- start: 20.859
  end: 28.199
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: So, in this sixth episode, we'll look at transubstantiation and the real presence according to the theology of St. Thomas Aquinas.
  zh: 因此，在这第六集中，我们将根据圣托马斯·阿奎那的神学观点，探讨变质说与真实临在。
- start: 28.199
  end: 40.019
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: This will be a continuation of what we looked at in the fifth episode, um, because Thomas Aquinas builds on his predecessors and brings it to a, um, synthesis.
  zh: 这将延续第五集的内容，因为托马斯·阿奎那在前人基础上进行了综合阐述。
- start: 40.019
  end: 50.119
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: So, we always have to remember that, um, the medieval scholastic theologians aren't trying to prove the real presence.
  zh: 我们必须始终牢记，中世纪经院神学家并非试图证明真实临在。
- start: 50.119
  end: 53.919
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Well, they're presupposing it as a doctrine of faith, right?
  zh: 他们是将此作为信仰教义的前提，对吗？
- start: 53.919
  end: 55.399
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: It's the faith of the Church.
  zh: 这是教会的信仰。
- start: 55.399
  end: 56.579
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And what they're...
  zh: 而他们...
- start: 56.579
  end: 64.819
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: They're making use of philosophy not to demonstrate the, uh, the mystery, but so that we can speak reasonable...
  zh: 他们运用哲学并非为了论证奥秘，而是为了让我们能够合理...
- start: 64.819
  end: 65.899
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Oh, I shouldn't even have said it.
  zh: 哦，我本不该这么说。
- start: 65.899
  end: 78.819
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: So that we can speak about it, um, and show it not to be contradictory, um, so that we can speak rightly about it, um, and to shed some light on the mystery by way of analogy.
  zh: 为使我们能谈论它，表明其不存在矛盾，从而正确论述，并通过类比揭示奥秘的某些方面。
- start: 78.819
  end: 87.859
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: But again, we're always taking our point of departure from the revealed truth, and that revealed truth is from the words of Jesus at the Last Supper.
  zh: 但我们的出发点始终是启示真理——即耶稣在最后晚餐上的话。
- start: 87.859
  end: 88.599
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: All right?
  zh: 明白吗？
- start: 88.599
  end: 89.439
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: '"Take, eat.'
  zh: 「你们拿着吃
- start: 89.439
  end: 91.379
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: This is my body.
  zh: 这是我的身体
- start: 91.379
  end: 96.319
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: This is the blood of the covenant." Right?
  zh: 这是我立约的血」对吗？
- start: 96.319
  end: 100.239
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: So, the point of departure is simply the words of Christ.
  zh: 因此出发点就是基督的这句话。
- start: 100.239
  end: 119.219
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And then, the faith of the Church, which we saw was defined against Berengarius in the, uh, formula that he had to, um, to recite, composed by Pope Gregory VII, and then, uh, four and a half centuries later, um, infallibly taught by the Council of Trent.
  zh: 接着是教会的信仰——我们曾看到教宗额我略七世为反对贝伦加尔制定的认信公式，四个半世纪后又被特利腾大会议以不可错误的方式教导。
- start: 119.219
  end: 119.839
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: So, let's look at that.
  zh: 让我们具体来看。
- start: 119.839
  end: 138.799
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: The Council of Trent, um, teaches that in the august sacrament of the Holy Eucharist after the consecration of the bread and the wine, our Lord Jesus Christ, true God and true man, is truly, really, and substantially contained under this species.
  zh: 特利腾大会议教导：在至圣圣餐中，面饼与酒祝圣后，我们的主耶稣基督——真实的神和真实的人——真实地、真正地、实体地临在于这些外形之下。
- start: 138.799
  end: 142.399
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: That means appearances of those sensible things.
  zh: 即那些可感知之物的外观。
- start: 142.399
  end: 153.379
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: So, uh, side, the word species, when we use it in Catholic theology, is simply, um, m- taking, um, the Latin word species, which means appearances.
  zh: 公教神学中使用的「外形」一词，直接取自拉丁文species，意为表象。
- start: 153.379
  end: 159.019
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And in negative form, the, um, Council of Trent says this.
  zh: 特利腾大会议以否定句式宣称：
- start: 159.019
  end: 179.259
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: '"If anyone denies that the body and blood, together with the soul and divinity of our Lord Jesus Christ, and therefore the whole Christ, is truly, really, and substantially contained in the sacrament of the most holy Eucharist, but says that Christ is present in this sacrament only as in a sign, or figure, or by His power, let him be anathema." All right.'
  zh: 「若有人否认我主耶稣基督的体血连同其灵魂与神性——即整个基督——真实、真正、实体地临在于至圣圣餐中，而声称基督在此圣事中仅以记号、象征或能力方式临在，当受咒诅。」
- start: 179.259
  end: 181.719
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: So we can see that's an infallible teaching, right?
  zh: 可见这是不可错误的教导，对吗？
- start: 181.719
  end: 186.699
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: That can't be changed and requires our, um, firm belief.
  zh: 这是不可更改且需要我们坚定相信的。
- start: 186.699
  end: 190.979
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Christ is truly, really, and substantially contained.
  zh: 基督是真实、真正且实体地临在。
- start: 190.979
  end: 197.859
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And notice, it's not, um, it's not simply repetition to add substantially, because there can...
  zh: 注意，「实体地」并非简单重复——因为基督...
