- start: 2.895
  end: 8.216999999999999
  speaker: xxx
  en: For God is good, or rather of all goodness, He is fountainhead.
  zh: 因为神本为善，或者更确切地说，他是一切美善的源头。
- start: 8.818
  end: 14.54
  speaker: xxx
  en: It is impossible for one who is good to be mean or grudging about anything.
  zh: 一个善良的人不可能对任何事情吝啬或怀有恶意。
- start: 15.16
  end: 18.262
  speaker: xxx
  en: Santa Athanasius on the Incarnation.
  zh: 圣亚他拿修论道成肉身。
- start: 19.522
  end: 21.163
  speaker: xxx
  en: Hello, my siblings in Christ!
  zh: 你们好，我在基督里的弟兄姊妹！
- start: 21.163
  end: 24.844
  speaker: xxx
  en: I'm Bojan, and today is the third birthday of this channel.
  zh: 我是博扬，今天是这个频道的三周年生日。
- start: 25.005
  end: 25.485
  speaker: xxx
  en: Yay!
  zh: 耶！
- start: 25.485
  end: 28.386
  speaker: xxx
  en: Happy birthday, Bible Illustrated YouTube channel!
  zh: 生日快乐，圣经图解 YouTube 频道！
- start: 28.666
  end: 32.948
  speaker: xxx
  en: In this long overdue video, we will talk about penal substitution.
  zh: 在这个期待已久的视频中，我们将谈论刑罚替代说。
- start: 33.325
  end: 39.129
  speaker: xxx
  en: Before we begin with this video, I highly suggest you watch my video Why Doesn't God Just Forgive?
  zh: 在开始这个视频之前，我强烈建议你观看我的视频《为什么神不直接宽恕？》
- start: 39.23
  end: 46.875
  speaker: xxx
  en: where I give an explanation of why Christ had to come in flesh in order to save us, as opposed to simply forgiving us our sins.
  zh: 在那里我解释了为什么基督必须道成肉身来拯救我们，而不是简单地赦免我们的罪。
- start: 47.356
  end: 51.999
  speaker: xxx
  en: That video complements this video, and this video complements that video.
  zh: 那个视频与这个视频相辅相成，这个视频也与那个视频相辅相成。
- start: 52.34
  end: 55.802
  speaker: xxx
  en: In that video, I called penal substitution a heresy.
  zh: 在那个视频中，我称刑罚替代说是异端。
- start: 56.043
  end: 59.585
  speaker: xxx
  en: Here, I should emphasize that it is not a condemned heresy.
  zh: 在这里，我要强调它并不是一个被定罪的异端。
- start: 59.726
  end: 65.735
  speaker: xxx
  en: I called it heresy just to be cheeky, which is a very bad criterion for something to be heretical.
  zh: 我称它为异端只是为了耍小聪明，这是一个非常糟糕的判断异端的标准。
- start: 66.116
  end: 71.939
  speaker: xxx
  en: If you're happy with penal substitution and it helps your life in Christ, feel free to subscribe to it.
  zh: 如果你对刑罚替代说感到满意，并且它有助于你在基督里的生命，请随意接受它。
- start: 72.279
  end: 83.446
  speaker: xxx
  en: However, please be aware that a lot of people do have great issues with it—issues that I consider more than justified—and that it prevents people from seeing God as the loving Father.
  zh: 然而，请注意许多人对它有很大的问题——我认为这些问题是完全合理的——它阻碍人们将神视为慈爱的父。
- start: 83.987
  end: 96.813
  speaker: xxx
  en: 'Okay, first, what I mean by penal substitution: according to how this teaching is most often presented, God is holy and just, and in order to be holy and just, He demands punishment for sin.'
  zh: 好的，首先，我所说的刑罚替代：根据这一教义最常见的表述方式，神是圣洁的，为了维护他的圣洁，他要求对罪进行惩罚。
- start: 96.813
  end: 99.514
  speaker: xxx
  en: He demands satisfaction for His justice.
  zh: 他要求满足他的公义。
- start: 99.714
  end: 107.079
  speaker: xxx
  en: Since us humans sin against God, we infinitely offend Him, and nothing we can do can ever satisfy His demand for justice.
