- start: 29.737
  end: 32.158
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Welcome to The Way of the Fathers.
  zh: 欢迎来到《教父之道》。
- start: 32.158
  end: 33.478
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: I'm Jim Papandrea.
  zh: 我是吉姆·帕潘德雷亚。
- start: 33.478
  end: 36.698
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: This podcast is a production of Catholic Culture.
  zh: 本播客由天主教文化制作。
- start: 36.739
  end: 40.199
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Sign up for our newsletter at catholicculture.org
  zh: 请在catholicculture.org订阅我们的通讯
- start: 40.199
  end: 41.779
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: slash newsletter.
  zh: /newsletter。
- start: 42.32
  end: 50.461
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Today we continue our series on the heresies with episode 16, Eutyches and Monophysite Christology.
  zh: 今天我们继续异端系列，第十六集：尤提克和一性论基督论。
- start: 51.301
  end: 56.743
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: If you're starting to get a little motion sickness from the swinging of the pendulum, you're not alone.
  zh: 如果你开始因钟摆的摆动感到晕眩，你并不孤单。
- start: 56.743
  end: 58.843
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: But brace yourself because...
  zh: 但请做好准备，因为……
- start: 58.883
  end: 59.884
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Here we go again.
  zh: 我们又要开始了。
- start: 59.884
  end: 78.299
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Apollinarius had overreacted against Arius' separation of the Father and the Son, and he overcorrected by overemphasizing the unity of the divine and human in the person of Christ, and he ended up diminishing Christ's humanity.
  zh: 亚波里拿留对亚略将圣父和圣子分开的反应过度，他过度纠正，过分强调基督位格中神性和人性的合一，结果削弱了基督的人性。
- start: 79.02
  end: 98.61
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Nestorius overreacted against Apollinarius' blurring the line between the divine and human, and he overcorrected by overemphasizing the distinction between the two natures, to the point of trying to keep them separate, as if he had to protect the divine from the human nature.
  zh: 聂斯脱里对亚波里拿留模糊神性和人性界限的反应过度，他过度纠正，过分强调两性之间的区别，甚至试图将它们分开，仿佛要保护神性不受人性的影响。
- start: 99.01
  end: 103.954
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: But in the end, he made it sound like Jesus had a split personality.
  zh: 但最终，他的说法让耶稣听起来像是有分裂的人格。
- start: 104.474
  end: 127.591
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Well, now the pendulum swings again, as someone will overreact against Nestorius, going even farther than Apollinarius did, to the point of describing Christ as though the divine in him overshadowed the human so much that the humanity was completely absorbed and effectively cancelled out.
  zh: 现在钟摆又摆动了，有人对聂斯脱里反应过度，比亚波里拿留走得更远，描述基督时，神性如此压倒人性，以至于人性被完全吸收，实际上被取消了。
- start: 128.732
  end: 137.74
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: During the time that Nestorius was bishop of Constantinople, there was a monastery in that city with an abbot named Eutyches.
  zh: 在聂斯脱里担任君士坦丁堡主教期间，该城有一座修道院，院长名叫尤提克。
- start: 138.261
  end: 145.928
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: And Eutyches knew that what Nestorius was teaching undermined the unity of the personhood of the Son of God.
  zh: 尤提克知道聂斯脱里的教导破坏了神儿子位格的合一。
- start: 146.469
  end: 151.434
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: And Eutyches was reading Cyril of Alexandria, as everyone should.
  zh: 尤提克在阅读亚历山大的区利罗，正如每个人都该如此。
- start: 151.774
  end: 160.698
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: And to be fair, sometimes Cyril himself really leans into the unity of the two natures to refute Nestorianism.
  zh: 公平地说，有时区利罗确实倾向于强调两性的合一，以驳斥聂斯脱里主义。
- start: 161.278
  end: 180.467
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: But Eutyches was not a great theologian, and although he thought he was reading Cyril correctly and being faithful to what Cyril was teaching, Eutyches took the unity of Christ's two natures farther than Cyril and even farther than Apollinarius ever did.
