council of Constantinople.
再次强调，我不期望你们记住很多日期，但这些日期是每个人都应该知道 的，不论他们是否在意。我想先看一下优西比乌信经，讲义上的第一栏。 Again, I don't expect you to memorize a lot of dates, but these are dates that everyone should know whether they care or not I want to begin by looking at the Creed of Eusebius, the first column on the handout.
这是优西比乌从凯撒利亚带到尼西亚的信经，为 了证明他是正统的，或者至少是足够正统的。 This is the one that Eusebius of Caesarea brought with him to Nicaea in order to clear his own name, to show that he was Orthodox, or at least Orthodox enough.
正如我提到的，这个信经中没有什么令人反感的内容，所以他被宣布为正统。 And as I mentioned, there is nothing objectionable in this creed, and so he was declared to be Orthodox.
但这个信经并不够具体，无法深入涉及争议领域的问题。 But the Creed is not really specific enough to get into the issues surrounding the area of controversy.
例如，它没有说圣子是永恒存在的，或永恒生成的，或关于本质或实质的任何内容。 So, for example, it does not say that the Son is eternally preexistent, or eternally generated, or anything about substance or essence.
所以让我们来看一下，如果你们允许，我会继续读下去。 So let's just take a look at that, and if you'll indulge me, I'll go ahead and read it.
我们信独一的神，全能的圣父，创造万物，无论有形无形。 We believe in one God, the Father Almighty, maker of all things, both visible and invisible.
并信独一的主耶稣基督，神的道，从神而生，光从光，生命从生命，独生子，万物之 首，在万世之前从圣父而生，万物借着他造，为了我们的救恩成了肉身，住在世人中 间，受难，第三天复活，升天到圣父那里，将来要在荣耀中再来审判活人和死人。 And in one Lord Jesus Christ, the Word of God, God from God, Light from Light, Life from Life, the only begotten Son, the firstborn of all creation, begotten of the Father before all ages, through whom also all things were made, who for our salvation was made flesh, and lived among men, and suffered, and rose again the third day, and ascended to the Father, and shall come again in glory to judge the living and dead.
并信圣灵。 And in the Holy Spirit.
所以你们看，我们有了什么。 So you see what we've got there.
我们有了三点纲要。 We've got our three-point outline.
我们有一些关于圣父的内容。 We've got a little bit on the Father.
我们有更多关于圣子的内容。 We've got more on the Son.
我们知道有圣灵。 And we know there is a Holy Spirit.
对吗？ Right?
所以现在大概就是这些。 So that's about it right now.
让我先说清楚，是的，我知道这些信经会用“人”这个词来表示包容的意义。 And let me just say up front, yes, I know that these creeds are going to use the word men in the inclusive sense.
请忍耐一下。 Just bear with me.
它确实是指人类。 It does mean humans.
好的。 Okay.
所以……我想让你们注意优西比乌信经的这一点。 So... What I want you to notice about the Creed of Eusebius is this.
注意耶稣基督被称为神的道。 Notice that Jesus Christ is called the Word of God.
我用蓝色标出了其中一些内容。 I highlighted some of these things in blue there.
这显然是圣经中的内容，来自约翰福音第一章，但注意他没有被称为神的儿子。 This is certainly biblical, obviously, from the first chapter of John, but notice that he's not called the Son of God.
记住，对于收养主义者来说，圣子只有在受洗后才是圣子，而不是之前。 And remember that for adoptionists, the Son is only the Son after his baptism, not before.
所以他在任何永恒的意义上都不是神的儿子。 So he's not the Son of God in any eternal sense.
所以在这里他甚至没有被称为神的儿子。 And so here he's not even called the Son of God.
还要注意《歌罗西书》1:15的引用，他被描述为万物之首。 Also notice the quotation from Colossians 1.15. He's described as the firstborn of all creation.
显然，这也是圣经中的内容，但它太容易被亚略主义解释。 Obviously, this is also biblical, but it's too open to an Arian interpretation.
万物之首，亚略主义者会解释为他是第一个被造的存在。 The firstborn of all creation, the Arians would interpret that as meaning that he was the first created being.
所以，你可以看到这将走向何方，但这必须去掉，因为它不明确。 So, you can see where this is going, but that's going to have to go, because it's unclear.
现在，这个信经确实说他在万世之前从圣父而生。 Now, this Creed does say that he was begotten of the Father before all ages.
但这并不一定意味着他是永恒生成的。 But that does not necessarily mean he is eternally begotten or eternally generated.
所以这句话可以被解释为他只是比其他受造物更早被造，在时间本身之前。 And so that phrase could be interpreted as if it's saying he was simply created before the rest of creation, before time itself.
但这不一定意味着他与圣父同为永恒或永恒生成。 But it would not necessarily have to be taken as that he is co-eternal with the Father or eternally generated.
注意这句话，成了肉身。 Notice the phrase, was made flesh.
再次强调，非常符合圣经。 Again, very biblical.
道成了肉身。 The word became flesh.
约翰福音第一章也是如此。 John chapter 1 also.
然而，很快仅仅说他成了肉身将不再足够。 However, it will soon not be good enough to say that he was made flesh.
因为使用“肉身”这个词为我们稍后谈论阿波里纳里时要讨论的内容留下了空间。 Because the use of the word flesh there leaves the door open for something that we're going to look at later when we talk about Apollinarius.
但它为一种不完全人性的基督论留下了空间。 But it leaves the door open for a Christology that has less than full humanity.
换句话说，想象一下，如果我说耶稣是一个灵性存在，只是穿上了一件肉身的外衣。 In other words, imagine if I said that Jesus was a spiritual being who just sort of put on a suit of flesh.
但无论出于何种原因，他并不是真正完全的人，我们稍后会谈到这一点。 but wasn't really fully human for whatever reason, and we'll talk about that later.
所以，仅仅说他成了肉身是不够的。 So, it's not going to be enough to say that he took on flesh.
再次强调，这符合圣经，但这不够，因为它可能为一种不完全人性的基督论留下空间。 Again, that is biblical, but it's not going to be enough because it could leave the door open for a Christology that had less than a full humanity.
所以，最终我们必须说他不仅成了肉身，而是成了人，完全的人。 So, eventually we're going to have to say not just flesh, but that he was made human, as in fully human.
现在，文本中会说他成了人，但这里的人是指人类，完全 的人，而不仅仅是成了肉身或穿上了一件肉身的外衣。 Now, in the text, it's going to say he was made man, But man there means human, fully human as opposed to simply made flesh or put on a suit of flesh.
总之，这就是优西比乌的信经。 So anyway, that's the creed of Eusebius.
这是优西比乌从凯撒利亚带到尼西亚会议的信经，也是让他脱身的信经。 That's the creed that Eusebius of Caesarea brought with him to the council of Nicaea, and it's the creed that got him off the hook.
这是会议将用作模板的信经，但它本身并不够好，对吗？ And it's the creed that the council will use as a template, but by itself it's not going to be good enough, right?
所以现在我们要看看尼西亚信经。 So now we're going to look at the Creed of Nicaea.
现在记住，这不是我们所知的尼西亚信经。 Now remember, this is not the Nicene Creed as we know it.
那还在后面。 That's coming.
这只是尼西亚信经。 This is simply the Creed of Nicaea.
这是325年写的信经，就是讲义中间那栏。 This is the Creed as it was written in 325. That's the middle column on the handout.
所以这只是信经向尼西亚信经的发展。 So this is just the development of the Creed to the Nicene.
是的，基本上尼西亚会议采用了优西比乌的信经， 并说这是一个好的开始，但我们必须调整一下。 Yeah, so basically the Council of Nicaea took the Creed of Eusebius and said this is a good start, but we've got to tweak this.
我们必须添加一些内容，使其更具体，以真正驳斥亚略主义。 We've got to add to it to make it more specific to really refute Arianism.
因为优西比乌的信经并没有驳斥亚略主义。 Because as it was, the Creed of Eusebius does not refute Arianism.
而且说实话，优西比乌本人倾向于那个方向，所以他为什么要驳斥呢？ And let's face it, Eusebius himself leaned in that direction, so why would he?
所以我们必须添加一些内容。 So we're going to have to add to this.
好吧？ Alright?
所以，优西比乌的信经是模板或起点，但在325年的尼西亚会议上被主教 们修改了。所以尼西亚信经是325年的信经。让我们看看，我会读一下。 So, Eusebius' Creed was the template or the starting point, but it was modified by the bishops at the Council of Nicaea in 325. So the Creed of Nicaea is the Creed of 325. So let's take a look at that, and I'll read through that.
我们信独一的神，全能的圣父，创造万物，无论有形无形。 We believe in one God, the Father Almighty, maker of all things, visible and invisible.
到目前为止没有太大不同。 Not too much different so far.
并信独一的主耶稣基督，独生于圣父，即圣父的本质，从神而生， 光从光，真神从真神而生，非受造，与圣父同质，万物借着他造， 无论在天上或地上，为了我们的救恩降世，成了肉身，成了人。 And in one Lord, Jesus Christ, the only begotten of the Father, That is, of the essence of the Father, God from God, light from light, true God from true God, begotten, not made, of the same substance with the Father, through whom all things were made, both in heaven and on earth, who for us men in our salvation descended, was incarnate, and was made man.
但等等，还有更多。 But wait, there's more.
那些说他曾经不存在的，说他在被生之前不存在的，说他是从无中被 造的，或坚持他是另一种本质的，换句话说，尼西亚信经以第四段诅 咒结束，实际上是在说，如果你相信这些东西，就会受到诅咒。 Those who say there was a time when he was not, and he was not before he was begotten, and that he was made out of nothing, or who maintain that he is of another hypostasis, So in other words, the Creed of Nicaea ends with a fourth paragraph of anathemas in effect saying, A curse on you if you believe any of this stuff.