  zh: 因为我们人类得罪了神，我们无限地冒犯了他，我们做什么都无法满足他对公义的要求。
- start: 107.519
  end: 113.843
  speaker: xxx
  en: However, Christ dies on the cross for us, and He suffers the punishment we are supposed to receive.
  zh: 然而，基督为我们死在十字架上，他承受了我们本该受的惩罚。
- start: 114.043
  end: 122.901
  speaker: xxx
  en: Because Christ is God, His sacrifice is of infinite value, and therefore God's demand for justice is finally satisfied.
  zh: 因为基督是神，他的祭献具有无限的价值，因此神对公义的要求终于得到满足。
- start: 123.741
  end: 132.063
  speaker: xxx
  en: 'I call penal substitution the quick-witted theologian''s answer to an uninquisitive inquirer: Why did Christ have to die?'
  zh: 我称刑罚替代说是机智的神学家对一个没有好奇心的质疑者的回答：为什么基督必须死？
- start: 132.684
  end: 136.345
  speaker: xxx
  en: Because you need to be punished for your sins, and Christ gets punished instead of you.
  zh: 因为你需要为你的罪受到惩罚，而基督代替你受罚。
- start: 136.345
  end: 138.265
  speaker: xxx
  en: Oh, okay.
  zh: 哦，好吧。
- start: 138.945
  end: 148.628
  speaker: xxx
  en: 'Now, there are a couple of quick answers to complex theological issues: Christ gets punished instead of you, good people go to heaven, and bad people go to hell.'
  zh: 现在，对于复杂的神学问题有几个快速的答案：基督代替你受罚，好人上天堂，坏人下地狱。
- start: 148.683
  end: 153.344
  speaker: xxx
  en: The Trinity is like a brick whose leaves are liquid, gas, and sunshine, and so on.
  zh: 三位一体就像一块砖，它的叶子是液体、气体和阳光，等等。
- start: 153.744
  end: 158.825
  speaker: xxx
  en: These sorts of explanations are like asking, Why did a mermaid's underwater home burn down?
  zh: 这些解释就像问，为什么美人鱼的水下家园会烧毁？
- start: 158.845
  end: 162.986
  speaker: xxx
  en: and getting an answer that it burned down due to an unattended cigar.
  zh: 然后得到一个答案，说是因为一支无人看管的雪茄烧毁的。
- start: 163.146
  end: 171.568
  speaker: xxx
  en: If it works, it's fine, but the explanation given tends to require more explanations, each more faulty and misguided than the one before.
  zh: 如果它奏效，那就好，但给出的解释往往需要更多的解释，每一个都比前一个更有缺陷和误导。
- start: 172.568
  end: 177.089
  speaker: xxx
  en: For a great many people, these sorts of explanations work perfectly well.
  zh: 对于很多人来说，这些解释非常有效。
- start: 177.586
  end: 186.589
  speaker: xxx
  en: They may not be true beyond their most superficial level, but if the surface level is satisfied, I suppose you can tick a box next to it and move on to something else.
  zh: 它们可能在最表面的层次之外就不真实了，但如果表面层次令人满意，我想你可以在它旁边打个勾，然后继续其他事情。
- start: 186.929
  end: 192.071
  speaker: xxx
  en: Some people do not move on to something else, and that is where penal substitution begins to implode.
  zh: 有些人不会继续其他事情，这就是刑罚替代说开始内爆的地方。
- start: 192.491
  end: 196.012
  speaker: xxx
  en: Either it has to go, or the most basic of Christian teachings have to go.
  zh: 要么它必须消失，要么最基本的基督教教义必须消失。
- start: 196.012
  end: 203.614
  speaker: xxx
  en: 'A caveat: I don''t mean to imply that being easily satisfied by a superficial solution implies stupidity.'
  zh: 提醒一下：我并不是暗示容易被肤浅的解决方案满足就意味着愚蠢。
- start: 203.774
  end: 205.895
  speaker: xxx
  en: Different people have different interests.
  zh: 不同的人有不同的兴趣。
- start: 206.144
  end: 211.326
  speaker: xxx
  en: Maybe theology isn't your thing, or maybe this branch of theology isn't your thing.
  zh: 也许神学不是你的菜，或者这个神学分支不是你的菜。
- start: 211.747
  end: 217.629
  speaker: xxx
  en: 'That is precisely the major issue with penal substitution: it is very easy to explain.'