  zh: 但尤提克不是伟大的神学家，虽然他以为自己正确地理解了区利罗，忠于他的教导，但尤提克将基督两性的合一推得比区利罗和亚波里拿留更远。
- start: 181.747
  end: 195.257
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: So, Eutyches started teaching that in the union of divine and human within the person of Jesus Christ, the humanity was absorbed by the divinity, like a drop of oil in the ocean.
  zh: 于是，尤提克开始教导说，在耶稣基督位格中神性和人性的结合中，人性被神性吸收，如同一滴油在海洋中。
- start: 195.818
  end: 200.621
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: But of course, that left a Christ who was no longer human at all.
  zh: 但这当然留下一个不再是人的基督。
- start: 200.781
  end: 209.408
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Or worse, it seemed like the union created some third thing that was no longer the divine nature or the human nature.
  zh: 或者更糟糕的是，这结合似乎创造了某种第三种东西，不再是神性或人性。
- start: 210.128
  end: 221.373
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: When pressed, Eutyches would say, well, there were two natures before the union, but once united, there is really only one nature, the divine nature.
  zh: 在被追问时，尤提克会说，结合前确实有两性，但一旦结合，就只有一个性，就是神性。
- start: 221.793
  end: 231.857
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Now, that's a problem, because it implies that Jesus' human nature existed without the divine nature, even if just for a moment, before the union.
  zh: 这就有问题了，因为这暗示耶稣的人性在结合前曾独立存在，即使只是片刻。
- start: 232.578
  end: 242.851
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: But the bigger issue is that this union would result in a Christ with only one nature, a divine nature without any remaining humanity.
  zh: 但更大的问题是，这结合导致一个只有神性、没有人性的基督。
- start: 243.333
  end: 245.635
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: And you can probably see what's coming.
  zh: 你可能已经看出接下来会发生什么。
- start: 245.716
  end: 248.96
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: There's a fancy Greek compound word for this.
  zh: 对此有一个复杂的希腊复合词。
- start: 249.764
  end: 258.949
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Remember, the word for Apollinarius' Christology, which had only one will, that word was monothelite.
  zh: 记得亚波里拿留的基督论，只有一个意志，那个词是「单意志」。
- start: 259.53
  end: 263.412
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: So now, what Eutyches proposed went even further.
  zh: 现在，尤提克的主张更进一步。
- start: 263.412
  end: 267.374
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Not just only one will, but only one nature.
  zh: 不仅只有一个意志，而且只有一个性。
- start: 267.555
  end: 273.318
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: And the word for that is monophysite, from mono for one nature.
  zh: 这个词就是「一性论」，来自「mono」，意为一个性。
- start: 276.4
  end: 290.686
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Monophysite Christology is a one-nature Christology, specifically that the divine word had absorbed the humanity to the point where Jesus Christ was really just all-divine.
  zh: 一性论基督论是一种一性基督论，具体来说，就是神的道吸收了人性，以至于耶稣基督实际上完全是神性。
- start: 290.706
  end: 294.547
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: His humanity was cancelled out by his divinity.
  zh: 他的人性被他的神性取消了。
- start: 295.068
  end: 325.507
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: So, while Nestorius had too much separation of the natures, now Eutyches swings the pendulum hard to the other extreme, way past where Apollinarius was, and Eutyches proposed too much unity of the natures, blurring the line between divinity and humanity so much that, as I said, either the humanity is cancelled out, or the end result is some amalgam of the two, which is neither one.
  zh: 所以，聂斯脱里过分分离两性，而尤提克则将钟摆摆向另一个极端，远超亚波里拿留，尤提克提出过度的性合一，模糊了神性和人性的界限，如我所说，要么人性被取消，要么结果是两者的混合体，既不是神性也不是人性。
- start: 326.608
  end: 342.155
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: So if Nestorius' two natures were like oil and vinegar, Eutyches' two natures would be like an alloy, the way copper and zinc come together to make brass, but brass is neither copper nor zinc.
  zh: 所以，如果聂斯脱里的两性如同油和醋，尤提克的两性就像合金，铜和锌结合成黄铜，但黄铜既不是铜也不是锌。
- start: 342.395
  end: 347.818
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: The integrity of both the copper and the zinc is affected, and both are changed.