所以如果你没有从信经的主体部分得到反亚略主义的论点，这里以另一种方式陈述。 So if you didn't get the anti-Aryan argument from the main body of the Creed, here it is stated another way.
所以让我们看看尼西亚信经的细节。 So let's look at the details of the Creed of Nicaea.
首先要注意的是，万物之首被去掉了，因为再次强调，这太容易被解释为不变的解释。 First thing to notice, firstborn of all creation is removed, because again, that is too open to invariant interpretation.
添加的是“非受造”这句话。 What's added is the phrase, not made.
独生，非受造。 Begotten, not made.
因为记住，亚略争议中的一个争论点是，独生是什么意思？ Because remember, one of the points of debate in the Arian controversy was, what does begotten mean?
对于亚略主义者来说，独生意味着被造。 For the Arians, begotten means created.
对于正统派，尼西亚派，我们称正统派为尼西亚派，尼西亚党。 For the Orthodox, the Nicenes, we'll call the Orthodox the Nicenes, the Nicene party.
对于尼西亚派来说，独生意味着生成，但不是被造。 For the Nicenes, begotten means generated, but not created.
所以，在这里我们添加了“独生，非受造”这句话。 And so, here we add the phrase begotten, not made.
还要注意本质语言的添加，这实际上在这个版本的信经中出现了两次。 Also, notice the addition of the essence language, and it actually occurs twice in this version of the creed.
首先，它说，在圣父的独生之后，即圣父的本质。 First, it says, after the only begotten of the Father, that is, of the essence of the Father.
我把希腊文放在这里。 And I put the Greek in there.
然后当然，后来出现了“同质”这个词，与圣父同质或同本质。 And then later, of course, the word homoousios, of the same substance or of the same essence with the Father.
所以你们看到这里有本质的语言，强调圣父与圣子的 合一不仅仅是意志的合作，而是在本质层面的合一。 So you've got that essence language in there to emphasize that the unity of Father and Son is not simply a unity of cooperating wills, but it is a unity on the level of substance.
这是本体论上的合一。 It is an ontological unity.
所以“同质”这个词就是“同本质”。 And so of the same substance is that word homoousios.
还要注意“降世”这个词被添加了，强调降世基督论。 Notice also the word descended is added there to emphasize the Christology of descent.
基督不是一个成了神的人，而是一个成了人的神。 Christ is not a man who became a god, but a god who became human.
现在还要注意，“成了肉身”现在改为“成了人”。 Now, also notice, was made flesh is now changed to was made man.
再次强调，这里的“人”是指人类，强调耶稣基督的完全人性。 And again, man there means human, to emphasize the full humanity of Jesus Christ.
所以，仅仅说他是肉身是不够的，因为这可能会被解释为不完全的人性。 So, it's not enough to say that he's flesh because that could leave too much possibility to interpret that as something less than fully human.
现在注意到这一段，我应该在“段落”周围加上引号，关于圣灵的段落仍然只有一句话。 Now, notice that the paragraph, and I should put air quotes around paragraph, the paragraph on the Holy Spirit is still just the one line.
所以，在尼西亚会议之后，我们仍然没有一个完整的圣灵论。 So, after the Council of Nicaea, we still don't have a full-fledged pneumatology here.
我们知道有圣灵。 We know that there is a Holy Spirit.
最后，诅咒部分，再次特别针对亚略主义。所以在圣灵之 前，他们只是说，它在那里，我们只是不知道它是什么。 And then finally, the anathemas, again, designed specifically to address Arianism and to So this whole, before the Holy Spirit, they're just like saying, it's there, we just don't know what it is.
是的，你知道，问题不在于他们会说我们不知道圣灵是什么，因为我 们有特土良和诺瓦提安已经在西方写了关于圣灵的文章，还有东方的 其他人，所以他们对圣灵了解更多，只是还没有成为争论的问题。 Yeah, you know, the thing is, it's not that, I don't think they would go so far as to say we don't know what the Holy Spirit is, because we have Fertullian and Novation who have already written on the Holy Spirit in the West, and others in the East, so they know more about the Holy Spirit It's just not the issue of debate yet.
现在，在尼西亚会议和君士坦丁堡会议之间，这绝对会成为争论的问题。 Now, between the Council of Nicaea and the Council of Constantinople, it absolutely will be the issue of debate.
所以那时我们必须在信经中添加更多内容以澄清一些事情。 And so that's when we have to add more to the creed to clarify some things.
这个问题还没有真正被提出。 The question hasn't really been pressed yet.
在我们继续之前，有没有关于325年会议的其他问题？ Any other questions about the Council of 325 yet before we go on?
在尼西亚会议之后，有一场对立的小型会议的网球比赛。 After the Council of Nicaea, there was a tennis match of opposing smaller councils.
记住，我今晚开始这整个话题时说过，当你有对立的会议时，你会怎么做？ And remember, I started this whole thing tonight by saying, you know, what do you do when you have opposing councils?
你会有一个大的超级会议，对吧，应该是一个全球性的会议，应该凌驾于所有会议之上。 You have one big uber-council, right, that's supposed to be a worldwide council that's supposed to override all of them.
你会认为那会奏效，但实际上并没有，因为在尼西亚会议之后 ，有一系列较小的地区性会议。根据谁在控制，哪个主教团体 在控制，他们要么试图取消尼西亚会议的决定，要么加强它。 And you'd think that would have worked, but it really didn't, because after the Council of Nicaea, you have a series of smaller regional councils Depending on who is in control, what group of bishops is in control, they either try to cancel out what Nicaea did or reinforce it.
所以在327年，你有安提阿和尼科曼尼亚的会议，由 亚略派主教主持，确认他们对亚略及其追随者的支持。 So in 327, you have synods in Antioch and in Nicomania that are presided over by Arian bishops and that affirm their support for Arius and his followers.
事实上，他们试图罢免支持尼西亚的主教，并用亚略派主教取而代之。 And in fact, they try to depose the pro-Nicene bishops and replace them with Arian bishops.
这将在整个东方发生，每当亚略派或尼西亚派主教掌权 时，他们都会试图让他们的朋友进入其他权力职位。 And this is going to happen throughout the East, where any time either an Arian or a Nicene bishop gains power, they're going to try to get their friends into other positions of authority.
所以，安提阿和尼科美底亚的会议支持亚略及其 追随者，并试图让亚略派主教进入权力职位。 So, the synods in Antioch and Nicomedia are supporting Arius and his followers and are trying to get Arian bishops into positions of power.
亚略本人向皇帝君士坦丁上诉，并同意接受“同质”这个词，再次 强调，可能认为他可以以某种方式解释它，不会迫使他改变信仰。 And Arius himself appealed to the Emperor Constantine and agreed to accept the word homoousios, again, probably thinking that he could interpret it in some way that wouldn't force him to change his beliefs.
但君士坦丁说，好吧。 But Constantine said, okay.
皇帝君士坦丁告诉亚历山大的亚历山大主教继续接纳亚略参加圣餐，但亚历山大拒绝了。 And Constantine, the emperor, told Bishop Alexander of Alexandria to go ahead and readmit Arius to communion, and Alexander refused.
君士坦丁命令他这样做，但亚历山大仍然拒绝。 Constantine ordered him to do it, and Alexander still refused.
亚略再次向君士坦丁抱怨，并威胁要分裂，威胁要另立 教会，这让君士坦丁生气了，因为记住君士坦丁是谁。 Arius complained again to Constantine and threatened A schism threatened to go off and start his own church and got Constantine mad at him because remember who Constantine is.
你可以站在他的一边，直到你威胁到统一。 You can be on his good side until you threaten unity.
然后他就会对你生气。 Then he's going to be mad at you.
在328年，我相信君士坦丁展示了他的真正神学立场，因为 此时，一直是他得力助手的科尔多瓦的奥修斯，现在出局了。 In 328, I believe Constantine shows his true theological colors because at this point, The bishop who's been his right-hand man all along, Osius of Cordova, is now out.
取代他的是，猜猜是谁，尼科美底亚的优西比乌。 And replacing him is, guess who, Eusebius of Nicomedia.
所以尼科美底亚的优西比乌，一个亚略派主教，不久前，君士坦 丁告诉尼科美底亚教会找一个新主教，因为他不按规矩办事。 So Eusebius of Nicomedia, an Arian bishop, who just a little while ago, Constantine told the church of Nicomedia to get themselves a new bishop, because he wasn't playing by the rules.
现在尼科美底亚的优西比乌成为君士坦丁最亲近的顾问。 Now Eusebius of Nicomedia becomes Constantine's closest advisor.
在此之后，被流放的亚略派主教被允许返回他们的教区，重新担任主教职务。 And after this, the exiled Arian bishops are allowed to return to their sees and regain their office as bishop.
同样在328年，亚历山大的亚历山大去世，亚他拿修继任，成为下任亚历山大主教。 Also in 328, Alexander of Alexandria died and Athanasius succeeded him, became the next Bishop of Alexandria.
所以现在我们有亚历山大的亚他拿修主教，你们知道他将 在他的著作中成为支持尼西亚或正统阵营的主要倡导者。 So now we have Bishop Athanasius of Alexandria, who as you know is going to become the major proponent of the pro-Nicene or the Orthodox camp here in his writings.
亚略竟然有胆量向君士坦丁抱怨亚他拿修成为下任亚历山大主教， 所以君士坦丁再次生气，这次君士坦丁下令烧毁亚略的所有著作。 Arius has the nerve to complain to Constantine about Athanasius becoming the next Bishop of Alexandria, and so Constantine got mad at him again, and this time Constantine ordered that all of Arius' writings should be burned.
所以注意，这不仅仅是会议的结果，也不仅仅是亚略被宣布为异端的结果。 So notice, that didn't happen simply as a result of the council, simply as a result of Arius being declared heretic.
他的著作被下令烧毁是因为他不断惹恼皇帝。 His writings were ordered to be burned because he kept annoying the emperor.