- start: 197.859
  end: 201.139
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Christ is present in different ways in the world.
  zh: 在世界上以不同方式临在。
- start: 201.139
  end: 209.159
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Um, Christ is present, um, in this room, because two or three are present here, um, in His name.
  zh: 基督此刻临在于这个房间，因为有两三个人奉他的名聚集。
- start: 209.159
  end: 217.059
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Um, Christ is present in the Word of God proclaimed, Christ is present, um, in, um, in many different ways, right?
  zh: 基督临在于宣讲的神的话语中，也以多种方式临在。
- start: 217.059
  end: 217.899
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: In icons.
  zh: 在圣像中。
- start: 217.899
  end: 221.479
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: But He's present substantially only in the Eucharist.
  zh: 但唯有在圣餐中，祂是实体地临在。
- start: 221.479
  end: 232.699
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: That means only in the Eucharist is He present, outside of Heaven, that is, in the fullness of His personal reality, including His body, His blood, His soul, as well as His divinity.
  zh: 这意味着在天堂之外，唯有圣餐中完整临在着祂位格的全部现实——包括身体、血、灵魂及神性。
- start: 232.699
  end: 233.199
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Right?
  zh: 对吗？
- start: 233.199
  end: 239.099
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: So, substantially contained, meaning in the whole substance of His humanity and divinity.
  zh: 所谓「实体地临在」，即祂人性与神性整个实体都在其中。
- start: 239.099
  end: 246.159
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And that's, um, also proclaimed in the Catechism of the Catholic Church 1374.
  zh: 这也在《公教会教理》1374条中申明。
- start: 246.159
  end: 247.919
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Right?
  zh: 对吧？
- start: 247.919
  end: 250.619
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Simply repeats the definition of Trent.
  zh: 完全重述了特利腾的定义。
- start: 250.619
  end: 263.499
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: But it goes on, in 1374, the Catechism, to say, to explain a little further, "This presence is called real, by which is not intended to exclude other kinds of presence, as if they could not be real too." Right?
  zh: 《要理》1374条进一步解释：「这种临在被称为真实的，但并非要排除其他也可能是真实的临在方式。」
- start: 263.499
  end: 268.699
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: As He's present, say, in the Word of God, or He's present, um, where we are gathered together.
  zh: 比如祂临在于神的话语中，或临在于我们聚会之处。
- start: 268.699
  end: 281.879
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Um, "but because it's present in the fullest sense, that is a substantial presence, by which Christ, God and man, makes Himself wholly and entirely present." All right?
  zh: 「而是因为这是最完满的临在——即实体性的临在，基督作为神人完整无缺地临现于此。」
- start: 281.879
  end: 283.619
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: That's the faith of the Church-
  zh: 这是教会的信仰——
- start: 283.619
  end: 283.739
  speaker: speaker_1
  en: Mm-hmm.
  zh: 嗯。
- start: 283.739
  end: 283.739
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: "..."
  zh: ……
- start: 283.739
  end: 284.699
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: in the real presence.
  zh: 关于真实临在的信仰。
- start: 284.699
  end: 288.719
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And theologians don't demonstrate that, but start from that.
  zh: 神学家不是论证这点，而是以此为出发点。
- start: 288.719
  end: 289.239
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: All right?
  zh: 明白吗？
- start: 289.239
  end: 291.779
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: So, that's St. Thomas' starting point.
  zh: 这就是圣托马斯的出发点。
- start: 291.779
  end: 303.639
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Now, um, another thing that he uses in his explanation of transubstantiation is what we covered in the last talk, the distinction of accidents and substance.
  zh: 他在解释变质说时运用的另一个概念，就是我们上回谈到的偶性与实体的区分。
- start: 303.639
  end: 304.139
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: All right?
  zh: 对吧？
- start: 304.139
  end: 316.179
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: So, again, the accidents are the changeable conditions and appearances which don't directly belong to the essence of a thing, but, um, answer the question how something is.
  zh: 偶性指可变的属性与外观，虽不直接属于事物本质，但能说明事物「如何存在」。
- start: 316.179
  end: 324.159
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And we know something, first, precisely by its accidents, um, and from them, we infer the substance.
  zh: 我们首先通过偶性认知事物，进而推断其实体。
- start: 324.159
  end: 325.139
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: All right?
  zh: 对吗？
- start: 325.139
  end: 331.199
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Whereas the substance is the abiding subject, um, that answers the question, what is it?
  zh: 而实体是恒存的主体，回答「是什么」的问题。
- start: 331.199
  end: 340.819
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: St. Thomas takes that, um, distinction from the, we could say, from Aristotle, but more importantly, from the philosophy of common sense.
  zh: 圣托马斯这一区分虽可溯至亚里士多德，但更源于常识哲学。
- start: 340.819
  end: 341.959
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: It's not just Aristotle.
  zh: 不限于亚里士多德。
- start: 341.959
  end: 347.739
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: All of us experience this distinction between what something is and how it appears.
  zh: 我们都体验过事物本质与表象的差异。
- start: 347.739
  end: 348.779
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: All right?
  zh: 对吧？
- start: 348.779
  end: 352.719
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: So, we could call it the patrimony of the philosophy of common sense.
  zh: 可谓常识哲学的遗产。
- start: 352.719
  end: 359.099
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And then, we s- see that in Jesus' words at the Last Supper.
  zh: 这在耶稣最后晚餐的话中可见：
- start: 359.099
  end: 359.839
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Right?
  zh: 对吗？
- start: 359.839
  end: 368.662
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And so, St. Thomas explains that the very language of Jesus' words at the Last Supper, the institution narrative......
  zh: 圣托马斯指出，耶稣设立圣餐时的表述本身...
- start: 368.662
  end: 377.061
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: requires us to, um, to believe that one substance is con- converted into another.
  zh: 要求我们相信一个实体转化为另一个实体。
- start: 377.061
  end: 378.082
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Right?
  zh: 对吧？
- start: 378.082
  end: 384.441
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Because Jesus said, "This..." Which before the consecration, be- at the beginning of the sentence, the this was bread.
  zh: 因为耶稣说「这...」——祝圣前指面饼。
- start: 384.441
  end: 392.382
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: But he says, "This is my body." And thus, at the end of the sentence, it's no longer bread, but his body.
  zh: 但他说「这是我的身体」——此时「这」已非面饼，而是他的身体。
- start: 392.382
  end: 397.001
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And that's because Jesus' words are omnipotent words, right?
  zh: 因耶稣的话是全能的。
- start: 397.001
  end: 398.301
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Which do what they say.
  zh: 言出必成。
- start: 398.301
  end: 403.921
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: So, one this into another this, one substance into another substance.
  zh: 故一个「这」转化为另一个「这」，一个实体转化为另一个实体。
- start: 403.921
  end: 405.382
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Right?