  zh: 这正是刑罚替代说的主要问题：它很容易解释。
- start: 217.87
  end: 224.192
  speaker: xxx
  en: If you use penal substitution, you don't have to use the ransom theory or, God forbid, Christus Victor.
  zh: 如果你使用刑罚替代说，你就不必使用赎价理论，或者，神保佑，基督得胜论。
- start: 224.213
  end: 235.738
  speaker: xxx
  en: Why bother with the complicated issues of a transcendent God taking upon our human nature in order to make us participants of His divine nature when you can easily explain redemption with a heavenly transaction?
  zh: 当你可以用一个天上的交易轻松地解释救赎时，为什么还要费心去处理超越的神取了我们人性，为要使我们有分于他神性这些复杂的问题呢？
- start: 235.885
  end: 237.806
  speaker: xxx
  en: You don't get your hands messy.
  zh: 你不会把手弄脏。
- start: 237.846
  end: 241.548
  speaker: xxx
  en: It is like a punctual village surgeon who never went to med school.
  zh: 这就像一个从未上过医学院的守时村医。
- start: 241.608
  end: 248.091
  speaker: xxx
  en: He's clean, he's fast, efficient; he saves lives and leaves corpses in his wake.
  zh: 他干净、快速、高效，他挽救生命，身后留下尸体。
- start: 248.231
  end: 256.03499999999997
  speaker: xxx
  en: It’s less than ideal; it's better than having no surgeon at all, but having a trained professional is better than having a village apprentice.
  zh: 这并非理想，总比没有外科医生强，但有训练有素的专业人士总比有一个村里的学徒强。
- start: 256.556
  end: 262.218
  speaker: xxx
  en: What I find worrisome about penal substitution is that there are people who call it the Gospel itself.
  zh: 我发现令人担忧的是，有人称刑罚替代说本身就是福音。
- start: 262.219
  end: 267.622
  speaker: xxx
  en: That is, that Christ taking upon Himself our punishment is what the Gospel is all about.
  zh: 也就是说，基督承担我们的刑罚就是福音的全部内容。
- start: 267.843
  end: 268.823
  speaker: xxx
  en: I disagree.
  zh: 我不同意。
- start: 268.823
  end: 272.985
  speaker: xxx
  en: I find this approach very reductionist at best and problematic at worst.
  zh: 我发现这种方法充其量是非常简化，最糟糕的是有问题。
- start: 273.105
  end: 278.008
  speaker: xxx
  en: The Orthodox Christian teaching on theosis has been mostly absent from Western Christianity.
  zh: 西方基督教中基本上没有正统基督教关于神化的教导。
- start: 278.108
  end: 286.092
  speaker: xxx
  en: Theosis is a transformative process whose aim is our union with God through participation in His divine nature via His uncreated energies.
  zh: 神化是一个改变的过程，其目的是通过参与神非受造的能量，与他的神性联合。
- start: 286.473
  end: 290.935
  speaker: xxx
  en: It is this teaching that is the most important check and balance for penal substitution.
  zh: 正是这一教导，是对刑罚替代说最重要的制衡。
- start: 290.979
  end: 299.401
  speaker: xxx
  en: It either prevents it from becoming the dominant model and the most important aspect of redemption, or it makes penal substitution completely redundant.
  zh: 它要么防止刑罚替代成为主导模式和救赎最重要的方面，要么使刑罚替代完全多余。
- start: 299.801
  end: 302.281
  speaker: xxx
  en: I'm of the opinion that it makes it redundant.
  zh: 我的观点是，它使刑罚替代变得多余。
- start: 302.381
  end: 314.364
  speaker: xxx
  en: We die because our sin has cut off our participation in that divine nature, which is life itself, not because God must punish us with death for something that the absolute majority of us simply did not do.
  zh: 我们死是因为我们的罪切断了我们参与神性的生命本身，而不是因为神必须用死亡惩罚我们绝大多数人根本没有做过的事。
- start: 314.444
  end: 322.111
  speaker: xxx
  en: As a side note, you may claim that theosis is some weird crypto-Hindu teaching that crept into Christianity; it is anything but.