  zh: 铜和锌的完整性都受到影响，两者都发生了变化。
- start: 348.518
  end: 352.521
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: But that presents a problem because divinity can't change.
  zh: 但这就有问题了，因为神性不能改变。
- start: 353.221
  end: 366.931
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: So what Eutyches was teaching had the unfortunate effects of both compromising divine immutability, implying that the divine could change somehow, and diminishing the humanity of Jesus.
  zh: 所以尤提克的教导不幸地既损害了神性的不变性，暗示神性可以某种方式改变，又削弱了耶稣的人性。
- start: 367.772
  end: 377.359
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: At the end of the day, Eutyches ended up in a similar place as the Docetics and the Gnostics, with a Jesus who was not really human.
  zh: 最终，尤提克与幻影说和诺斯低派处于类似的境地，拥有一个不是真正人的耶稣。
- start: 377.8
  end: 388.088
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Or you could say he ended up in a similar place as the Modalists, with a Savior who is consubstantial with the Father, but not with us.
  zh: 或者可以说，他与形态论者处于类似的境地，拥有一个与圣父同体但与我们不同的救主。
- start: 389.628
  end: 392.411
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Now what happened next is really interesting.
  zh: 接下来发生的事情非常有趣。
- start: 393.052
  end: 403.522
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Nestorius, as Bishop of Constantinople, was of course deposed in 431 AD after he was excommunicated by the Council of Ephesus.
  zh: 聂斯脱里作为君士坦丁堡的主教，当然在公元431年被以弗所会议革除并逐出教会。
- start: 404.084
  end: 408.247
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: So the bishops of Constantinople after him were Orthodox.
  zh: 所以他之后的君士坦丁堡主教都是正统的。
- start: 409.119
  end: 423.787
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: But when Cyril of Alexandria died in the year 444, he was succeeded as bishop of Alexandria by one Dioscorus, and Dioscorus took the side of Eutyches.
  zh: 但当亚历山大的区利罗于公元444年去世时，接替他成为亚历山大主教的是狄奥斯库罗斯，狄奥斯库罗斯站在尤提克一边。
- start: 424.268
  end: 429.971
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: So in effect, the two sides of heresy and orthodoxy in the East switched.
  zh: 所以实际上，东方的异端和正统两方对调了。
- start: 430.511
  end: 443.221
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: At the time of the Third Ecumenical Council of Ephesus in 431, the Bishop of Alexandria, Cyril, was Orthodox, and the Bishop of Constantinople, Nestorius, was a heretic.
  zh: 在公元431年第三次以弗所大公会议时，亚历山大的主教区利罗是正统的，君士坦丁堡的主教聂斯脱里是异端。
- start: 443.561
  end: 450.346
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: But by the time of the controversy over Eutyches, less than 20 years later, it was the reverse.
  zh: 但到尤提克争议时，不到二十年后，情况就反过来了。
- start: 450.507
  end: 460.674
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: The Bishop of Alexandria, Dioscorus, was the heretic, and the Bishop of Constantinople was a man named Flavian, and he was Orthodox.
  zh: 亚历山大的主教狄奥斯库罗斯是异端，君士坦丁堡的主教是弗拉维安，他是正统的。
- start: 460.975
  end: 465.558
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: These two great metropolitan cities had switched sides.
  zh: 这两大都会城市换了立场。
- start: 466.48
  end: 478.33
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: So the leaders of the heresy of Monophysite Christology at this time were the abbot Eutyches in Constantinople and the bishop Dioscorus of Alexandria.
  zh: 所以此时一性论基督论异端的领袖是君士坦丁堡的院长尤提克和亚历山大的主教狄奥斯库罗斯。
- start: 479.011
  end: 488.517
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: But I need to add a bit of nuance here, because Dioscorus' reasons for siding with Eutyches may have been more than theological.
  zh: 但我需要补充一点细微之处，因为狄奥斯库罗斯支持尤提克的理由可能不仅仅是神学上的。
- start: 488.938
  end: 500.625
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: In other words, Dioscorus might have been politically motivated to oppose the bishop of Constantinople out of the fear of the loss of his own authority and autonomy.