  zh: 对吗？
- start: 405.382
  end: 408.041
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: But the appearances of the first one remain.
  zh: 但前者的外观仍存留。
- start: 408.041
  end: 409.341
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: All right.
  zh: 好。
- start: 409.341
  end: 411.742
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Are there any other options?
  zh: 还有其他可能性吗？
- start: 411.742
  end: 422.361
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: So, Saint Thomas, in treating the real presence, he starts with the question, "Is Christ really present?" And he answers, "Yes," based on the authority of Christ and the faith of the church.
  zh: 圣托马斯论述真实临在时，先问「基督是否真实临在？」他根据基督的权威与教会信仰回答「是」。
- start: 422.361
  end: 427.301
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: But then in his second article on the real presence, he addresses the conversion.
  zh: 在关于真实临在的第二篇中，他探讨转化问题。
- start: 427.301
  end: 458.361
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And he poses the question, um, "Could Christ's real presence come about in any other way than through transubstantiation?" That is, could Christ become present, um, by moving into the host, um, and this was the, um, later would become the position of Martin Luther and, um, the Luther- our Lutheran brothers and sisters, often called consubstantiation.
  zh: 他提出：「基督真实临在能否通过变质说以外的方式实现？」即基督是否可通过进入面饼而非将面饼转化为祂来临在——这后来成为马丁·路德及路德宗「同质说」的立场。
- start: 458.361
  end: 459.001
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Right?
  zh: 对吗？
- start: 459.001
  end: 469.541
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: So, um, could Christ become present by moving into the bread and wine instead of through the conversion of the bread and wine into him?
  zh: 那么基督是否可通过进入面饼与酒，而非将面饼与酒转化为祂来临在？
- start: 469.541
  end: 470.221
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Right?
  zh: 对吗？
- start: 470.221
  end: 472.101
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: So, that's the question he poses.
  zh: 这就是他提出的问题。
- start: 472.101
  end: 486.601
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And he answers that consubstantiation, um, Christ coming into the bread and wine is incompatible with the faith of the church for two reasons.
  zh: 他回答：同质说——即基督进入面饼与酒——与教会信仰相悖，原因有二。
- start: 486.601
  end: 491.621
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: First, he thinks it's incompatible with the very words used by Christ.
  zh: 首先他认为这与基督的原话矛盾。
- start: 491.621
  end: 492.781
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Right?
  zh: 对吧？
- start: 492.781
  end: 500.721
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: '"This is my body." If the substance of bread remains and Christ simply comes into them, he should have said something different.'
  zh: 「这是我的身体。」若面饼实体仍在而基督只是进入其中，祂本应说「这里有我的身体」之类的话。
- start: 500.721
  end: 507.841
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: He should have said, "Here is my body." Or, "Here is also my body." Or, "My body is in the bread." Or something like that.
  zh: 祂本该说「这里有我的身体」「我的身体在面饼中」等。
- start: 507.841
  end: 508.921
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: But he doesn't say that.
  zh: 但祂没这么说。
- start: 508.921
  end: 518.121
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: He says, "This is my body." And so the meaning has to be, this substance, which was bread, is now my body.
  zh: 祂说「这是我的身体」——意味着曾是面饼的这个实体，现在成了祂的身体。
- start: 518.121
  end: 526.221
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: In other words, Christ's words imply a conversion of substance from one this into another this.
  zh: 换言之，基督的话暗示实体从「这个」转化为「那个」。
- start: 526.221
  end: 528.841
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Uh, that's Saint Thomas' first argument.
  zh: 这是圣托马斯的第一论据。
- start: 528.841
  end: 535.041
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And it had been- been made before his time by other theologians that we mentioned in the previous episode.
  zh: 这在他之前的神学家——如上集提到的——已有论述。
- start: 535.041
  end: 550.961
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: But Saint Thomas adds another argument then, and he explains, um, when we think about it, something can begin to be present in a new place in- in fundamentally two ways, and only two ways.
  zh: 圣托马斯补充第二论据：某物开始存在于新地点，根本只有两种方式。
- start: 550.961
  end: 553.921
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Um, let's take the example of a fire.
  zh: 以火为例。
- start: 553.921
  end: 557.601
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: A fire can be- begin to be present here, maybe ...
  zh: 火开始在此处出现...
- start: 557.601
  end: 561.701
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: God forbid, um, because something here is transformed into fire.
  zh: 但愿不会——是因某物转化为火。
- start: 561.701
  end: 568.961
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Let's say we get a spark and the wood of my podium becomes, um, on fire, and so the wood would be transformed into fire and ash.
  zh: 比如火花使讲台木材燃烧，转化为火与灰烬。
- start: 568.961
  end: 575.561
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Or it could come to be here by being brought here from another place.
  zh: 或火从别处被移至此。
- start: 575.561
  end: 575.761
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Right?
  zh: 对吗？
- start: 575.761
  end: 577.201
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Those are our two options.
  zh: 就这两种可能。
- start: 577.201
  end: 582.081
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Local movement or one thing converting into another.
  zh: 局部移动或一物转化为另一物。
- start: 582.081
  end: 584.961
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Let's take another example.
  zh: 再举一例。
- start: 584.961
  end: 599.161
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: The ordinary way in which a baby begins to be present in a mother's womb is by conversion of, um, in this case, the egg and the sperm, into, um, a new human being at the moment of conception.
  zh: 婴儿通常通过受精时卵子与精子转化为新人类而存在于母腹。
- start: 599.161
  end: 603.321
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: So, that would be conversion, egg and sperm into new human being.
  zh: 这是转化——配子成为新人。
- start: 603.321
  end: 620.801
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: But, um, another possibility, um, contrary to, um, Catholic moral theology would be in vitro fertilization, in which, um, the union is taking place in a test tube.
  zh: 另一种违背公教伦理的方式是试管受精——配子在试管结合。
- start: 620.801
  end: 627.501
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: It is then brought into the mother's womb, um, by local movement.
  zh: 再通过移动植入子宫。
- start: 627.501
  end: 627.821
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Right?
  zh: 对吧？
- start: 627.821
  end: 635.521
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: So, those are our two ways, local movement from one place into another, or conversion of one thing into another thing.
  zh: 总之两种方式：空间移动或实体转化。
- start: 635.521
  end: 637.401
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: All right.
  zh: 好。
- start: 637.401
  end: 641.081
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Which one is the case in- in the Eucharist?
  zh: 圣餐中是哪一种？
- start: 641.081
  end: 641.541
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Right?
  zh: 对吗？
- start: 641.541
  end: 657.141
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Is it that Christ, um, who is in heaven, right, descended into heaven 2,000 years ago, he remains there in his, um, in his normal mode of bodily presence, parts outside of other parts taking up space in heaven.
  zh: 是在天堂的基督——两千年前升天，以身体常态（各部分占据空间）临在于天堂...