  zh: 顺便说一下，你可能会说神化是某种怪异的隐藏的印度教义渗透到基督教中，但它绝非如此。
- start: 322.371
  end: 349.359
  speaker: xxx
  en: For that, I only have to quote the Epistle of St. Peter, who says, His divine power has granted to us all things that pertain to life and godliness through the knowledge of Him who called us to His own glory and excellence, by which He has granted to us His precious and very great promises, so that through them you may become partakers of the divine nature, having escaped from the corruption that is in the world because of sinful desire.
  zh: 为此，我只需引用彼得的书信，他说：「神的神能已将一切关乎生命和虔敬的事赐给我们，皆因我们认识那用自己荣耀和美德召我们的主。因此，他已将又宝贵又极大的应许赐给我们，叫我们既脱离世上从情欲来的败坏，就得与神的性情有分。」
- start: 350.014
  end: 355.757
  speaker: xxx
  en: 'See what great words the apostle uses: partakers of the divine nature.'
  zh: 看使徒用了何等伟大的话：「与神的性情有分」。
- start: 355.998
  end: 366.885
  speaker: xxx
  en: Our salvation is not a simple verdict for being good; our salvation is to be unified with God in the most intimate way without dissolving our very being and personality.
  zh: 我们的救恩不是简单地因为行善而得到的判决，我们的救恩是以最亲密的方式与神联合，而不消解我们的存在和个性。
- start: 367.145
  end: 372.828
  speaker: xxx
  en: The issues of penal substitution depend primarily on how you see the mortality of Adam and Eve.
  zh: 刑罚替代的问题主要取决于你如何看待亚当和夏娃的死亡。
- start: 372.989
  end: 375.0
  speaker: xxx
  en: Is this punishment retributive?
  zh: 这个惩罚是报应性的吗？
- start: 375.0
  end: 381.345
  speaker: xxx
  en: That is, does God take away their chance at immortality as a way of causing pain and misery due to their sin?
  zh: 也就是说，神是否因他们的罪而剥夺了他们获得永生的机会，以此造成痛苦和悲惨？
- start: 381.906
  end: 388.311
  speaker: xxx
  en: Or is the mortality of Adam and Eve a natural consequence of their disobedience to the very Giver of life?
  zh: 还是亚当和夏娃的死亡是他们悖逆生命的主的自然后果？
- start: 388.331
  end: 398.74
  speaker: xxx
  en: Notice that in Genesis, God says that upon the day when Adam shall taste the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evil, He says, You will die, not I will kill you.
  zh: 请注意，在创世记中，神说，亚当吃善恶知识树的果子的日子，他说：「你必定死」，而不是「我要杀死你」。
- start: 398.92
  end: 406.607
  speaker: xxx
  en: This clearly indicates that our mortality is primarily a consequence of our sin, not intentionally inflicted by God on us.
  zh: 这清楚地表明，我们的死亡主要是我们罪的结果，而不是神有意加在我们身上的。
- start: 407.047
  end: 418.835
  speaker: xxx
  en: This distinction may seem like a minor one, but if we see Adam and Eve's mortality as a retributive penalty as opposed to a consequence, then we cannot comprehend why their children die as well.
  zh: 这种区别可能看起来微不足道，但如果我们将亚当和夏娃的死亡视为报应性的惩罚，而不是一种后果，那么我们就无法理解为什么他们的孩子也会死。
- start: 418.996
  end: 425.019
  speaker: xxx
  en: Our mortality and our sinful nature are primarily a disease that spread from our foreparents to us.
  zh: 我们的死亡和罪性主要是一种从我们的祖先传给我们的疾病。
- start: 425.5
  end: 428.682
  speaker: xxx
  en: That is why we die, and that is why our children die.
  zh: 这就是我们死亡的原因，也是我们的孩子死亡的原因。
- start: 428.897
  end: 437.742
  speaker: xxx
  en: Otherwise, if the punishment was retributive, we could not explain why our children die as well; they did not sin with the sin of Adam and Eve.
  zh: 否则，如果惩罚是报应性的，我们就无法解释为什么我们的孩子也会死，他们并没有犯亚当和夏娃的罪。
- start: 437.942
  end: 441.404
  speaker: xxx
  en: I would also like to comment on the justice of God for a second.
  zh: 我还想简单评论一下神的公义。
- start: 441.765
  end: 455.993
  speaker: xxx
  en: Whenever God does something in Scripture that gets His hands messy—anything that would make an atheist YouTuber's heyday in some 7,000 years—He always does that with the goal of preventing further spread of sin and corruption.