但这也意味着尼科美底亚的优西比乌和其他亚略派主教现在要对付亚他拿修。 But that also meant that Eusebius of Nicomedia and the other Arian bishops are now out to get Athanasius.
他们要罢免他，把他从职位上赶走。 They're out to get him deposed and removed from his seat.
在335年，耶路撒冷召开了一次会议，重新接纳了亚略。 In 335, a synod was held in Jerusalem that readmitted Arius.
亚略派指控亚他拿修各种罪行，敲诈、谋杀、叛国 ，当然这些都不是真的，但他被赶出了亚历山大。 The Arians accused Athanasius of various crimes, extortion, murder, treason, all of this was not true of course, but he was thrown out of Alexandria.
在他去世之前，他在这段时间内被赶出亚历山大并重新安装在亚历山大教区五次。 And over the course of the time, until his death, he would be kicked out of Alexandria and reinstalled in the Sea of Alexandria five times.
当他被赶出亚历山大并由一位亚略派主教取代时，亚历山大 的好人们陷入疯狂，愤怒的暴民杀死了那位亚略派主教。 When he was kicked out of Alexandria and an Arian bishop was installed in his place, the good people of Alexandria rose up into a frenzy and an angry mob killed the Arian bishop.
所以亚他拿修进进出出大约五次。 So Athanasius is in and out like five times.
当他被赶出时，你认为他会去找谁寻求支持？ When he's out, who do you think he goes to for support?
罗马的主教，当时的朱利叶斯主教。 The Bishop of Rome, Bishop Julius at this time.
所以注意这里发生了什么。 So notice what's happening here.
当支持尼西亚或正统的亚历山大主教被亚略派赶出他的城市，无法回去时，他会去哪里？ When the pro-Nicene, or the Orthodox bishop of Alexandria is thrown out of his city by the Arians and can't go back, where does he go?
他去罗马。 He goes to Rome.
我会给你们一个结论，那就是我们知道谁会赢，对吧？ And I'll just sort of give you the bottom line here, and that is that we know who's going to win, right?
我们知道尼西亚派，正统派，最终会胜出。 We know that the Nicene party, the Orthodox party, is going to eventually come out on top.
这是罗马支持的派别，这是支持罗马的派别，罗马再次站在胜利的一边。 this is the party that Rome sided with, this is the party that sided with Rome, and once again, Rome is on the winning side.
事实上，这成为了一种模式。 In fact, that becomes a pattern.
君士坦丁于337年去世。现在，君士坦丁在去世前有一件事必须做。 Constantine died in 337. Now, Constantine has one thing he's got to do before he dies.
有人记得那是什么吗？ Anyone remember what that is?
受洗，没错。 Get baptized, exactly.
你认为是谁给君士坦丁施洗的？ So who do you think baptized Constantine?
尼科美底亚的优西比乌，亚略派主教。 Eusebius of Nicomedia, the Arian bishop.
现在，我会省略很多细节，但当君士坦丁去世时，他的帝国被分 给了他的三个儿子，但最终留在了他一个儿子君士坦提乌手中。 Now, I'm going to spare you a lot of the details here, but when Constantine died, his empire was divided up among his three sons, but eventually, it remained in the hands of his one son, Constantius.
君士坦提乌，以他祖父的名字命名，对吧？ Constantius, named after his grandfather, right?
所以，君士坦提乌在338年任命尼科美底亚的优西比乌为君士坦丁堡主 教。所以记住尼西亚会议反对主教从一个教区调到另一个教区的规定吗？ So, Constantius made Eusebius of Nicomedia Bishop of Constantinople in 338. So remember that rule of Nicaea against the translation of a bishop from one seat to another?
嗯，这种情况到处都在发生。 Well, this is going on all over the place.
新皇帝君士坦提乌任命尼科美底亚的优西比乌为君士坦丁堡主教。 And the new emperor, Constantius, makes Eusebius of Nicomedia the bishop of Constantinople.
所以这也意味着一个亚略派主教在东方处于最高教会权威的位置。 And so this also means that an Arian bishop is in the position of highest ecclesiastical authority in the East.
因为记住，君士坦丁堡将成为东方的第一大都会。 Because remember, Constantinople is going to be the number one metropolitan in the East.
所以，当传教士被训练和委派出去将北欧和东欧的蛮族部 落转变为基督教时，他们将由亚略派主教训练和委派。 So then, when missionaries are trained and commissioned to go out and convert the barbarian tribes of northern and eastern Europe to Christianity, they're going to be trained and commissioned by the Arian bishops.
所以，当这些传教士去到蛮族部落时，他们会将其转变为亚略派版本的基督教。 So, when these missionaries go out to the barbarian tribes, they will convert them to an Aryan version of Christianity.
所以当这些蛮族部落进入南欧和西欧时，他们不仅是蛮族，而且还是异端。 And so that when these barbarian tribes then come into southern and western Europe, not only are they barbarian, but they're also heretics.
我们将在西欧经历一段有趣的时期，在西班牙等地 ，亚略派作为宗教少数派统治着公教会多数派。 And we are going to have an interesting span of time in western Europe where you have a sort of religious minority, Aryans, ruling over a Catholic majority in places like Spain.
所以这就是亚略主义如何向西传播，尽管它在东方已经被处理了。 And so this is how Arianism will move west, even though it's supposedly dealt with already in the east.
这很讽刺，因为在尼西亚会议上，西方来的主教 不多，因为亚略主义在西方并不是一个问题。 So it's ironic because At the Council of Nicaea, not very many Western bishops came because Arianism wasn't really an issue in the West.
所以，理论上尼西亚会议应该处理亚略主义，但亚略主义 通过亚略派主教在君士坦丁堡掌权和蛮族部落向西传播。 And so, theoretically then, the Council of Nicaea is supposed to deal with Arianism, and yet Arianism migrates West through Arian bishops gaining power in Constantinople and through the barbarian tribes.
所以我们稍后会谈到亚略主义在西方的影响时再详细讨论。 So we'll talk a little bit more about that later when we talk about the effect of Arianism in the West.
因为君士坦提乌本人甚至会在西方推广亚略主义。 Because Constantius himself will try to promote Arianism even in the West.
但正如我之前提到的，来自尼科美底亚的优西比乌等主教和皇帝的压力将突显出亚略主义 版本与其他派别之间的差异，并导致其他派别加入尼西亚派，最终帮助尼西亚派获胜。 But as I mentioned before, The pressure from bishops like Eusebius of Nicomedia and from the Emperor will highlight the differences between that version of Arianism and some of these other factions and will cause the other factions to join with the Nicenes and will eventually help the Nicene party win the day.
但记住，在这些争议中，罗马的主教站在正统派一 边，支持像亚他拿修这样的支持尼西亚的主教。 But remember that in these controversies, The bishop of Rome is siding with and supporting the Orthodox, the pro-19 bishops like Athanasius.
记住，罗马的主教声称拥有彼得座位的权威，彼得至少在传统上是该城市的第一任主教。 And remember that the bishop of Rome claims the authority of the seat of Peter, the city where Peter was at least traditionally the first bishop.
现在，当罗马的主教支持亚他拿修时，这一行为被一些东方人视为对东方的反抗行 为，因为如果他们有一些较小的东方会议将亚他拿修逐出教会或试图罢免他，亚他 拿修去西方，罗马的主教支持他，那么这被视为对这些东方会议的反抗行为。 Now, when the bishop of Rome supports Athanasius, That act is taken by some of the Easterners as an act of defiance against the East, because if they've got some of these smaller eastern synods that excommunicate or try to depose Athanasius, Athanasius goes to the West and the Bishop of Rome supports him, then that is taken as an act of defiance against these eastern synods.
但这也是罗马主教权威演变的又一步。 But it also is, again, another step on the way of the evolution of the authority of the Bishop of Rome.
我想我可能之前提到过，但值得重复的是，随着时间的推移 ，东方有五个大都会，没有一个主教能登上金字塔的顶端。 And I think I may have mentioned this before, but it's worth repeating that as time goes on, With five metropolitans in the East, there is no one bishop who rises to the top of a pyramid.
我们有一个传统，更倾向于将权威放在主教会议中，而 不是放在金字塔顶端的一个人或一个最高权威点上。 We have a tradition of putting its authority more in councils of bishops than in one person at the top of a pyramid, or one point of highest authority.
现在，不是说不会有人对会议持怀疑态度，因为这些来回的会议， 你知道，互相取消，会有人对会议能否完成任何事情持怀疑态度。 Now, not that there aren't going to be people who are skeptical of the councils, because with all these back and forth councils, you know, canceling each other out, there is going to be some skepticism about the ability of a council to accomplish anything.
但总体而言，东方教会将更多地依赖或寻求会议的权威。 But overall, the Eastern Church will place its, or will look to councils more for its authority.
而西方教会，西方教会只有两个大都会，其中一个是明确的领导者，即罗 马的主教，现在承担起支持正统主教的权威，即使这意味着反对某些东方 会议，西方将更多地依赖罗马主教作为权威金字塔顶端的那个人的权威。 Whereas the Western Church, the Western Church with only two metropolitans, one of which is the clear leader, And that being the Bishop of Rome that now takes on this authority of supporting the Orthodox bishops, even if that means opposing some Eastern synod, the West will defer more to the authority of the Bishop of Rome as that one person at the top of the authority pyramid.
嗯，我们还有几个小型会议。 Well, we've got another couple of small synods.
在341年，安提阿又召开了一次会议。 In 341, there's another synod in Antioch.
东方的主教们对罗马感到愤怒，亚略派主教占多数，所以他们写了一个亚略派版本的信经。 The Eastern bishops are angry with Rome, and the Arian bishops are in the majority there, and so they write an Arian version of the Creed.
在342年和343年，在萨丁卡城又召开了一次会议。 In 342, 343, there's another council in the city of Sardinca.