- start: 657.141
  end: 661.301
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Um, is it that he comes down onto the altar by local movement?
  zh: "...通过移动降临祭坛？"
- start: 661.301
  end: 674.581
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Or is it that something here on the altar, the bread and the wine, are converted into him, making him present under their appearances which God miraculously upholds?
  zh: 还是祭坛上的面饼与酒转化为祂，使祂临在于神迹保存的外形之下？
- start: 674.581
  end: 676.321
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: All right.
  zh: 好。
- start: 676.321
  end: 681.041
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: The faith of- faith of the church is the second and not the first.
  zh: 教会信仰是第二种而非第一种。
- start: 681.041
  end: 681.881
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Right?
  zh: 对吗？
- start: 681.881
  end: 684.201
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: We may imagine it in the first way, right?
  zh: 我们可能想象第一种方式。
- start: 684.201
  end: 687.961
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: We sometimes use that language of Christ coming down onto the altar.
  zh: 有时会说「基督降临祭坛」。
- start: 687.961
  end: 691.721
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: I speak that way too, but we have to understand that that's a metaphor.
  zh: 我也这样说，但要明白这是比喻。
- start: 691.721
  end: 694.201
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: What's really happening is in some way the opposite.
  zh: 实际发生的情形某种程度上正相反。
- start: 694.201
  end: 712.601
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: It's the bread and the wine on the altar that are converted into Christ's body and blood while the accidents or- or appearance of the bread and wine remain here, and Jesus becomes now present under those appearances with the whole of his body and blood, soul and divinity.
  zh: 是祭坛上的面饼与酒转化为基督的体血，而其偶性（外形）留存，耶稣以整个身体、血、灵魂及神性临在于这些外形之下。
- start: 712.601
  end: 717.141
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: In other words, not local movement, but conversion.
  zh: 换言之，非空间移动，而是转化。
- start: 717.141
  end: 717.581
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Right?
  zh: 对吧？
- start: 717.581
  end: 719.261
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And we saw that was defined...
  zh: 我们已看到...
- start: 719.261
  end: 727.501
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Berengaris had to swear that, that Christ became present by substantial conversion of the bread and the wine into him.
  zh: 贝伦加尔被迫宣誓承认：基督通过面饼与酒实体性地转化为祂而临在。
- start: 727.501
  end: 732.867
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And he had denied that, thinking that the bread and the wine simply remain unchanged....
  zh: 他曾否认这点，认为面饼与酒本质未变...
- start: 732.867
  end: 733.867
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: after the consecration, right?
  zh: "...祝圣后仍存留。"
- start: 733.867
  end: 735.267
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Then that's heretical.
  zh: 这是异端观点。
- start: 735.267
  end: 735.788
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Right?
  zh: 对吗？
- start: 735.788
  end: 745.467
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: We can't hold that the bread and the wine remain after the consecration because that's how Jesus becomes present, the bread and the wine becoming him.
  zh: 我们不能认为祝圣后面饼与酒仍存留，因耶稣是通过它们转化为祂而临在。
- start: 745.467
  end: 746.708
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: All right.
  zh: 好。
- start: 746.708
  end: 748.967
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Why couldn't it be local movement though?
  zh: 但为何不能是空间移动？
- start: 748.967
  end: 752.488
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And it's very simple, right?
  zh: 很简单。
- start: 752.488
  end: 760.507
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: If Jesus became present in the Eucharist through local movement, various impossible things or absurd things would have to occur.
  zh: 若耶稣通过移动临在于圣餐，会导致种种不可能或荒谬之事。
- start: 760.507
  end: 763.287
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: He would have to travel from where he is in heaven.
  zh: 祂需从天庭出发。
- start: 763.287
  end: 767.288
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: In other words, local movement involves going through all the intermediate places.
  zh: 空间移动需经过所有中间地点。
- start: 767.288
  end: 778.107
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Now, those intermediate places, uh, we don't know exactly where heaven is, um, but nevertheless, it's a place clearly not accessible to us in this, in our-
  zh: 我们虽不知天堂确切位置，但显然非人间可达。
- start: 778.227
  end: 778.627
  speaker: speaker_2
  en: Yeah.
  zh: 是的。
- start: 778.627
  end: 778.907
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: "..."
  zh: ……
- start: 778.907
  end: 779.588
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: place on Earth.
  zh: 在地球上。
- start: 779.588
  end: 785.968
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Um, and he would have to travel through the intermediate places to get to our altar here in Steubenville.
  zh: 祂需穿越中间空间来到我们斯图本维尔的祭坛。
- start: 785.968
  end: 804.287
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Another problem is, he's through transubstan- through, in, in the Eucharist, he becomes present on many altars simultaneously, and a body, through local movement, um, has to leave the place where it is, end up in a new place, and he can't end up in multiple places.
  zh: 另一问题是：圣餐中祂同时临在于无数祭坛——而身体通过移动需离开原处到达新处，无法同时处于多地。
- start: 804.287
  end: 809.267
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Um, so there are various, um...
  zh: 因此存在诸多...