  zh: 每当神在圣经中做一些把手弄脏的事情——任何会让一个无神论的YouTuber在七千年后大肆宣扬的事情——他总是以防止罪恶和腐败进一步蔓延为目标。
- start: 456.273
  end: 461.249
  speaker: xxx
  en: That is the case with the flood, with Sodom and Gomorrah, and Ananias and Sapphira.
  zh: 洪水、所多玛和蛾摩拉、亚拿尼亚和撒非喇的事就是如此。
- start: 461.569
  end: 473.777
  speaker: xxx
  en: God does not inflict punishment in order to cause pain or misery; He does it to bring people to repentance or, at the very worst, to contain the sin that has become especially heinous.
  zh: 神施加惩罚不是为了造成痛苦或悲惨，而是为了使人悔改，或者最糟糕的情况下，遏制那些变得特别可憎的罪。
- start: 474.158
  end: 485.565
  speaker: xxx
  en: Remember that according to the Scriptures, according to the Epistle of St. Peter, God did redeem those souls who had perished in the flood, even despite their initial disobedience.
  zh: 请记住，根据圣经，根据彼得的书信，神确实救赎了那些在洪水中灭亡的灵魂，尽管他们起初不顺服。
- start: 485.928
  end: 492.852
  speaker: xxx
  en: The writings of St. John Chrysostom are simply filled with similar comments, and the following passages are quite telling.
  zh: 屈梭多模的著作中充满了类似的评论，以下段落相当能说明问题。
- start: 493.453
  end: 503.238
  speaker: xxx
  en: For if the wrath of God were a passion, one might well despair as being unable to quench the flame which a wicked man has kindled by so many evil doings.
  zh: 因为如果神的愤怒是一种情绪，人就可能绝望，因为无法熄灭恶人因许多恶行点燃的火焰。
- start: 503.699
  end: 515.346
  speaker: xxx
  en: But since the divine nature is passionless, even if He punishes, even if He takes vengeance, He does not do this with wrath but with tender care and much lovingkindness.
  zh: 但既然神的本性不受情绪影响，即使他惩罚，即使他报复，他也不是以愤怒，而是以温柔的关怀和极大的慈爱来做这事。
- start: 515.535
  end: 530.161
  speaker: xxx
  en: Therefore, it behooves us to be of much good courage and to trust in the power of repentance, for even those who have sinned against Him He is not wont to visit with punishment for His own sake, for no harm can traverse that divine nature.
  zh: 因此，我们应当大大壮胆，相信悔改的力量，因为即使是那些得罪他的人，他也不会为自己的缘故惩罚他们，因为没有什么伤害能穿越那神的本性。
- start: 530.361
  end: 539.284
  speaker: xxx
  en: But He acts with a view to our advantage and to prevent our perverseness from becoming worse by our making a practice of despising and neglecting Him.
  zh: 但他的行为是为了我们的益处，防止我们因习惯藐视和忽略他而使我们的乖僻变得更糟。
- start: 539.364
  end: 558.232
  speaker: xxx
  en: For even as one who places himself outside the light inflicts no loss on the light but the greatest upon himself, being shut up in the darkness, even so, he who has become accustomed to despise that almighty power does no injury to the power but inflicts the greatest possible injury upon himself.
  zh: 因为正如一个将自己置身于光明之外的人，并没有使光明受到损失，而是使自己受到最大的损失，被关在黑暗中；同样，习惯于藐视全能大能的人，并没有伤害那大能，而是给自己造成了最大可能的伤害。
- start: 558.232
  end: 567.438
  speaker: xxx
  en: And for this reason, God threatens us with punishment and often inflicts it, not as avenging Himself, but by way of attracting us to Himself.
  zh: 因此，神以惩罚威胁我们，并且经常施加惩罚，不是为了报复自己，而是为了吸引我们归向他。
- start: 567.499
  end: 582.475
  speaker: xxx
  en: For a physician also is not distressed or vexed at the insults of those who are out of their minds, but yet does and contrives everything for the purpose of stopping those who do so many unseemly acts, not looking to his own interests but to their profit.