  zh: 换句话说，狄奥斯库罗斯可能出于政治动机反对君士坦丁堡的主教，因害怕失去自己的权威和自治。
- start: 501.326
  end: 507.89
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: You see, by rights, Alexandria should have been the second most important metropolitan after Rome.
  zh: 按理说，亚历山大应是仅次于罗马的第二大都会。
- start: 508.37
  end: 523.823
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: But now, Constantinople was the capital of the empire, so the authority of Alexandria was becoming subordinated to Constantinople, which means Dioscorus wanted to see the patriarchs there knocked down a peg.
  zh: 但现在君士坦丁堡是帝国的首都，所以亚历山大的权威正被君士坦丁堡压制，这意味着狄奥斯库罗斯希望看到那里的牧首被削弱。
- start: 524.344
  end: 531.69
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: And so, Dioscorus' move might have been more a vote against Flavian than a vote for Eutyches.
  zh: 所以，狄奥斯库罗斯的行动可能更多是反对弗拉维安，而非支持尤提克。
- start: 532.05
  end: 536.774
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Not that this excuses him, but I will come back to this point in the epilogue.
  zh: 这并不能为他开脱，但我会在结尾时回到这一点。
- start: 537.334
  end: 544.44
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: What's at stake here is the balance of unity and distinction between the two natures within the person of Christ.
  zh: 这里所关乎的是基督位格中两性之间合一与区别的平衡。
- start: 545.04
  end: 569.087
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Just as the Trinitarian controversies resulted in a clarification of the balance of unity and distinction between the persons of the Trinity, the three persons can't be so unified as to slip into modalism, but the three persons also can't be so separate as to diminish the divinity of the Son and the Holy Spirit as the Arians and the Pneumatomachians did.
  zh: 正如三位一体的争议导致了三个位格之间合一与区别平衡的澄清，三个位格不能如此合一以至于陷入形态论，但也不能如此分离以至于削弱圣子和圣灵的神性，如亚略派和敌灵派所做的。
- start: 569.688
  end: 582.971
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Now in the same way, with this Christological controversy, the two natures within Christ cannot be so unified that they are blended, because then you lose the integrity of one or both natures.
  zh: 同样，在这基督论争议中，基督内的两性不能如此合一以至于混合，因为那样你就失去了一个或两个性的完整性。
- start: 583.531
  end: 591.792
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Either you ascribe change to the divine nature, or the human nature is overshadowed or absorbed and cancelled out, or both.
  zh: 要么你将改变归于神性，要么人性被压制或吸收而取消，或两者皆是。
- start: 592.312
  end: 601.434
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: But on the other hand, the two natures cannot be so separate that Jesus is split in two, giving him a kind of dual personality.
  zh: 但另一方面，两性不能如此分离以至于耶稣被分成两部分，使他有一种双重人格。
- start: 602.188
  end: 616.119
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: We need to describe Christ in such a way as to make it clear that the two natures are unified enough to maintain a singular personhood and yet distinct enough to avoid mixing them up.
  zh: 我们需要这样描述基督，使两性合一到足以保持单一位格，又足够区别以避免混淆。
- start: 616.6
  end: 622.204
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: So who were the church fathers who weighed in at this point in this ongoing controversy?
  zh: 那么，在这持续的争议中，哪些教父对此发表了意见？
- start: 622.705
  end: 627.57
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Well, of course, we still have the important writings of Cyril of Alexandria.
  zh: 当然，我们仍有亚历山大的区利罗的重要著作。
- start: 627.771
  end: 634.78
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: And even though Eutyches didn't always understand Cyril correctly, Cyril's writings continue to be important.
  zh: 即使尤提克并不总是正确理解区利罗，区利罗的著作仍然很重要。
- start: 635.081
  end: 650.142
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: But as I mentioned, Cyril had died in the year 444 AD. In the year 448, Bishop Flavian of Constantinople convened a synod there and excommunicated the abbot Eutyches.