- start: 809.267
  end: 811.007
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: and it would take time as well, et cetera.
  zh: 还需时间等因素。
- start: 811.007
  end: 816.667
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Um, and none of this clearly is, um, what we believe about the Eucharist.
  zh: 这些显然不符合我们对圣餐的信仰。
- start: 816.667
  end: 831.847
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Um, and what's happening is rather the reverse, the bread and the wine that's on many altars in many parts of the world, all of that is converted into the same one preexisting Christ who remains in heaven.
  zh: 实际发生的是相反过程：全球各处祭坛上的面饼与酒，都转化为同一位早已存在、仍在天堂的基督。
- start: 831.847
  end: 835.447
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Christ doesn't leave heaven in, in the Eucharist.
  zh: 圣餐中基督并未离开天堂。
- start: 835.447
  end: 848.307
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: It's that the bread and the wine are converted into him, but the appearances of the bread and wine remain here, and Christ now becomes mysteriously, sacramentally present under them.
  zh: 是面饼与酒转化为祂，其外形留存，基督以圣事性奥秘临在于此外形之下。
- start: 848.307
  end: 869.207
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Under them if we consider them as sacramental veils that veil his real presence here where those accidents of the bread and the wine remain, and in our very bodies, when we take those appearances of bread and wine into ourselves, we take Christ's whole person into ourselves.
  zh: 若视这些外形为圣事面纱，遮掩祂真实临在——当我们将面饼与酒的外形摄入体内时，实将基督整个位格纳入己身。
- start: 869.207
  end: 875.647
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: So not by local movement, but rather by conversion of bread and wine into him.
  zh: 故非通过移动，而是面饼与酒转化为祂。
- start: 875.647
  end: 890.267
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: He now becomes present, see, Thomas explains, in a way analogous to how the bread and the wine were present, um, before the transubstantiation.
  zh: 托马斯解释：祂现在的临在方式，类似于变质前面饼与酒的临在方式。
- start: 890.267
  end: 901.067
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Before the transubstantiation, um, the substance of bread and wine was present whole and entire under every part of the appearances of the bread and wine, right?
  zh: 变质前，面饼与酒的实体完整临在于其外形的每一部分。
- start: 901.067
  end: 913.247
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: After the transubstantiation, instead of the bread and the wine being present as substances, Christ is now present in, in an analogous way, whole and entire under every part.
  zh: 变质后，基督以类似方式完整临在于每一部分——取代了面饼与酒的实体。
- start: 913.247
  end: 914.967
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: We'll come back to that in a minute.
  zh: 稍后再谈这点。
- start: 914.967
  end: 932.527
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Now, another very odd thing about this is it's different from other conversions we've said because in other conversions, let's say the wood into ash or the egg and the sperm into the, the new human being, um, a new thing is created.
  zh: 另一奇特之处在于：不同于木材成灰或配子成胎等转化会创造新事物...
- start: 932.527
  end: 941.887
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: But in the case of transubstantiation, Christ, um, is made present, and he existed before.
  zh: 变质说中，基督是预先存在的位格被呈现。
- start: 941.887
  end: 943.267
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: In other words, he's not...
  zh: 换言之...
- start: 943.267
  end: 947.987
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: nothing new is brought into existence, and he's unchanged by it.
  zh: 没有新事物被创造，祂本身也未改变。
- start: 947.987
  end: 958.087
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: But of course, it enables him to become present now here through the appearances of bread and wine which are here.
  zh: 当然，这使祂能通过此地现存的面饼与酒外形临在。
- start: 958.087
  end: 970.007
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: The conversion of the bread and the wine into Christ rather than the local movement is what enables Christ to be present on many, many altars all at the same time, and many tabernacles, right?
  zh: 正是面饼与酒转化为基督（而非空间移动），使祂能同时临在于无数祭坛与圣体龛中。
- start: 970.007
  end: 973.187
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Because in each tabernacle, it's not a different Christ.
  zh: 每个圣体龛中的都是同一位基督。
- start: 973.187
  end: 981.407
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: It's the same Christ who's present under the appearances of bread and wine which are locally here.
  zh: 是同一位基督临在于本地现存的面饼与酒外形之下。
- start: 981.407
  end: 993.567
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: In other words, um, with their quantity taking up space in the tabernacle, making Christ present, whole and entire under them, and the same Christ in every place, because all of those...
  zh: 即面饼与酒的体积占据圣体龛空间，使基督完整临在于其下——各地都是同一位基督，因所有...
- start: 993.567
  end: 998.847
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: transubstantiation converted all of those hosts into the one Christ.
  zh: "...变质说将所有面饼转化为同一位基督。"
- start: 998.847
  end: 1004.407
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And, and so this is what the church understands by the term transubstantiation.
  zh: 这就是教会对「变质说」的理解。
- start: 1004.407
  end: 1026.107
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: So I'm gonna go back again to the Council of Trent, which defines it as, "A change of the whole substance of bread into the substance of the body of Christ and a change of the whole substance of wine into the substance of his blood." This change, the Holy Catholic Church has fittingly and properly named transubstantiation.
  zh: 特利腾大会议定义：「面饼的整个实体转化为基督身体的实体，酒的整个实体转化为祂血的实体——公教会恰当地称此变化为变质说。」
- start: 1026.107
  end: 1039.067
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: So Saint Thomas, in speaking about this, says that such a change cannot be made by a finite agent, but only by an infinite agent.
  zh: 圣托马斯指出：这种转变非受造者所能，唯无限者可为。
- start: 1039.067
  end: 1041.527
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: That is, by God's own omnipotence.
  zh: 即神的全能。
- start: 1041.527
  end: 1045.967
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: So it's not hard for God, but it's impossible for a creature.
  zh: 这对神不难，对受造物却不可能。
- start: 1045.967
  end: 1050.947
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: A creature can bring about change by causing accidental change.
  zh: 受造物只能引发表面变化。
- start: 1050.947
  end: 1060.767
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: In other words, fire brings about, works on wood by causing accidental changes until the wood can no longer remain wood and becomes another thing, ash.
  zh: 如火烧木导致偶性变化，直至木材无法保持原状而化为灰烬。
- start: 1060.767
  end: 1068.747
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Um, but what we can't do is simply instantaneously take one substance and make it into another substance.
  zh: 但我们无法瞬间将一实体变为另一实体。
- start: 1068.747
  end: 1079.867
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: But the divine omnipotence can do this, and that's obvious because the divine omnipotence simply has to say the word and something comes to be.
  zh: 神的全能却可——因祂一言即有万物。
- start: 1079.867
  end: 1093.027
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: So Saint Thomas explains, "Such a change can be made by the power of an infinite agent which has control over all being because the nature of being is common to both." Right?
  zh: 圣托马斯解释：「无限者掌控万有，因存在本质相通，故能实现此转变。」
- start: 1093.027
  end: 1095.087
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: The wine in Christ's body...
  zh: 基督身体中的酒...