这是西方主教人数首次超过东方主教。 And this is the first time that Western bishops outnumber the Eastern bishops.
亚他拿修作为罗马主教随行人员的一部分出现。 And Athanasius shows up as part of the entourage of the Bishop of Rome.
东方的主教们拒绝坐下来，因为亚他拿修在场，他的存在对他们来说代表了 西方对东方的至高权威，罗马主教对东方大都会主教的至高权威的主张。 And the Eastern bishops refuse to even sit down at the table because Athanasius is there, and his very presence to them represented the West's claim of supremacy over the East, the Bishop of Rome's claim of supremacy over the Eastern metropolitan bishops.
所以东方的主教们有点退缩，西方的主教们几乎可以随心所欲地做任何事情。 So the eastern bishops kind of bailed and the western bishops were left to do whatever they wanted pretty much.
那个会议的决定是，罗马主教基本上是意见不合的主教的最后上诉法院。 And what that council decreed was that the bishop of Rome is basically the last court of appeals for disagreeing bishops.
所以如果你有对立的主教，或者一个主教被另一个主教罢免，被罢 免的主教可以向罗马主教上诉，罗马主教是可以做出决定的权威。 So that if you have opposing bishops, or if you have one bishop who is deposed by another, the deposed bishop can appeal to the bishop of Rome, and the bishop of Rome is the authority who can make the decision.
所以，你知道，这在亚他拿修和其他人身上也发生过。 And so, you know, this is sort of something that plays out with Athanasius and others.
显然，如果东方的主教们留在会议上，他们绝不会同意这一点，但这就是会议的决定。 And obviously the eastern bishops would never have agreed to this if they had stayed at the council, but that's what the council decreed.
现在，在接下来的几十年里，关于神的儿子耶稣基 督的问题是，圣子是否以与圣父相同的方式为神？ Now, Over the next few decades, the questions that have been asked of the Son of God, Jesus Christ, is the Son divine in the same way that the Father is?
圣子是永恒的吗？ Is the Son eternal?
敬拜圣子是否合适？ Is it appropriate to worship the Son?
所有这些关于圣子的问题现在将被问到圣灵。 All those questions that were asked of the Son will now be asked about the Holy Spirit.
所以现在的问题是，那么，圣灵呢？ So now the question is called, well, what about the Holy Spirit?
所以，由于亚略争议，关于神的儿子的同样问题现在将出现在圣灵身上。 And so the same questions that came up with regard to the Son of God, as a result of the Aryan controversy, are now going to come up with regard to the Holy Spirit.
甚至到了一些原本是亚略派或半亚略派的人转向尼西亚派的地步，其中一 些人会说，好吧，我们承认圣子的神性，但我们不能接受圣灵的神性。 And even to the point where some of the people who were originally Aryans, or semi-Aryans, who come over to the 19th side, Some of those folks are going to say something to the effect of, okay, we'll give you the divinity of the Son, but we can't buy into the divinity of the Holy Spirit.
所以他们会在那里。 So they're going to be sort of there.
现在，当我们有关于卡帕多西亚教父的讲座时，你们会 听到更多关于这方面的内容，所以我现在不会说太多。 Now you're going to hear more about this when we have a lecture on the Cappadocians, and so I'm not going to say too much about it now.
目前，只需注意卡帕多西亚教父是来自卡帕多西 亚地区的三位主教，现在的土耳其或小亚细亚。 For now, it's enough to note that the Cappadocians are three bishops, from the region of Cappadocia, in what is now Turkey or Asia Minor.
再次强调，我们不会详细讨论，因为你们稍后会听到更多关于他们的内容，但目前 ，基本上，只需注意卡帕多西亚教父是帮助东方教会回答这些关于圣灵问题的人。 And again, we're not going to go into detail because you're going to hear more about them later, but For now, basically, it's enough just to note that the Cappadocians are the ones who helped the Eastern Church answer these questions about the Holy Spirit.
他们还帮助东方教会确定了特土良术语的希腊语等价词。卡帕多西亚教父还 帮助东方教会确定了用于描述三位一体的三个位格和一个本质的希腊词汇。 And they also helped the Eastern Church settle on the Greek equivalent of Tertullian terms The Cappadocians also helped the Eastern Church settle what Greek words would be used to talk about the three persons and the one substance of the Trinity.
换句话说，如何将特土良的persona或per sonae和substantia翻译成希腊语？ So in other words, how do you translate Tertullian's persona or personae and substantia into Greek?
你将使用哪些希腊词汇来表达这些概念？ What Greek words are you going to use for those concepts?
问题在于，人们用相同的词语谈论不同的事物，用不同的词语谈论相同的事 物，所以语义问题困扰了很长时间，卡帕多西亚教父帮助解决了这些问题。 And the problem is that you have people using the same words to talk about different things, and using different words to talk about the same things, and so the semantics really got in the way for a long time, and the Cappadocians helped sort all that out.
并为下一个大公会议铺平了道路。 and paved the way for the next ecumenical council.
所以再次强调，我会把关于卡帕多西亚教父的其他细节留到以后。 And so again, I'll leave the rest of the detail on the Cappadocians for later.
但最终很明显需要另一个会议。 But eventually it became clear that another council was going to be needed.
就像尼西亚会议必须推翻早期的对立会议一样，现在我们需要另一个大公会议 ，另一个全球性的会议，推翻自尼西亚会议以来所有小型会议的反复争论。 Just like the Council of Nicaea had to override the earlier opposing councils, now we needed another ecumenical council, another worldwide council Override all of the back and forth of the smaller councils that were going on since the Council of Nicaea.
到这个时候，部分归功于卡帕多西亚教父，东方教会 准备接受325年的信经，并在圣灵方面进行扩展。 And by this time, thanks in part to the Cappadocians, the Eastern Church was ready to accept the Creed of 325 and also expand on it relative to the Holy Spirit.
所以，就像第一次大公会议是由皇帝君士坦丁召开的，第二次大公会议也是由皇帝召开的。 So, just like the First Ecumenical Council was convened by an emperor, Constantine, The Second Ecumenical Council was also convened by an emperor.
这次是我们的老朋友狄奥多西一世。还记得狄奥多西一世吗？我告诉过你们，君 士坦丁并不是那个将基督教定为唯一合法宗教或禁止所有其他异教习俗的皇帝。 This time it was our old friend Theodosius I. Now remember Theodosius I? I told you that Constantine was not really the emperor who made Christianity the only legal religion or who outlawed all other pagan practice.
那是狄奥多西。 That was Theodosius.
他就是那个做了这些事的人。 He's the one who did that.
他是那个真正将基督教定为帝国官方宗教的人。 He's the one who made Christianity really the official religion of the empire.
当然，君士坦丁使其成为帝国的首选宗教，但随后他们遇到 了亚略主义的问题，君士坦丁在某种程度上支持亚略主义。 Granted, Constantine made it the favorite religion of the Empire, but then they had that whole problem of Arianism, and Constantine, and certainly in some, means for Arianism.
狄奥多西是那个将基督教定为帝国官方宗教的人，我已经告诉过你 们，在380年，他发布了法令，如果你要问基督教是什么意思， 或者哪种基督教是帝国的官方宗教，那就是公教会的基督教。 Theodosius is the one who made Christianity the official religion of the Empire, and I already told you that in 380, he issued the edict that said that If you're going to ask what you mean by Christianity, or which Christianity is the official religion of the Empire, it is Catholic Christianity.
根据法令，这就是彼得传给罗马人的基督教。 It is the Christianity that, according to the edict, that Peter delivered to the Romans.
所以，这再次强调了罗马城的优先地位及其对彼得使徒继承的主张。 So again, this highlights the privacy of the city of Rome and its claim to apostolic succession from Peter.
所以，在381年，我们有了第二次大公会议，即君士坦丁堡会 议，381年是你们都应该记住的日期，无论你们是否在意。 So, in the year 381, We have the Second Ecumenical Council, the Council of Constantinople, and 381 is a date you should all remember whether you care or not.
第二次大公会议在君士坦丁堡所做的，首先是确认了尼 西亚信经，即325年的信经，并对其进行了更新。 And what the Second Ecumenical Council did at Constantinople was, first of all, it confirmed the Creed from Nicaea, the Creed 325, and it updated it.
我们马上就会看看这个。 And we're going to look at that in a minute.
它所做的另一件事，我已经提到过，就是它规定君士 坦丁堡作为大都会，是仅次于罗马的第二高权威。 The other thing it did, and I've already mentioned this, is that it decreed that the city of Constantinople, as a metropolitan, was The second highest authority after Rome.
所以，从某种意义上说，君士坦丁堡的这一法令旨在提升 君士坦丁堡的地位，使其成为东方的第一教会，对吧？ So, in a sense, the canon of Constantinople that decreed this was meant to elevate the status of Constantinople to the position of first church of the East, right?
但在这样做的同时，它也承认君士坦丁堡次于罗马，基本上使罗马成为世界第一教会。 But in doing so, it also acknowledged that it's second to Rome, and basically made Rome first church of the world.
所以这显然进一步加强了罗马大都会的地位，并削弱了其他东方大都会的地位，如 安提阿和亚历山大。在我们看看君士坦丁堡会议的信经之前，有没有什么问题？ And so this obviously just further strengthens the position of the metropolitan of Rome, and it weakens the positions of the other Eastern metropolitans, like Antioch and Alexandria, Any questions at this point before we take a look at the creed from the Council of Constantinople?
回到你们的讲义，第三栏，那里写着尼西亚信经，当然，正如 我所说，从技术上讲，它实际上是尼西亚君士坦丁堡信经。 Go back to your handout, the third column, where it says the Nicene Creed, and of course, as I said, it's really, technically speaking, the Nicene Constantinopolitan Creed.