  zh: 但如我所提，区利罗已于公元444年去世。公元448年，君士坦丁堡的弗拉维安主教在当地召开会议，将院长尤提克逐出教会。
- start: 650.682
  end: 655.884
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: But this forced Dioscorus' hand and he came out against Flavian.
  zh: 但这迫使狄奥斯库罗斯采取行动，他反对弗拉维安。
- start: 656.324
  end: 661.666
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: So now it was no longer about a rebellious monk being disciplined by his bishop.
  zh: 所以现在不再是一个叛逆的僧侣被他的主教管教的问题。
- start: 662.026
  end: 665.047
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Now it was a fight between two archbishops.
  zh: 现在是两位大主教之间的斗争。
- start: 665.387
  end: 667.828
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: And this is where the pope stepped in.
  zh: 这时教宗介入了。
- start: 668.351
  end: 683.576
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: At this time, the bishop of Rome was Leo the Great, who was pope from 440 to 461 AD. And he wrote a letter in support of Flavian, which we now refer to as Leo's Tome.
  zh: 此时罗马的主教是大教宗良，他在公元440年至461年任教宗。他写了一封支持弗拉维安的信，我们现在称之为《良的书》。
- start: 684.076
  end: 689.878
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: The word tome usually refers to a book, often a big book, but this isn't that long.
  zh: 「书」通常指一本书，常是大书，但这并不长。
- start: 689.878
  end: 690.419
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: It's a letter.
  zh: 这是一封信。
- start: 690.419
  end: 695.88
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: I suppose it gets the name tome more for its importance than its length.
  zh: 我想它被称为「书」更多是因为其重要性，而非长度。
- start: 695.961
  end: 711.486
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: And also because Leo wrote the letter with the authority of the successor of Peter on the assumption that he, as if he was speaking for Peter himself, had the authority to be the judge over these two eastern patriarchs.
  zh: 也因为良以彼得继承者的权威写信，假定他如同代表彼得本人，有权对这两位东方牧首作出裁决。
- start: 712.256
  end: 717.82
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: And in the Tome, Leo affirmed the teaching of Flavian of Constantinople.
  zh: 在《书》中，良肯定了君士坦丁堡弗拉维安的教导。
- start: 718.141
  end: 730.151
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: And then he very succinctly pulled together all of the best thought from both the West and the East on the subject of Christ's two natures and the hypostatic union.
  zh: 然后他非常简洁地汇集了东西方关于基督两性和位格联合的最佳思想。
- start: 730.772
  end: 739.581
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: And Leo articulated the precise language that would become standard for the explanation of Orthodox teaching on Christology.
  zh: 良阐明了精确的语言，成为解释正统基督论教义的标准。
- start: 739.982
  end: 747.35
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: As he said in the Tome, Jesus Christ, the second person of the Trinity, is one person.
  zh: 正如他在《书》中所说，耶稣基督，三位一体的第二位，是一个位格。
- start: 747.45
  end: 755.037
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Now, actually, he said one person in both natures, but it means the same thing.
  zh: 实际上，他说的是「两性中的一个位格」，但意思相同。
- start: 755.718
  end: 762.944
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Now, it's easy to miss the important part of this because, as it often happens, the littlest words mean a lot.
  zh: 现在，很容易忽略其中的重要部分，因为往往最小的词语意义重大。
- start: 763.285
  end: 764.745
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: The Son of God is...
  zh: 神的儿子是……
- start: 765.466
  end: 768.427
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: one person in two natures.
  zh: 两性中的一个位格。
- start: 768.907
  end: 773.688
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Not two persons, obviously, so Nestorianism is ruled out.
  zh: 显然不是两个位格，所以排除了聂斯脱里主义。
- start: 774.149
  end: 789.393
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: But also not one person made out of two natures, since that language could leave room for a Monophysite Christ who started out as two natures but became something else as a result of the union.
  zh: 但也不是由两性组成的一个位格，因为这种说法可能为一性论的基督留下余地，起初是两性，但因结合而变成别的东西。
- start: 790.173
  end: 795.634
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: One person out of two natures could imply that amalgam or alloy.