- start: 1095.087
  end: 1100.682
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: I'm sorry, the, the bread in Christ's body, the wine in Christ's blood....
  zh: 抱歉——面饼成为基督身体，酒成为祂的血...
- start: 1100.682
  end: 1112.661
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: and whatever there is of being in the one, the author of being can change into whatever, ever there is of being in the author, withdrawing all that whereby one was distinguished from the other.
  zh: "...存在之源能将一物之存在完全转化为另一存在，消除所有差异。"
- start: 1112.661
  end: 1127.601
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: In other words, God simply makes in Christ, right, in his divinity, which is working through his human words as instruments, simply takes the reality of the bread and, and makes it into the reality of his body.
  zh: 即神通过基督的神性——以祂的人言为工具——将面饼实体转化为祂身体的实体。
- start: 1127.601
  end: 1134.221
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And likewise with the wine, making it into the reality of his blood.
  zh: 酒亦如此转化为祂血的实体。
- start: 1134.221
  end: 1139.082
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: For God, this is not a difficulty, right?
  zh: 这对神并非难事。
- start: 1139.082
  end: 1141.041
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: It's rather a piece of cake.
  zh: 轻而易举。
- start: 1141.041
  end: 1148.101
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Um, what's difficult though is precisely, um, what this makes present, his sacrifice, right?
  zh: 真正困难的是此转变所呈现的——祂的牺牲。
- start: 1148.101
  end: 1151.601
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: In other words, his sacrifice which cost him all of his blood.
  zh: 即祂倾尽鲜血的牺牲。
- start: 1151.601
  end: 1156.921
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: The real presence though is not difficult for God to bring about, understand.
  zh: 但真实临在对神而言不难实现。
- start: 1156.921
  end: 1163.601
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: So, why does God retain the appearances of the bread and the wine?
  zh: 那么神为何保留面饼与酒的外形？
- start: 1163.601
  end: 1174.101
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And, and I think we've already answered this, um, so that we can receive him in a fitting way under the appearance of what we normally eat and drink.
  zh: 我想已回答过——为使我们能以日常饮食的外形合宜地领受祂。
- start: 1174.101
  end: 1182.421
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And then secondly, to give us the merit of faith, believing what we don't see, right?
  zh: 其次为赐我们信心之功——相信未见之事。
- start: 1182.421
  end: 1191.361
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: What we doubly don't see in, um, in the incarnation, Christ, right, was seen in his humanity but not in his divinity.
  zh: 道成肉身中，我们未见祂的神性；圣餐中，我们人性与神性俱未见。
- start: 1191.361
  end: 1195.441
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: In the Eucharist, he's seen in neither, and we have the merit of both.
  zh: 却因此获得双倍信心之功。
- start: 1195.441
  end: 1205.081
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And third, the bread and the wine remain the appear...
  zh: 第三，面饼与酒的外形...
- start: 1205.081
  end: 1206.341
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Sorry, not the bread and the wine.
  zh: 抱歉——不是面饼与酒本身。
- start: 1206.341
  end: 1214.661
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: The appearances of the bread and wine remain after the consecration, um, to make present Christ's body and blood under them, right?
  zh: 祝圣后面饼与酒的外形留存，为呈现其下的基督体血。
- start: 1214.661
  end: 1223.901
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: As long as the appearances or accidents of the bread and wine remain, Christ's whole personal presence is under them, right?
  zh: 只要面饼与酒的偶性存留，基督整个位格就临在于其下。
- start: 1223.901
  end: 1237.241
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: When we receive communion, after about 10 minutes, our digestive powers break down those appearances, and it's at moment, um, when the appearances cease, um, Christ's real presence likewise ceases.
  zh: 领圣餐约十分钟后，消化作用破坏这些外形——外形消失时，基督的真实临在也随之终止。
- start: 1237.241
  end: 1246.121
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And so for about 10 minutes after receiving communion, each one of us is a tabernacle containing Christ's body, blood, soul, and divinity.
  zh: 因此领圣餐后约十分钟内，我们每人都是承载基督体血、灵魂与神性的活圣体龛。
- start: 1246.121
  end: 1254.041
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: After the 10 minutes, that sureness of divinity continues to nourish us, but his humanity is no longer present.
  zh: 十分钟后，神性仍滋养我们，但人性不再临在。
- start: 1254.041
  end: 1260.201
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And so the appearance of the bread and wine are very, are crucial to the...
  zh: 因此面饼与酒的外形至关重要...
- start: 1260.201
  end: 1267.581
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: that means by which Christ becomes present here in our space and time, um, wherever we happen to be.
  zh: "...是基督临在于我们时空中的媒介。"
- start: 1267.581
  end: 1271.061
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Right?
  zh: 对吗？
- start: 1271.061
  end: 1282.021
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And it's not contradictory that the appearances, the accidents of bread and wine remain, even though the substance of bread and wine has been, uh, converted into Christ.
  zh: 面饼与酒的偶性留存而其实体转化为基督，这并不矛盾。
- start: 1282.021
  end: 1284.361
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And that's, again, simply the divine omnipotence.
  zh: 这仍是神的大能。
- start: 1284.361
  end: 1294.301
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: This, the divine omnipotence, just as it can make one substance into another substance, so it can sustain the accidents without a proper substance.
  zh: 神的全能既能转变实体，也能维持无实体的偶性。
- start: 1294.301
  end: 1299.281
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: So, before transubstantiation, when I, when the...
  zh: 变质前...