  zh: 因为医生也不会因精神失常者的侮辱而感到苦恼或烦恼，而是竭尽全力阻止那些做出许多不当行为的人，不看重自己的利益，只顾他们的益处。
- start: 582.555
  end: 600.767
  speaker: xxx
  en: And if they manifest some small degree of self-control and sobriety, he rejoices and is glad and applies his remedies much more earnestly, not as revenging himself upon them for their former conduct, but as wishing to increase their advantage and to bring them back to a purely sound state of health.
  zh: 如果他们表现出一些自制和清醒，他就欢喜快乐，更加认真地施用药物，不是为了报复他们先前的行为，而是希望增加他们的益处，使他们恢复到完全健康的状态。
- start: 600.928
  end: 614.576
  speaker: xxx
  en: Even so, God, when we fall into the very extremity of madness, says and does everything not by way of avenging Himself on account of our former deeds, but because He wishes to release us from our disorder.
  zh: 同样，当我们陷入极度疯狂时，神所说和所做的一切，都不是为了报复我们从前的行为，而是因为他希望将我们从失常中解救出来。
- start: 615.197
  end: 624.222
  speaker: xxx
  en: By means of right reason, it is quite possible to be convinced of this, so says St. John Chrysostom.
  zh: 借着正确的理性，完全有可能确信这一点，屈梭多模如是说。
- start: 624.815
  end: 633.237
  speaker: xxx
  en: The biggest issue I have is how people generally pit God's mercy and God's justice against each other in the context of penal substitution.
  zh: 我最大的问题是，在刑罚替代的语境下，人们通常将神的怜悯和神的公义对立起来。
- start: 633.717
  end: 638.638
  speaker: xxx
  en: God would like to have mercy, but sadly He has to be just.
  zh: 神愿意怜悯，但可悲的是，他必须公正。
- start: 638.878
  end: 645.24
  speaker: xxx
  en: People forget that Scripture says that God is love; it never says God is justice.
  zh: 人们忘记了圣经说神就是爱，却从未说过神就是公义。
- start: 647.18
  end: 651.401
  speaker: xxx
  en: It does call Him just, but not on the same level as calling Him love.
  zh: 圣经的确称他为公义的，但不像称他为爱那样。
- start: 651.713
  end: 659.014
  speaker: xxx
  en: God's justice is simply a different manifestation of His law for us, not the evil twin of God's mercy.
  zh: 神的公义只是他的律法的另一种表现，而不是神怜悯的邪恶孪生兄弟。
- start: 659.395
  end: 668.416
  speaker: xxx
  en: Speaking of this insane duality that some people see in God, Saint Isaac of Syria says, God is so loving that He is unjust.
  zh: 谈到有些人在神身上看到的这种疯狂的二元性，叙利亚的圣以撒说：「神是如此慈爱，甚至于他不是公正的。」
- start: 668.677
  end: 673.137
  speaker: xxx
  en: I also have to point out a glaring inconsistency in penal substitution.
  zh: 我还必须指出刑罚替代中一个明显的矛盾。
- start: 673.518
  end: 678.718
  speaker: xxx
  en: According to the teaching, Christ dies and takes upon Himself the penalty for our sins.
  zh: 根据这一教义，基督死了，承担了我们罪的刑罚。
- start: 679.219
  end: 684.601
  speaker: xxx
  en: Now, that would be fine if Christ stayed dead, but He does not.
  zh: 如果基督一直死着，那倒没问题，但他没有。
- start: 684.942
  end: 690.344
  speaker: xxx
  en: The resurrection of Christ is, in my opinion, a major flaw in the whole concept.
  zh: 在我看来，基督的复活是整个概念的一个主要缺陷。
- start: 690.544
  end: 699.829
  speaker: xxx
  en: If God is infinitely offended by our transgression and requires the sacrifice of infinite value, that sacrifice would have to remain dead.
  zh: 如果神因我们的过犯无限受冒犯，并要求无限价值的祭献，那么这祭献就必须一直死着。
- start: 699.969
  end: 702.67
  speaker: xxx
  en: What penalty does Christ suffer exactly?
  zh: 基督到底遭受了什么刑罚？
- start: 703.11
  end: 704.111
  speaker: xxx
  en: Is it death?
  zh: 是死亡吗？
- start: 704.311
  end: 706.292
  speaker: xxx
  en: It lasted only for three days.