  zh: 「由两性组成的一个位格」可能暗示那种混合或合金。
- start: 795.934
  end: 802.935
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: No, Leo says Christ remains always and eternally in two natures.
  zh: 不，良说基督始终永远在两性中。
- start: 803.676
  end: 806.636
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: So, Pope Leo put it all together.
  zh: 所以，教宗良将一切整合在一起。
- start: 807.056
  end: 816.158
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Apollinarius and then even more so Eutyches had blurred the line between the divine and the human in Jesus, diminishing his human nature.
  zh: 亚波里拿留，尤提克更甚，模糊了耶稣身上神性和人性的界限，削弱了他的人性。
- start: 816.659
  end: 822.343
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Against that, Leo clarified that the two natures have to be eternal.
  zh: 对此，良澄清两性必须是永恒的。
- start: 822.664
  end: 833.032
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Well, technically, the divine nature is eternal and the human nature is immortal, since the human nature was created at the moment of Jesus' conception.
  zh: 严格来说，神性是永恒的，人性是不朽的，因为人性是在耶稣受孕时被创造的。
- start: 833.093
  end: 834.474
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: But you get the idea.
  zh: 但你明白我的意思。
- start: 834.554
  end: 841.46
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: From the moment of his conception, both natures are eternal and in a permanent union.
  zh: 从他受孕的那一刻起，两性就是永恒的，并处于永久的结合中。
- start: 841.618
  end: 855.785
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: And so, even right now, in his resurrected state and, as we say in the Creed, at the right hand of the Father, Jesus Christ remains fully human, existing in both of his two natures.
  zh: 所以，即使现在，在他复活的状态中，正如我们在信经中所说，在父的右边，耶稣基督仍然完全是人，存在于他的两性中。
- start: 856.566
  end: 869.132
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: On the other hand, the two natures must remain eternally distinct so that the divine nature does not change and the human nature is a real and complete human nature.
  zh: 另一方面，两性必须永远保持区别，以免神性改变，人性是真实完整的人性。
- start: 870.572
  end: 891.408
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: But Nestorius had made too much of a separation between the two natures, and so Leo, following Cyril, affirmed the hypostatic union, that the two natures are really and truly, permanently and eternally united in one person who is the second person of the Trinity.
  zh: 但聂斯脱里过分分离两性，所以良跟随区利罗，肯定了位格联合，即两性真实地、永久地、永恒地联合在一个位格中，就是三位一体的第二位。
- start: 891.969
  end: 894.671
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: One person in two natures.
  zh: 两性中的一个位格。
- start: 895.252
  end: 899.857
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: The two natures being united but not changed by the union.
  zh: 两性联合但不因联合而改变。
- start: 900.218
  end: 902.7
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Distinct but not separate.
  zh: 有区别但不分离。
- start: 904.176
  end: 922.511
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: In fact, and here I'm going to give some more credit to my man Novation, Novation had prepared the West to come to this correct understanding by using Latin terminology related to marriage as an analogy for this union of the human and the divine in Christ.
  zh: 事实上，我要再赞扬一下诺瓦蒂安，他通过使用与婚姻相关的拉丁术语作为比喻，为西方准备了这种正确理解，即基督中神性和人性的结合。
- start: 923.072
  end: 932.217
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: In a marriage, the two individuals retain their distinct integrity, but they come together in a permanent union in which they act as a unit.
  zh: 在婚姻中，两个人保持各自的完整性，但他们结合在一个永久的联合中，作为一个整体行动。
- start: 932.517
  end: 937.38
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: It's not a perfect analogy because, after all, Jesus is one person, not two.
  zh: 这不是一个完美的比喻，因为毕竟耶稣是一个位格，不是两个。
- start: 937.86
  end: 956.69
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: But you can think of the union of his two natures using this analogy in the sense that his divine nature is the groom and his humanity is the bride, and then it becomes the image after which is patterned the image of the church as the bride of Christ.
  zh: 但你可以用这个比喻来思考他两性的结合，他的神性是新郎，他的人性是新娘，然后这成为教会作为基督新娘的形象的模式。
- start: 957.791
  end: 959.992
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Okay, so far so good.