- start: 1299.281
  end: 1304.861
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: before the priest does the consecration, there are simply pieces of bread on the altar, right?
  zh: "...祭司祝圣前，祭坛上只是面饼。"
- start: 1304.861
  end: 1316.141
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And under those pieces of bread, um, there was the substance, and the appearances or accidents of the bread adhered, had their being in the substance.
  zh: 面饼实体承载其偶性（外形）。
- start: 1316.141
  end: 1317.641
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And the same for the wine, right?
  zh: 酒亦如此。
- start: 1317.641
  end: 1319.321
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: As in every other thing.
  zh: 万物皆然。
- start: 1319.321
  end: 1330.221
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And when that substance is, is converted, God sustains the accidents doing what previously the bread did.
  zh: 实体转化后，神维系偶性——取代原先面饼的功能。
- start: 1330.221
  end: 1333.701
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: In other words, um, they had their being in the bread previously.
  zh: 即偶性原先依存于面饼。
- start: 1333.701
  end: 1339.921
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Now, God simply upholds them in being without them enduring in the bread.
  zh: 如今神直接维持其存在，无需面饼支撑。
- start: 1339.921
  end: 1341.741
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: It, they're still accidents.
  zh: 它们仍是偶性。
- start: 1341.741
  end: 1356.441
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: In other words, they still have the nature such that they would inhere in the substance of bread, but God is holding them in being without the aid of the bread and the wine, um, and he's powerful to do that because he's God.
  zh: 即仍具依存于面饼实体的本性，但神无需面饼与酒即能维持其存在——因祂是神。
- start: 1356.441
  end: 1362.801
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And he sustains them precisely so that we can receive Christ under them.
  zh: 神维系这些外形，正是为使我们能在其下领受基督。
- start: 1362.801
  end: 1371.661
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: As we said, the whole substance of Christ is present "under" us, right?
  zh: 如前所述，基督整个实体「在」外形之下。
- start: 1371.661
  end: 1372.821
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: These quotes, right?
  zh: 用引号表示。
- start: 1372.821
  end: 1378.701
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: So we're using it analogously under any part of the appearance of bread and wine.
  zh: 我们类比性地用于面饼与酒外形的任何部分。
- start: 1378.701
  end: 1383.141
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And if we break it in half, Christ remains whole and entire in each half, right?
  zh: 若掰开两半，基督完整临在于每一半。
- start: 1383.141
  end: 1396.441
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: As we explained, Christ, um, in the Eucharist is present in the same manner analogously as the substance of the bread and wine was present, um, prior to the consecration.
  zh: 如前解释：圣餐中基督的临在方式，类比于祝圣前面饼与酒实体的临在方式。
- start: 1396.441
  end: 1399.501
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And that is whole and entire under every part.
  zh: 即在每一部分下完整临在。
- start: 1399.501
  end: 1412.821
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And so he's, Christ becomes present in the Eucharist, not in the mode of quantity with parts outside of other parts, measured that we could take a ruler to, but he's present whole and entire under every part.
  zh: 故基督临在于圣餐，非以可测量的空间分布方式，而是完整临在于每一部分。
- start: 1412.821
  end: 1416.941
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And that's why Christ who's, let's assume six feet tall, right?
  zh: 因此假设身高六尺的基督...
- start: 1416.941
  end: 1423.981
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: In heaven, um, fits under any size Eucharist because he's present whole and entire.
  zh: "...在天堂却能临在于任何尺寸的圣餐中——因祂完整临在。"
- start: 1423.981
  end: 1434.001
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: He's not present in the mode of quantity that we could measure with a ruler, but he's present in the mode of substance, and that means whole and entire under every part.
  zh: 祂非以可测量的空间方式，而以实体方式临在——即在每一部分下完整临在。
- start: 1434.001
  end: 1437.201
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: The best analogy, it falls short, is our soul, right?
  zh: 最接近的类比是灵魂——虽不完美。
- start: 1437.201
  end: 1440.901
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Because we're whole and entire in our animating our whole body.
  zh: 因我们灵魂完整地激活全身。
- start: 1440.901
  end: 1442.961
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: But let's not be confused here.
  zh: 但切勿混淆。
- start: 1442.961
  end: 1447.081
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: It's not just Jesus' soul that's present in the Eucharist, it's the whole of him, right?
  zh: 圣餐中临在的不只是耶稣的灵魂，而是祂的整个位格。
- start: 1447.081
  end: 1450.261
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: We say body, blood, soul, and divinity.
  zh: 即身体、血、灵魂与神性。
- start: 1450.261
  end: 1457.381
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: He's wholly present under every part of the quantity of the bread and the wine.
  zh: 祂完整临在于面饼与酒体积的每一部分下。
- start: 1457.381
  end: 1461.507
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Now, this is not i- in, in speaking about......
  zh: 圣托马斯论及...
- start: 1461.507
  end: 1465.807
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: substance and quantity, Saint Thomas, he isn't trying to, again, demonstrate anything.
  zh: "...实体与量时，并非试图论证什么。"
- start: 1465.807
  end: 1477.687
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: It's just simply how should we think about Christ's presence on the basis of Jesus' words and the church's universal liturgical, um, practice and faith.
  zh: 只是根据耶稣的话与教会普世礼仪实践及信仰，我们应如何理解基督的临在。
- start: 1477.687
  end: 1484.607
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And so, Christ is present in the mode of substance, not in the mode of quantity.
  zh: 因此基督以实体方式而非空间方式临在。
- start: 1484.607
  end: 1497.227
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And that's simply explaining, or maybe not explaining, it's speaking rightly about what we all know when receiving the Eucharist, that it doesn't matter what size host we receive, we receive the whole Jesus Christ.
  zh: 这不过是正确表述我们领圣餐时的共识：无论面饼大小，我们领受的都是完整的耶稣基督。
- start: 1497.227
  end: 1503.707
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And it doesn't matter if we receive under both species or just one, we receive the whole Jesus Christ.
  zh: 无论领一种或两种外形，领受的都是完整的耶稣基督。
- start: 1503.707
  end: 1506.187
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Right?
  zh: 对吗？
- start: 1506.187
  end: 1512.048
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And that's what we call concomitance, that the whole of him, um, comes along, right?