如果你能快速说三遍，你就值得一个奖。 If you can say that three times fast, you deserve a prize.
所以，再次强调，如果你们允许，我现在就读一下。 So, again, if you'll indulge me, I will just go ahead and read it now.
有些版本的信经说“我们信”，有些说“我信”。 Some versions of the creed say we believe, some say I believe.
你们知道，拉丁语中的“credo”意思是“ 我信”，但当然信经本身最初是用希腊语写的。 As you know, the word credo in Latin means I believe, but of course the creed itself would have been written in Greek originally.
但无论如何，我们信或我信独一的神，全能的圣父，创造天地和一切有形无形的万物。 But anyway, we believe or I believe in one God, the Father Almighty, maker of heaven and earth, and of all things visible and invisible.
并信独一的主耶稣基督，神的独生子，在万世之前从圣父而生，从神而 生，光从光，真神从真神而生，非受造，与圣父同质，万物借着他造。 And I believe in one Lord Jesus Christ, the only begotten Son of God, born of the Father before all ages, God from God, light from light, true God from true God, begotten, not made, consubstantial with the Father, through Him all things were made.
为我们人类和我们的救恩，他从天降临，由圣灵感孕，童贞女马利亚所生，成为人。 For us men and for our salvation He came down from heaven and by the Holy Spirit was incarnate of the Virgin Mary and became man.
他在本丢·彼拉多手下为我们钉十字架。 For our sake he was crucified under Pontius Pilate.
他受难，埋葬，第三天照圣经所说复活。 He suffered death and was buried, and rose again on the third day in accordance with the Scriptures.
他升天，坐在圣父的右边。 He ascended into heaven and is seated at the right hand of the Father.
他将再来，在荣耀中审判活人和死人，他的国度永无穷尽。 He will come again in glory to judge the living and the dead, and his kingdom will have no end.
并信圣灵，主，赐生命者，从圣父而出。 And I believe in the Holy Spirit, the Lord, the giver of life, who proceeds from the Father.
暂时先不提括号里的那句话。 Hold that parenthetical phrase off for a minute.
与圣父和圣子同受敬拜，同受荣耀，他曾借众先知说话。 Who with the Father and the Son is adored and glorified, who has spoken through the prophets.
并信独一圣洁公教会和使徒教会。 And I believe in one holy, Catholic, and apostolic Church.
我承认一洗礼以赦罪，并期望死人的复活和来世的生命。 I confess one baptism for the forgiveness of sins, and I look forward to the resurrection of the dead and the life of the world to come.
阿们。 Amen.
好的，这就是你们的尼西亚信经，根据翻译的不同会有一些变化，但基本上就是这样。 Alright, so that's your 19 Creed, and there are variations depending on the translation, but that's basically it.
这是381年的信经。所以这是381年的信经。谢谢你指出这一点。 That is from 381. So that is the Creed of 381. Thanks for pointing that out.
所以现在注意到，神的道这个词终于被神的儿子这个词取代了。 So notice now that finally the phrase Word of God has been replaced with the phrase Son of God.
这是为了强调耶稣基督始终是神的儿子。 This is to emphasize that Jesus Christ is always Son of God.
不是通过收养，不仅仅是从他的洗礼开始，而是凭他的本性，永远是神的儿子。 not by adoption, not just starting in his baptism, but by his very nature, eternally Son of God.
记住亚历山大和亚他拿修的口号是为了反驳亚略的口号。 And remember Alexander and Athanasius' slogan that was meant to counter Arius' slogan.
亚略的口号是，他曾经不存在，而亚历山大的口号是，永远是父，永远是子。 Arius' slogan was, there was a time when he was not, and the Alexandrian slogan was, always a father, always a son.
所以在这里他是神的独生子。 So here he is as the only begotten Son of God.
现在，同质这个词仍然在这里，同质这个词只是同一本质的另一种翻译。 Now, consubstantial is still in here, and the word consubstantial is just another translation of the same substance.
这并不是真正的变化，只是英语中的变化。 That's not really a change, it's just a change in the English.
但注意到，第一次提到本质语言的部分被去掉了。 But notice that the first reference to the essence language is taken out.
这可能是对一些摇摆不定的派别的让步，这些半亚略派可能仍然对本质语言感到不舒服， 所以这可能是一个让步，好吧，你知道，我们会把它去掉，但我们会保留同质这个词。 This was probably a concession To some of those factions who were on the fence, these semi-Aryans, who may still have been uncomfortable with the essence language, and so this is probably a concession, well, you know, we'll take that out, but we're leaving the homoousios word in there.
然后他们就可以接受这个了。 And then they could get on board with that.
万世之前这个词回来了。 The phrase, before all ages, is back.
在万世之前从圣父而生。 Born of the Father before all ages.
但当然，现在的假设是，这应该明确表示永恒生成。 But of course now the assumption would be that it's supposed to be clear that this means eternal generation.
这不仅仅意味着他在其他受造物之前被造，而是意味着他是永恒生成的。 It doesn't simply mean that he was created before the rest of creation, but it means that he was eternally generated.
所以这个出生的语言并不是意味着他有一个存在的开始。 And so this born language is not meant to imply that he has a beginning to his existence.
我的意思是，即使是诺瓦提安也使用这个出生的语 言，尽管是在拉丁语中，当他谈论永恒生成时。 I mean, even Novation uses that born language, although in Latin, when he's talking about eternal generation.
所以这并不意味着他有一个存在的开始。 So it doesn't mean that he has a beginning to his existence.
事实上，恰恰相反，这意味着他是永恒生成的。 In fact, just the contrary, it means that he's eternally generated.
这并不像我希望的那样清楚，但这是那里的假设。 It's not as clear as I might like it to be, but that's the assumption there.
另一种说法是永恒独生，在一些翻译中，这正是它所说的，永恒独生。 Another way to say this is eternally begotten and in some translations that is exactly what it says, eternally begotten.
注意到马利亚的添加。 Notice the addition of Mary.
他由圣灵感孕，由童贞女马利亚所生。 He was incarnate by the Holy Spirit and of the Virgin Mary.
所以在我们进入关于圣灵的段落之前，这里已经添加了圣灵，并且添加了马利亚。 So we have the addition of the Holy Spirit in here before we even get to the paragraph about the Spirit, and we have the addition of Mary.
现在我们要多谈一点马利亚在基督论中的角色。 Now we're going to talk a little bit more about the role of Mary in Christology.
你可能会认为这是关于马利亚的，注意到还添加了本丢·彼拉多。 You may be tempted to think that it's about Mary, Notice also the addition of Pontius Pilate.
我不知道你们是否记得摇滚歌剧《耶稣基督超级明星》。 And I don't know if you remember the rock opera, Jesus Christ Superstar.
记得那个吗？ Remember that one?
在《耶稣基督超级明星》中，有一首彼拉多唱的歌。 In Jesus Christ Superstar, there is a song that Pilate sings.
在福音书中，彼拉多的妻子做了一个梦，对彼拉多说，不要与那个耶稣有任何关系。 Now, in the Gospels, Pilate's wife has a dream and says to Pilate, don't have anything to do with the Jesus guy.
在安德鲁·劳埃德·韦伯和蒂姆·赖斯的福音书中，实际上是彼 拉多做了这个梦，他唱了这首歌，歌中有一句非常辛酸的歌词， 他仿佛看到了未来，看到数百万人责怪他导致基督的死亡。 In the Gospel according to Andrew Lloyd Webber and Tim Rice, it's actually Pilate who has the dream, and he sings this song, and there's a very poignant line in the song where he sort of sees into the future, and he sees millions of people blaming him for the death of Christ.
当然，这是指他在信经中的名字。 And of course that's a reference to his name in the Creed.
不过，这不仅仅是找一个替罪羊的问题。 It isn't simply a matter of finding a scapegoat here, though.
提到本丢·彼拉多的名字将基督事件锚定在历史中。 The inclusion of the name of Pontius Pilate anchors the Christ event in history.
换句话说，本丢·彼拉多是一个真实的历史人物，他确实存在，并且在2 6年至36年间确实是犹太的总督。所以我们可以确定这个事件的日期。 In other words, Pontius Pilate is a real historical character who really lived and who really was procurator of Judea from the years 26 to 36. So we can date this.
我们可以确定这个事件的日期。 We can date this event.
这很重要，因为基督教信仰是一个历史信仰，我 们相信神在耶稣基督的身上介入了人类历史。 And that's important because The Christian faith is a historical faith, in the sense that we believe God intervened in human history in the person of Jesus Christ.
正如神在出埃及记中介入人类历史，犹太信徒相信这一点，我们也相信神介入了人类历史。 Just as God intervened in human history in the Exodus, and the Jewish believers believe that, we also believe that God intervened in human history.
这不是一种基于时间之初在奥林匹斯山或其他地方发生的宇宙事件的信仰。 This is not a faith based on cosmic events that happened before the dawn of time on Mount Olympus or something.
这是历史性的。 This is historical.
这里提到本丢·彼拉多是为了将整个事件锚定在历史中。 Pontius Pilate here is mentioned to anchor the whole event in history.
按照圣经所说，这句话的意思实际上是根据圣经。 The phrase, in accordance with the Scriptures, really means according to the Scriptures.
可能对其中的圣经外词汇“同质”有些尴尬，但这是 说所有这些都是根据圣经发生的，并且与圣经一致。 Possibly there's some embarrassment about the extra-biblical word homoousios in there, but this is to say all of this happened according to the Scriptures and is consistent with the Scriptures.
在一些翻译中，你会看到“应验圣经”的说法。 In some translations you get the phrase, in fulfillment of the Scriptures.
虽然早期基督徒确实相信旧约中有很多预言与耶稣的生平、事 工、死亡和复活有关，但这里并不完全是关于预言的应验。 And while the early Christians certainly did believe that there was a lot of prophecy in the Old Testament that related to the events of Jesus' life, ministry, death, and resurrection, it's not really about the fulfillment of prophecy here.