  zh: 它只持续了三天。
- start: 706.532
  end: 708.052
  speaker: xxx
  en: Is it spiritual death?
  zh: 是灵里的死亡吗？
- start: 708.353
  end: 711.214
  speaker: xxx
  en: God incarnate cannot suffer spiritual death.
  zh: 道成肉身的神不能遭受灵里的死亡。
- start: 711.647
  end: 725.054
  speaker: xxx
  en: Jesus Christ does not come to Hades (Sheol), the abode of the dead, as a condemned criminal; He descends there like a conqueror with intent to raid the entire place and leave the devil empty-handed.
  zh: 耶稣基督来到阴间，死人的居所，不是作为一个被定罪的罪犯；他像一个征服者下到那里，目的是洗劫整个地方，让魔鬼空手而归。
- start: 725.054
  end: 728.476
  speaker: xxx
  en: We and the souls of the dead are His foil.
  zh: 我们和死人的灵魂是他的陪衬。
- start: 728.816
  end: 733.578
  speaker: xxx
  en: However, in the Christus Victor model, things are far more consistent.
  zh: 然而，在基督得胜的模式中，事情要一致得多。
- start: 733.799
  end: 737.26
  speaker: xxx
  en: God takes upon Himself our fallen mortal nature.
  zh: 神取了我们堕落的必死的性情。
- start: 737.54
  end: 748.045
  speaker: xxx
  en: We killed Christ; we would have killed Him even if He spent His days in peace, for He would have died of old age—all for bearing that mortal body.
  zh: 我们杀了基督；即使他安然度日，我们也会杀死他，因为他会因年老而死——这一切都是因为他承担了那必死的身体。
- start: 748.346
  end: 756.991
  speaker: xxx
  en: His decision to die upon the cross specifically was to show at what lengths God Himself would go for His sheep that have wandered astray.
  zh: 他决定死在十字架上，是为了表明神自己为他走迷的羊会走多远。
- start: 757.291
  end: 760.993
  speaker: xxx
  en: Our humanity drags Him to death; we do that to Him.
  zh: 我们的人性把他拖向死亡，是我们对他做了这事。
- start: 761.133
  end: 769.799
  speaker: xxx
  en: The resurrection of Christ is what He does for us; His divinity and His divine body pull us out of our common grave.
  zh: 基督的复活是他为我们所做的；他的神性和他属神的身体把我们从共同的坟墓中拉了出来。
- start: 769.879
  end: 781.663
  speaker: xxx
  en: In that regard, we understand the parable of the suffering servant, who suffers due to our fallen nature in order to glorify us all by having both our human nature and His divine nature.
  zh: 在这方面，我们理解受苦仆人的比喻，他因我们堕落的本性而受苦，为要借着拥有我们的人性和他的神性，使我们众人得荣耀。
- start: 782.224
  end: 791.007
  speaker: xxx
  en: Orthodox hymnography and the writings of saints are a source of doctrine in the Eastern Orthodox Church; they help us see what Christians of old believed.
  zh: 正教的圣歌和圣徒著作是东正教会教义的来源；它们帮助我们了解古代基督徒的信仰。
- start: 791.387
  end: 799.75
  speaker: xxx
  en: If you take the Bible as the sole source of teachings, you will never be able to tell what’s literal, what’s symbolic, and what’s poetic in the Scriptures.
  zh: 如果你只把圣经作为教导的唯一来源，你将永远无法分辨经文中哪些是字面意思、哪些是象征意义、哪些是诗意的。
- start: 800.051
  end: 815.122
  speaker: xxx
  en: Orthodox hymns of the Great and Holy Friday are extremely powerful, and they lament God being slain by His own creation; that very God who showered us with such mercies that He even took upon Himself our very flesh.
  zh: 正教大斋期星期五的圣歌极其有力，它们哀悼神被自己的创造物杀害；就是那位神，他用如此丰盛的怜悯浇灌我们，甚至取了我们的肉身。
- start: 815.603
  end: 820.767
  speaker: xxx
  en: The imagery of an angry God being appeased by His own death is practically absent.
  zh: 一位愤怒的神因自己的死而得到安抚的意象实际上是不存在的。
- start: 821.135
  end: 834.384
  speaker: xxx
  en: Now, there are some who will say that just because I dismissed the most dominant model of penal substitution, I deny that Christ died for our sins, that God does not punish people, and that hell cannot be real if there is no punishment.