  zh: 这就是所谓的「连带性」——祂的整个位格随之临在。
- start: 1512.048
  end: 1517.488
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Even though, so Saint Thomas says, "The words of institution directly have one effect, right?
  zh: 圣托马斯指出：「设立圣餐的话直接产生一个效果——
- start: 1517.488
  end: 1527.827
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: '''This is my body,'' makes his body present." But when one thing becomes present, everything else that''s really joined to it also becomes present, right?'
  zh: 『这是我的身体』使祂身体临在。」但一物临在时，与之真实结合的一切也随之临在。
- start: 1527.827
  end: 1534.347
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And so, the whole of Christ becomes present, um, through concomitance.
  zh: 因此基督整个位格通过连带性临在。
- start: 1534.347
  end: 1538.027
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And here, Saint Thomas does a thought experiment, which is interesting.
  zh: 圣托马斯在此做了个思想实验：
- start: 1538.027
  end: 1544.927
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Let's imagine for a second that Holy Mass had been celebrated by, let's say, Saint Peter on Holy Saturday.
  zh: 假设圣彼得在圣周六举行弥撒——
- start: 1544.927
  end: 1545.267
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: All right.
  zh: 当然实际上没有——
- start: 1545.267
  end: 1559.007
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Well, nobody celebrated Mass on Holy Saturday, but let's just suppose that Mass had, had been celebrated then, um, the words of, of institution, of the institution narrative, "This is my body," would've made his body present as it then was.
  zh: 若当时举行弥撒，『这是我的身体』这句话会使祂当时状态的身体临在。
- start: 1559.007
  end: 1561.987
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And at that moment, it was dead in the tomb.
  zh: 那时祂的身体在坟墓中已无生命。
- start: 1561.987
  end: 1570.107
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: He was still united to his divinity, um, but his blood was not united to his body, but was separated from it.
  zh: 仍与神性结合，但血已与身体分离。
- start: 1570.107
  end: 1580.987
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And so, the words over the chalice would've made his blood present, his blood present, um, united to his divinity, but not united either to his body or to his soul.
  zh: 因此圣爵祝圣会使祂的血临在——与神性结合，却与身体和灵魂分离。
- start: 1580.987
  end: 1583.747
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: But on Easter Sunday, Jesus rose from the dead.
  zh: 但复活节主日，耶稣从死里复活。
- start: 1583.747
  end: 1592.847
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And so, from that point on, it's impossible to make his body present without his blood, his soul, and his divinity coming along for the ride, as it were.
  zh: 从此以后，要使祂身体临在，血、灵魂与神性必随之临在。
- start: 1592.847
  end: 1599.747
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And likewise, impossible to make his blood present without his body, soul, and divinity coming present likewise.
  zh: 要使祂血临在，身体、灵魂与神性亦必随之临在。
- start: 1599.747
  end: 1607.187
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: But still, we need to celebrate Eucharist under both species always to make his sacrifice present.
  zh: 但我们仍需同时领受两种外形，以呈现祂的牺牲。
- start: 1607.187
  end: 1624.167
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And so, this too was defined in the Council of Trent, "If anyone denies that in the venerable sacrament of the Eucharist the whole Christ is contained under each species and under each and every portion of either species when divided up, let him be anathema." Right?
  zh: 特利腾大会议定义：「若有人否认在可敬的圣餐中，整个基督临在于每种外形及每一分开的部分中，当受咒诅。」
- start: 1624.167
  end: 1641.447
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: So Christ, in summary, Christ, um, becomes present in this unique way, the conversion of substance of bread and wine into him, and he remains present under those appearances as long as they retain their own being.
  zh: 总之，基督以这种独特方式临在——面饼与酒的实体转化为祂，只要外形存留，祂就持续临在。
- start: 1641.447
  end: 1651.767
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: That is, until we digest them, um, and he remains present in the mode of substance, that is, whole and entire under every part.
  zh: 即直到我们消化外形为止——祂以实体方式临在，完整存在于每一部分下。
- start: 1651.767
  end: 1658.227
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And that means that the whole of him is received by us in holy communion and nothing is left out.
  zh: 意味着我们领圣餐时领受了完整的祂，毫无遗漏。
- start: 1658.227
  end: 1671.467
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And in all of this, we haven't demonstrated anything, but we're simply, um, seeking to, uh, express what it is that we believe in the mystery of the Eucharist.
  zh: 这一切并非论证，而是表述我们对圣餐奥秘的信仰。
- start: 1671.467
  end: 1682.747
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: And the reason we believe it is because of Christ's words, right, which say this, and we know he has the power to make those words true.
  zh: 我们相信是因基督的话——我们知道祂有能力使这些话成真。
- start: 1682.747
  end: 1684.067
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: '"This is my body.'
  zh: 「这是我的身体。
- start: 1684.067
  end: 1699.847
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: This is my blood." Saint Thomas has a marvelous hymn, um, Adoro Te Devote, in which, um, he speaks about how our senses are deceived, our senses of seeing, touching, and tasting, but hearing is not deceived, right?
  zh: 这是我的血。」圣托马斯在《虔诚朝拜》圣诗中写道：视觉、触觉、味觉都会受骗，唯独听觉不会——因我们听见基督亲口说『这是我的身体』。
- start: 1699.847
  end: 1710.927
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Because we hear Christ's own word, "This is my body." I will leave it there, and in the next episode, we'll take up, um, the sacrifice of the Mass.
  zh: 下集我们将探讨弥撒祭献。
- start: 1710.927
  end: 1722.767
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: We give you thanks, almighty God, for the gift of the Eucharist and the real presence of our Lord Jesus Christ, um, in the Eucharist in every tabernacle of the world.
  zh: 全能的神，我们感谢祢赐下圣餐，使主耶稣基督真实临在于世间每个圣体龛中。
- start: 1722.767
  end: 1724.347
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: Amen.
  zh: 阿们。
- start: 1724.347
  end: 1726.587
  speaker: speaker_0
  en: In the name of the Father, Son, and the Holy Spirit.
  zh: 因父、及子、及圣灵之名。