更多的是指福音书。 It's more in the sense that this is a reference to the Gospels.
这就是这里发生的事情。 That's what's going on here.
然后添加了“他的国度永无穷尽”这句话，我认为这是指应验《撒母耳记下》第 七章。在这里，我认为我们确实有一个对旧约的暗示，在《撒母耳记下》第七章 中，有一个关于大卫王朝永恒的应许，所以耶稣是那个将永远统治的永恒君王。 And then the addition of the phrase, his kingdom will have no end, I think this is a reference to the fulfillment of 2 Samuel 7. Here we do have an allusion, I think, to the Old Testament, where in 2 Samuel chapter 7, there is a promise of the sort of eternal dynasty of the Davidic line, and so Jesus is that eternal king who will reign forever.
好的。 Okay.
所以，正如你们所见，诅咒部分被去掉了，谢天谢地。 So, as you can see, the anathemas are removed, thankfully.
我很高兴我们不必在礼拜中背诵那个。 I'm too glad we don't have to recite that in worship.
但我们当然有扩展的关于圣灵的段落。 But we do have, of course, the expanded paragraph on the Holy Spirit.
所以，如果问题是，确实是，问题是，圣灵是神吗？ And so, if the question is, and it was, the question is, is the Holy Spirit divine?
答案是肯定的。 The answer is yes.
圣灵是主，是赐生命者，与耶稣基督本人无异。 The Holy Spirit is the Lord And the giver of life, no less than Jesus Christ himself.
主显然是一个神圣的称号，相当于旧约中的“阿多奈”，作为神圣名字的替代。 Lord is clearly a divine title, equivalent to Adonai, as the replacement for the divine name in the Old Testament.
所以我们在第二段看到耶稣基督被称为主，现在我们看到圣灵也被称为主。 So we see Jesus Christ called Lord in the second paragraph, now we see the Holy Spirit also called Lord.
并赐生命者。 And giver of life.
所以这说明了圣灵的神性。 And so it speaks to the divinity of the Spirit.
有问题吗？ Question?
是的？ Yes?
是的，但圣洁并不一定意味着神圣。 Yeah, but holy doesn't necessarily mean divine.
有些人，我们在听到卡帕多西亚教父时会更多地谈论这个，但在早期教会中 有一个团体，他们有各种名字，特别是在四世纪，他们质疑圣灵的神性，并 想把圣灵说成是一个被造的存在，或本质上是一个天使或类似的东西。 And there were people, and we'll talk about this more when we hear about the Cappadocians, but there was a group In the early church, that went by various names, but during the fourth century especially, who questioned the divinity of the Holy Spirit and wanted to talk about the Holy Spirit as a created being or essentially an angel or something like that.
所以我们会更多地听到关于这个的内容。 So we're going to hear more about that.
所以，是的，关于圣灵的神性有过争论。 So yeah, there was a debate over the divinity of the Spirit.
再次强调，这引出了一个问题，如果圣灵是神，如果我们 质疑圣灵的神性，我们也必须质疑敬拜圣灵是否合适。 And again, that begs the question, if the Spirit is divine, If we're questioning the divinity of the Spirit, we also have to question whether it's appropriate to worship the Holy Spirit.
再次强调，答案是肯定的，因为我们看到圣灵从圣父而出，与 圣父和圣子同受敬拜，同受荣耀，并且他曾借众先知说话。 And again, the answer would be yes, because we see the Spirit who proceeds from the Father, who with the Father and the Son is adored and glorified, and also who is spoken to as prophets.
所以谈到圣灵也是永恒的，因为圣灵在旧约中就已经存在。 So speaking of the Spirit is also eternal in the sense that the Spirit was there in the Old Testament.
现在注意到圣灵是从圣父而出。 Now notice that the Spirit proceeds.
我们已经在谈论三位一体和不可分割的运作和归属教义时谈到了一点，我 说过，实际上只有非常有限的词汇来描述三位一体中的一个位格，对吧？ We've talked about this a little bit already in the context of when we were talking about the Trinity and the doctrine of inseparable operation and appropriation and I was saying that there's really a very limited amount of words that describe only one person of the Trinity, right?
圣父是未生的。 The Father is unbegotten.
圣子是独生的并且成了肉身，然后圣灵是从圣父而出。 The Son is begotten and incarnate, and then the Holy Spirit proceeds.
这有点像教会用尽了词汇，只剩下这个词。 And it's sort of almost like the church ran out of words and proceeds with the only word left.
事实上，在护教学家中，从圣父而出是我们用来专门指圣灵的词，特别是指圣灵赐给教 会和人类的方式。所以，在很多方面，它的意思与独生有点相同，但并不完全相同。 In fact, in the Apologists, Proceeds is the word we're going to use to speak specifically of the Holy Spirit, and specifically of the way in which the Holy Spirit is given to the Church, to humanity, So, it means, in a lot of ways, kind of the same thing as begotten, but it's not exactly the same thing.
因为独生导致了子身份。 Because begottenness leads to sonship.
所以，圣子是独生的，因此圣子是圣子。 So, the Son is begotten, therefore the Son is the Son.
但圣灵不是圣父的另一个儿子。 But the Spirit is not another son of the Father.
所以你不能再用独生这个词。 So you can't just use the word begotten again.
我们需要另一个词，这个词是从圣父而出，这说 明了圣灵是神赐给教会和人类的礼物的方式。 We need another word, and that word is proceeds, and that speaks to the way in which the Holy Spirit is the gift of God to the church and to humanity.
现在，我们搁置了那句话，“和圣子”，因为最初的381年信经中没有那句话。 Now, we've set aside that phrase, and the Son, because originally the Creed of 381 did not have that phrase in there.
最初它只说圣灵从圣父而出，仅此而已。 Originally it only said that the Holy Spirit proceeds from the Father, period.
我马上会谈到这个。 And I'm going to talk about that in a minute.
有些东方神学家说我们可以说圣灵从圣父通过圣 子而出，但从圣父和圣子而出的概念是不同的。 There were some of the Eastern theologians who were saying that we could say the Holy Spirit proceeds from the Father through the Son, but this concept of proceeding from the Father and the Son is different.
这被称为双重发出。 It's called double procession.
我马上会谈到这个，但首先让我完成这里的信经。 And I'll get to that in a minute, but first let me finish the creed here.
现在，我们有了第四段，但再次感谢的是，它没有诅咒任何人。 Now, we have a fourth paragraph, but it, again, thankfully doesn't curse anyone.
第四段通常被称为教会的四个标志。 This fourth paragraph is what is often referred to as the four marks of the church.
使教会成为教会，基督的身体的四个要素。 The four things that make the church the church, the body of Christ.
所以，我们现在实际上有一个四点纲要，因为我们有一段关 于圣父，一段关于圣子，一段关于圣灵，一段关于教会。 And so, we now kind of actually have a four-point outline because we have a paragraph on the Father, a paragraph on the Son, a paragraph on the Spirit, and a paragraph on the church.
因为理解是，你想要到达圣父，你必须通过圣子。 Because the understanding was, you want to get to the Father, you've got to go through the Son.
你想要到达圣子，你必须通过教会。 You want to get to the Son, you've got to go through the Church.
你以为我会说圣灵，但我没有。你必须通过教会。 You thought I was going to say Spirit there, but I didn't. You've got to go through the Church.
所以这就是它的运作方式。 So that's kind of how it works.
所以使教会成为教会的四个要素是它是独一的，只有一个教会，保罗 在《以弗所书》中谈到这个，一个身体，一个洗礼，类似的语言。 So the four things that make the Church the Church are that it is one, there is only one Church, Paul talks about this in Ephesians, one body, one baptism, that kind of language.
它是圣洁的，因为它是由神创造的，由基督设立的。 It is holy because it is created by God, instituted by Christ.
它是公教会的，意味着它是普世的或全球性的。 It is Catholic, meaning that it is universal or worldwide.
这也与独一性有关，因为如果教会要成为一个，它必须是全球性的。 And this goes with the oneness, too, because if the church is to be one, it has to be worldwide.
你不能有一个东方的教会和一个西方的教会。 You can't have one church of the East and one of the West.
现在，显然你知道我们会到达那里，但它应该是一个，它应该是全球性的。 Now, obviously you know we're going to get there, but it's supposed to be one, it's supposed to be worldwide.
教会的第四个标志是它是使徒性的。 And the fourth mark of the church is that it is apostolic.
它与使徒们相连，通过他们与耶稣相连。 It is connected to the apostles and through them to Jesus.
所以，教会的独一性和普世性或全球性在一个洗礼中得以显现。 So, the oneness and the universality, or the world-wideness, of the Church are made manifest in the one baptism.
这确实是教会成为一个的方式。 That is really how the Church is one.
理论上，一个圣餐桌也是，但…… Theoretically, the one table also, but...
第四个是它是使徒性的。 The fourth one is that it is apostolic.
它是独一的，圣洁的，公教会的，使徒性的。 It is one, holy, Catholic, apostolic.
但接着注意到，它继续说，有一个洗礼以赦罪，所以在 理论上，一个洗礼确保了教会的独一性，教会的合一。 But then notice it goes right on to say, that there is one baptism for the forgiveness of sins, and so it is in the one baptism that theoretically ensures the oneness of the church, the unity of the church.
我认为即使到今天，洗礼是最接近的东西，也许信经本身也是我们拥 有的最接近的东西，尽管我们有宗派的差异，但它使我们保持合一。 And I would argue that even to this day, baptism is the closest thing, and perhaps the creed itself also is the closest thing we have that keeps us one in spite of our denominational differences.
最后，作为教会的成员，作为基督的身体，信经以我们对永生的希望结束。 And finally, as members of the Church, as the body of Christ, the Creed ends with our hope of eternal life.