  zh: 现在，有些人会说，仅仅因为我否定了最主要的刑罚替代模式，我就是在否认基督为我们的罪而死，否认神惩罚人，否认如果没有惩罚地狱就不能是真实的。
- start: 834.465
  end: 839.028
  speaker: xxx
  en: First, yes, Christ died for our sins; He died for us.
  zh: 首先，是的，基督为我们的罪而死；他为我们而死。
- start: 839.028
  end: 843.691
  speaker: xxx
  en: Redemption is real, but He does not get punished instead of us.
  zh: 救赎是真实的，但他没有替我们受我们该受的惩罚。
- start: 843.991
  end: 845.852
  speaker: xxx
  en: Those are two different things.
  zh: 这是两回事。
- start: 846.293
  end: 852.236
  speaker: xxx
  en: Second, I already defined what punishment is, and sin is punishment in itself.
  zh: 其次，我已经定义了惩罚是什么，罪本身就是惩罚。
- start: 852.336
  end: 856.937
  speaker: xxx
  en: God need not punish per se; sin is what we do to ourselves.
  zh: 神本身不需要惩罚；罪是我们自己对自己所做的。
- start: 857.377
  end: 864.219
  speaker: xxx
  en: God only acts to prevent or punish sin in His loving providence, especially to prevent an abysmal catastrophe.
  zh: 神只是在他慈爱的护理中采取行动，防止或惩罚罪，特别是为了防止可怕的灾难。
- start: 864.219
  end: 871.821
  speaker: xxx
  en: As for hell, that is a subject for another video, but hell is still real and very eternal.
  zh: 至于地狱，那是另一个视频的主题，但地狱仍然是真实的，而且是永恒的。
- start: 872.061
  end: 882.072
  speaker: xxx
  en: Those who do not partake of God's own nature won't be able to endure Him, and their inability to endure the Most Holy Trinity in eternity will be hell.
  zh: 那些不与神的性情有分的人将无法忍受他，他们无法在永恒中忍受至圣三位一体，这就是地狱。
- start: 882.492
  end: 886.315
  speaker: xxx
  en: I would like to thank everyone who has stayed so far and watched this video.
  zh: 我要感谢所有坚持到现在并观看这个视频的人。
- start: 886.335
  end: 889.617
  speaker: xxx
  en: Please remember to comment, share, and subscribe.
  zh: 请记得评论、分享和订阅。
- start: 889.877
  end: 893.44
  speaker: xxx
  en: If you have an opposing opinion, feel free to share it and so on.
  zh: 如果你有不同意见，欢迎分享等等。
- start: 893.56
  end: 901.205
  speaker: xxx
  en: This video was intended to be much longer, but because this channel does not make deep dives, this is what it is.
  zh: 这个视频本来打算做得更长，但因为这个频道不做深入探讨，所以就是这样了。
- start: 901.593
  end: 911.275
  speaker: xxx
  en: I do hope to make further videos based on St. Athanasius on the Incarnation and especially on why Christ had to come in flesh, why did He have to die, and so on.
  zh: 我希望以后能根据亚他拿修的《论道成肉身》制作更多视频，特别是关于基督为什么必须道成肉身，为什么他必须死，等等。
- start: 911.395
  end: 916.797
  speaker: xxx
  en: This video is primarily a dismantling of the Western idea of penal substitution.
  zh: 这个视频主要是为了解构西方的刑罚替代说。
- start: 917.037
  end: 923.218
  speaker: xxx
  en: There are many atheists out there who would not have been atheists if it weren't for penal substitution.
  zh: 有许多无神论者，如果不是因为刑罚替代说，他们就不会成为无神论者。
- start: 923.218
  end: 925.339
  speaker: xxx
  en: We do have to bear that in mind.
  zh: 我们必须记住这一点。
- start: 925.499
  end: 941.564
  speaker: xxx
  en: These people are not fleeing personal responsibility—maybe some of them are—but these people are fleeing an angry Father God that is not Father but a God who is more akin to Annas and Caiaphas, who is out to get Christ's blood.
  zh: 这些人不是在逃避个人责任——也许他们中的一些人是——但这些人是在逃避一位愤怒的父，他不是父，而是一位更像亚那和该亚法的神，他要去得基督的血。