所以这是381年的信经，我们称之为尼西亚信经。 So that is the Creed of 381, the Creed that we call the 19th Creed.
现在在我继续之前，有没有关于这个的具体问题？ Now before I go on, are there any questions about that specifically?
童贞女马利亚，好吧，我不知道该说什么，除了这里的道成肉身描述得更详细之 外，没有太多可说的，所以我们再次根据福音书，提到他是如何从天降临的。 The Virgin Mary, well, I don't know what to say, there isn't too much to say about it other than the incarnation here is described in more detail, and so we get, again, based on the Gospels, We get the mention of how it is he came down from heaven.
所以我们仍然有“降临”的语言，我知道在325年的信经中是“ 降世”，然后是“降临”，但再次强调，它基本上是同一个意思。 So we still have the came down language, and I know it's descended in the creative 325 and then came down, but again, it means basically the same thing.
这并不是真正的变化。 It's not really a change.
所以我们仍然有“降临”的语言。 So we still have the came down language.
我们仍然有“成了人”和“成了完全的人”的语言，但我认为 为了强调完全的人性，我们还说他实际上是由一个女人所生。 And we still have the became man and became fully human language, but I think to emphasize the full humanity, we also have that he was actually born of a woman.
所以这不是某个诺斯替幻影突然出现在地球上。 So this is not some Gnostic phantom who just appeared on the earth.
他有一个实际的出生，这说明了他的真实人性。 He had a physical birth, which speaks to his real humanity.
另一方面，他的出生仍然是独特的，因为这是一个由圣灵感孕的童贞女所生的出生。 On the other side of that coin is that his birth is still unique in the sense that it is a virginal birth with a conception by the Holy Spirit.
所以，你知道，我们在这里有一点阐述了神性和人性。 So, you know, we sort of have both the divine and human natures elaborated here a little bit.
这几乎像是，嗯，不是那样的。 It's almost like, well, it's not like that.
这不像，那个词是什么，阳刚，阳刚，阳刚，阳刚。 It's not like, what's that word, masculine, masculine, masculine, masculine.
嗯，是的，你不想去那里，因为这是完全的人性和完全的神性。 Well, yeah, you don't want to go there because it's a full humanity and a full divinity.
对。 Right.
我想当我们说完全的人性时，因为我们认为人性是男人和女人的结合。 I guess when we say full humanity, because we think of humanity as conception as a man and woman.
圣灵不是一个男人。 The Holy Spirit is not a man.
对。 Right.
所以这就是我要说的。 So that's where I'm going there.
当我说完全的人性时，童贞女感孕并不否定完全的人性。 When I say full humanity, the virginal conception doesn't negate the full humanity.
实际上我澄清这一点是好的，因为你实际上在信经中没有看到“完全”这个词，对吗？ It's actually good that I'm clarifying this because You don't see the word full, actually, in the Creed, do you?
那我为什么一直在强调它呢？ So why do I keep throwing it in?
重要的是它是完全的人性，因为就像基督必须与圣父同质才能成为使救恩成为可 能的神圣介入一样，他也必须与人类同质才能成为我们的代表并为我们而死。 It's important that it's a full humanity, because just like Christ must be consubstantial with the Father in order for Him to be that divine intervention that makes salvation possible, He also must be consubstantial with humanity In order to be our representative and to die for us in our place.
所以这就是我所说的完全的人性。 So that's what I mean by a full humanity.
他也与人类同质，这将在后面进一步澄清。 That he is also consubstantial with humanity and that will be clarified more later.
所以我们还没有完全到那里。 So we're not quite there yet.
但再次强调，我认为添加了由女人实际出生的内容正在朝那个方向发展。 But again, I think the addition of physical birth from a woman is moving in that direction.
不过这是个好问题。 Good question though.
好的。 Okay.
好的，让我从这里继续一点。 Alright, so let me go on from here just a bit.
即使是君士坦丁堡会议和信经的更新也没有完全消除亚略主义。 Even the Council of Constantinople and the updating of the creed did not completely make Arianism go away.
你必须记住两件事。 There's two things you have to remember.
第一件事是，像尼科美底亚的优西比乌这样的亚略派 主教委派了传教士去蛮族，而蛮族部落迁入欧洲。 The first thing is that it was Arian bishops, like Eusebius of Nicomedia, who commissioned the missionaries to the barbarians, and the barbarian tribes moved into Europe.
我说的是哥特人、汪达尔人这些人，对吧？ I'm talking about the Goths, the Vandals, these guys, right?
蛮族部落迁入西欧，许多人是亚略派，有些人将占领某些地区，这是西罗 马帝国开始崩溃的时候，也是欧洲在蛮族酋长统治下成为独立王国的开始 ，其中一些蛮族酋长是亚略派基督徒，如果你能称他们为基督徒的话。 The barbarian tribes move into Western Europe and many of them are Aryan and some of them will take over certain areas and this is when the Roman Empire in the West starts to break down and it's the beginning of Europe as separate kingdoms under barbarian chieftains and some of these barbarian chieftains are Aryan Christian, if you can call them Christian.
所以在这些地区，我们有一个亚略派少数派统治着公教会多数派。 And so we have an Aryan minority ruling over a Catholic majority in some of these areas.
所以会有这种影响将亚略主义带入西方。 And so there's going to be that influence that is going to bring Aryanism into the West.
所以这就是亚略主义不会简单消失的一个原因。 So that's one reason why Aryanism doesn't simply go away.
第二件要记住的事是，任何倾向于收养主义的人都 会看向正统的中间，并且会觉得那是另一个极端。 The second thing to remember is that anyone who leans toward adoptionism It's going to look at the Orthodox middle, and it's going to look like the other extreme to them.
在他们看来，这会像是形态论。 It's going to look like modalism to them.
换句话说，如果你是一个收养主义者或亚略派，当你听到“同质” 这个词，与圣父同质，这听起来像是三位一体中有太多的合一，圣 父和圣子之间有太多的合一，就像在说圣父和圣子是同一个。 In other words, if you're an adoptionist or an Arian, and you hear the word consubstantial, consubstantial with the Father, that is going to sound to you like there's too much unity in the Trinity, too much unity between Father and Son, like it's saying that the Father and Son are one and the same.
所以亚略派如果在争论圣父和圣子之间的更多区别，那么圣父和圣子之 间的关系是合作意志的关系，但不是本体论上的相同或类似的东西。 And so the Arians If the Arians are out there arguing for more of a distinction between father and son, So that the relationship between father and son is a relationship of cooperating wills, but it's not an ontological sameness or anything like that.
如果亚略派在争论圣父和圣子之间的更大区别，正统派会怎么做？ If the Arians are out there arguing for a greater distinction between father and son, what are the Orthodox going to do?
他们会通过争论圣父和圣子之间的更多合一来反驳。 They're going to counter by arguing for more unity between the father and son.
特别是如果你在像西班牙这样的地方，那里有亚略派蛮族统治着你。 And especially if you're in some place like Spain, where you have Aryan barbarians ruling over you.
顺便说一下，那只是一个巧合。 That rhyme was just a coincidence, by the way.
所以，这意味着正统派，支持尼西亚派，特别是在西方，想要更加强调圣父和圣子 之间的合一，因为他们害怕，你知道的，所以你把这两件事放在一起，入侵者是亚 略派，还有需要强调圣父和圣子的合一和平等，你就得到了圣灵的双重发出。 So, what that means is that the Orthodox, the pro-Nicene, especially in the West, want to emphasize the unity between the father and son even more because they're afraid of the, you know, So you put these two things together, the invaders are Aryans, and the need to emphasize the unity and equality of the father and son, and you get the double procession of the spirit.
让我告诉你这是如何运作的。 Let me show you how that works.
基本上，圣奥古斯丁，我们稍后会谈到，但奥古斯丁会 写道，圣灵不仅从圣父而出，圣灵从圣父和圣子而出。 Basically, St. Augustine, who we'll talk about later, but Augustine will write that the Holy Spirit doesn't proceed just from the Father, but the Holy Spirit proceeds from both the Father and the Son.
这是强调圣父和圣子的合一和平等的一种方式。 And this was a way to emphasize the unity and the equality of the Father and Son.
让我告诉你我的意思。 And let me show you what I mean.
现在，公平地说，这是符合圣经的。 Now, to be fair, It's biblical.
如果你特别看第四福音书，我们可以找到圣父差遣 圣灵的经文，也可以找到圣子差遣圣灵的经文。 If you look at especially the Fourth Gospel, we can find passages where the Father sends the Spirit, and we can find passages where the Son sends the Spirit.
所以这个想法，这个概念本身没有问题。 So the idea, the concept in itself is not problematic.
但你马上会看到问题出在哪里。 But you're going to see where the problem is going to come in in a minute.
但让我在这里画一个简单的图。 But let me just draw a little crude diagram here.
我们习惯于以这样的三位一体层次结构来思考，对吧？ We're used to thinking in terms of a hierarchy of the Trinity that looks like this, right?
事实上，回到护教学家，圣父占第一位，圣子占第二位，圣灵占第三位。 In fact, going back to the apologists, the Father takes the first place, the Son takes the second place, the Holy Spirit takes the third place.
我们习惯了这种层次结构。 We're used to this kind of a hierarchy.
但奥古斯丁和其他人提出的东西更像是一个倒三角形。 But what Augustine and others will propose is something that looks more like an upside-down triangle.
所以我们把圣父放在这里，把圣子放在这里，把圣灵放在这里。 So let's put Father here, Let's put Son here, and let's put the Holy Spirit here.
所以，从某种意义上说，他们的意思是圣灵从圣父和圣子而出，来到人类，来到教会。 So that, in a sense, what they're saying is that the Holy Spirit proceeds from both the Father and the Son to humanity, to the Church.
这强调了圣父和圣子的平等和合一。 This emphasizes the equality and the unity of the Father and Son.
现在，这并不是说圣灵没有同样的平等和合一。 Now, it's not saying that there isn't also the same equality and unity with the Holy Spirit.
这并不是说圣灵不是同质的。 It's not saying that the Holy Spirit isn't consubstantial.
但这不是现在的重点。 But that's not really the point at this point.
现在的重点是强调圣父和圣子的合一和平等，因为通过将圣子 从这里提升到这里，是一种驳斥这种持续存在的领域的方法。 The point right now is to emphasize the unity and the equality of Father and Son, because by putting the Son, by taking the Son from here up to here, is a way of refuting this ongoing area inside.
亚略主义想在这里划线。 Arianism wants to draw the line here.
这条线以上的一切都是未被造的，是神，这条线以下的一切都是被造的。 Everything above this line is uncreated, and God, and everything below the line is created.
而正统派不想在这里划线。 Well, the Orthodox don't want to draw the line there.
他们想在这里划线，并说，这里是人类，所以这条线以上的 一切都是未被造的，是神，这条线以下的一切都是被造的。 They want to draw the line here, and say, here's humanity, and so everything above the line is uncreated and God, and everything below the line is created.
这就是正统派想划线的地方。 That's where the Orthodox want to draw the line.
所以为了从这里抹去这条线，他们把圣子放在与圣父同等的水平上，所以我们有 一种新的，我们在理论上仍然有这种层次结构，就三位一体内部的权威而言，但 现在我们有一种新的看待三位一体的方式，即圣灵同样从圣父和圣子而出。 So in order to erase the line from here, they take the Son and put him up on the same level as the Father, and so we have a new kind of, we still have this hierarchy in theory, in terms of the authority internal to the Trinity, but now we sort of have a new way of looking at the Trinity that says the Holy Spirit proceeds equally from both Father and Son.
我希望你们明白，这整个重点是为了驳斥亚略主义，对吧？ And I'm hoping that you get that the whole point of that is to refute Arianism, right?
所以，当亚略主义最终被克服并在某些地区消亡时，比如在西班 牙，当正统派能够控制会议时，他们会确保亚略主义不会回来。 So, what we have then is when Arianism is finally overcome and sort of dies out in some of these areas, like in Spain, and when the Orthodox then can control the councils, They're going to make sure Arianism doesn't come back.
你如何确保亚略主义不会回来？ How do you make sure Arianism doesn't come back?
你在信经中加入一句话，“和圣子”。 You stick into the creed a little phrase, and the Son.
圣灵从圣父和圣子而出。 The Holy Spirit proceeds from the Father, and the Son.
我们会把它加进去。 We're going to stick that in there.
现在，这是西方，所以我们现在用拉丁语。 Now, this is the West, so we're doing Latin now.
所以“和圣子”这个词在拉丁语中实际上只有一个词。 So the phrase, and the Son, in Latin, is actually only one word.
这个词是filioque。 The word is filioque.
Filio是“子”，que是“和”，当你以这种方式使用“和”这 个词时，你可以把它作为后缀加在词的末尾，在拉丁语中很多时候不需 要“the”这个词，所以“和圣子”是一个词，filioque。 Filio is sun, que is and, and when you use the word and in this way you can tack it on the end of the word as a suffix, and you don't need the word the a lot of times in Latin, so and the sun is one word, filioque.
这将被称为filioque争议，因为当东方人得知 西方人在信经中添加了一个词时，他们会感到不满。 And this will come to be known as the filioque controversy, because when the Easterners get wind of the fact that the Westerners have added a word to the creed, they're going to be upset.
现在，在东方人和西方人的辩论中，我有时听到东方人争论filioque是异端。 Now, in debates between Eastern and Westerners, I sometimes hear Easterners argue that filioque is heretical.
我认为问题不在于filioque是异端。 And I would argue that the problem is not that filioque is heretical.
问题在于西方人是否有权改变在大公会议上制定的信经。 The problem is The question of whether the Westerners had the right to change a creed that was created at the Ecumenical Council.
东方人会争论说西方人没有这个权利。 And the Easterners will argue that the Westerners did not have that right.
无论如何，从西班牙开始，filioque这个词被添加到信经中，最 终在中世纪查理曼大帝统治下，它将永久地添加到西方的尼西亚信经中。 So anyway, starting in Spain, The word filioque is added to the creed and eventually in the Middle Ages under Charlemagne, it will get permanently added to the Nicene Creed in the West.
这将成为东西方关系中的另一个痛点，并导致东西方基督徒最终分裂的另一个因素。 And this is going to be another sore spot in the relations between East and West and another thing that leads to the eventual split between the Eastern and the Western Christians.
所以把它记在心里，因为我们稍后会再提到它。 So keep that tucked in the back of your mind because we're going to bring it back up later.
但我想告诉你，这就是事情的发展方向。 But I wanted to show you that that's where this goes.
所以当你背诵信经时，如果你属于一个背诵信经的传统，我希望你确实背诵信 经，当你背到“和圣子”这句话时，要知道你的东方兄弟姐妹们不这么说。 And so when you say the creed, if you belong to a tradition that says the creed, and I hope you do say the creed, when you get to the phrase, and the Son, know that your Eastern brothers and sisters don't say that.
当然，他们可能用希腊语说，但撇开翻译不谈，信经实际上应 该是团结所有基督徒的东西，但不幸的是我们有这个差异。 Of course, they're probably saying it in Greek, but, I mean, translation aside, The Creed is actually something that should unite all Christians, but unfortunately we have this one difference.
除此之外，我们都背诵同样的信经，我们都有同样的信经，我们 都在假设信经定义了界限的基础上运作。当西方和东方团体聚在 一起时，当他们决定共同创造时，他们如何克服这个障碍？ But other than that, we all say the same Creed, we all have the same Creed, and we all operate on the assumption that the Creed defines the boundaries of When the Western and the Eastern groups meet together, how do they overcome this obstacle when they decide to create together?
西方和东方基督徒实际上没有机会一起敬拜，因为在像东正教传统或罗 马公教会这样的古老传统中，礼仪主要围绕圣餐，他们不能分享圣餐。 Western and Eastern Christians don't really get an opportunity to worship together because in the ancient traditions like the Eastern Orthodox traditions or the Roman Catholic, liturgy centers so primarily around the Eucharist and they can't share the Eucharist.
你看不到那种大公服务。 You don't see that kind of ecumenical service.
在我们的世界里，你可以做感恩节并举行大公服务或 类似的事情，但在东西方之间这样做是很困难的。 In our world, you can do Thanksgiving and have an ecumenical service or something like that, but it's difficult to do that across East and West.
所以，这不会发生。 So, it doesn't happen.
我的意思是，据我所知没有。 I mean, not that I'm aware of.
是吗？ Yes?
在我所在的米沙拉卡镇，有一个希腊东正教教堂，他们称之为与教宗共融。 In my town of Mishalaka, there's a Greek Orthodox church that is what they call in communion with the Pope.
那是…… Is that...
类似你所说的，有些人做了一些事情以重新与教宗保持一致或类似的事情。 Something like what you're talking about, some of them have done something to get back in line with the Pope or something.
公教会的神父可能会代替某些与西方共融的东方 礼仪教会，但他们仍然使用东方的礼仪和传统。 The Catholic priest might fill in for There are certain Eastern Rite churches that are in communion with the West, but they still use the liturgy from the East and the traditions from the East.
我个人对此并不太了解。 I'm not really personally up on that.
我很想了解更多。 I would love to learn more about it.
这对我来说有点神秘，但我知道它确实发生了。 It's a bit of a mystery to me, but I know that it happens.
不过，在那些情况下，我去上了一堂课，他们整个弥撒的每一个字都是希腊语。 In those cases, though, I had a visit for a class and every single word of their whole Mass was in Greek.
我什么都听不懂。 I understood nothing.
但他们真的很友好。 But they were real friendly.
你有机会坐下来吗？ Did you get to sit down much?
没有。他们像小鸟一样把一个小圣餐放进嘴里。 No. They dropped a little communion thing into their mouth like little birds.
是的，所以我们有时会带团体去参观希腊东正教或其他传统，东方传统。 Yeah, so we have on occasion taken groups to visit Greek Orthodox or other traditions, Eastern traditions.
希腊东正教的礼拜很美，但如果你不懂希腊语，你会有点被排除在外。 The Greek Orthodox is a beautiful service, but if you don't know Greek, you're kind of left out.
好的，现在还有其他问题吗？ Okay, any other questions at this point?
你能重复一下你说的那句话吗，信经定义了正统的界限？ Could you repeat the one phrase you said, the creed defines the boundaries of Orthodoxy?
理论上，对于东西方，除了filioque的添加，信经应该是团结我 们的东西，并且在定义正确信仰或正统信仰的界限的意义上团结我们。 Theoretically, for East and West, apart from the Filiogeo edition, the Creed should be the thing that unites us, and that unites us in the sense that it defines the boundaries of what correct belief is, or orthodox belief.
从某种意义上说，如果你想称自己为基督徒，你必须接受这个。 It's in a sense saying, if you want to call yourself a Christian, You have to accept this.
就是这样。 This is it.
这些是这里的界限。 These are the boundaries here.
所以我们与全球的基督徒分享这一点，再次强调，除了添加的那个词。 And so we share that with Christians worldwide, again except for the addition of that one word.
是吗？ Yes?
你说它是在西方添加并在西班牙传播的。 You said it was added in the West and spread in Spain.
那是什么时候？ When was that?
好问题。 Good question.
那是什么时候？ When was that?
我想说…… I want to say...
查理曼大帝试图做的一件事是标准化礼仪，所以在那时它要么对每个人都有效，要么无效。 One of the things Charlemagne tried to do was standardized liturgy, so it was either going to be in or out for everybody at that point.
还有其他问题吗？ Anything else?
好的，我宣布你们可以回家了。 Alright, I decree that you should go home.