  zh: 好，到目前为止一切顺利。
- start: 960.232
  end: 962.373
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: But there was another problem.
  zh: 但还有另一个问题。
- start: 962.907
  end: 975.887
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: The emperor in Constantinople at this time was Theodosius II, and he was a Monophysite, and so he supported Eutyches against Bishop Flavian.
  zh: 此时君士坦丁堡的皇帝是狄奥多西二世，他是一性论者，所以他支持尤提克反对弗拉维安主教。
- start: 976.443
  end: 986.368
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: And in the year 449 AD, the emperor convened another council in Ephesus, and he let Dioscorus chair this one.
  zh: 公元449年，皇帝在以弗所召开另一次会议，让狄奥斯库罗斯主持。
- start: 986.828
  end: 992.571
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: So consequently, anyone known to be against Eutyches was not invited.
  zh: 因此，任何被认为反对尤提克的人都未被邀请。
- start: 992.651
  end: 994.472
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: And you can see where this is going.
  zh: 你可以看出这将走向何方。
- start: 994.752
  end: 1003.937
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Leo's Tome was rejected without even being read, and both Pope Leo and Flavian of Constantinople were excommunicated.
  zh: 良的《书》甚至未被阅读就被拒绝，教宗良和君士坦丁堡的弗拉维安都被逐出教会。
- start: 1004.278
  end: 1006.279
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Of course, this was not legitimate.
  zh: 当然，这是不合法的。
- start: 1006.279
  end: 1015.246
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: The council was completely out of order, and in fact, Pope Leo would later refer to it as a synod of thieves, the robber synod.
  zh: 会议完全不合规，事实上，教宗良后来称之为「盗贼会议」。
- start: 1015.827
  end: 1022.892
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: In the end, chaos reigned, the people rioted, and the emperor had to call in troops to quiet it down.
  zh: 最终，混乱肆虐，民众暴动，皇帝不得不召集军队平息。
- start: 1023.372
  end: 1032.059
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: But Pope Leo's delegation had to run for it to escape arrest, and they did arrest Bishop Flavian, who was beaten almost to death.
  zh: 但教宗良的代表团不得不逃跑以免被捕，他们确实逮捕了弗拉维安主教，他被打得几乎致死。
- start: 1032.179
  end: 1037.082
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: And he was thrown in prison, later exiled, and died in exile.
  zh: 他被投入监狱，后来被流放，死于流放中。
- start: 1037.962
  end: 1045.226
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: But eventually, the emperor also died in the year 450, and his successor was Orthodox.
  zh: 但最终，皇帝也在公元450年去世，他的继任者是正统的。
- start: 1045.527
  end: 1049.569
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: And Leo convinced him to convene a legitimate council.
  zh: 良说服他召开一个合法的会议。
- start: 1049.749
  end: 1072.384
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: And this would be the fourth worldwide or ecumenical council of the church, the Council of Chalcedon, in the year 451 AD. Just a quick reminder, my brother from another mother, Mike Aquilina, has whole episodes on each of these four ecumenical councils, so I do encourage you to listen to those.
  zh: 这将是教会的第四次普世大公会议，即公元451年的迦克墩会议。提醒一下，我的兄弟迈克·阿奎利纳有关于这四次大公会议的完整节目，我鼓励你们去听。
- start: 1073.005
  end: 1087.776
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Well, the first thing the bishops did at the Council of Chalcedon was to affirm the Nicene Creed, the creed written at both the first two ecumenical councils of Nicaea and Constantinople in the previous century.
  zh: 在迦克墩会议上，主教们首先做的就是确认尼西亚信经，即前世纪第一次和第二次大公会议在尼西亚和君士坦丁堡制定的信经。
- start: 1088.296
  end: 1095.962
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: We don't need to write another creed, they said, because the one we have from the first two ecumenical councils is sufficient.
  zh: 他们说，我们不需要再写一个信经，因为我们从前两次大公会议得到的信经已经足够。
- start: 1095.962
  end: 1097.923
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: So we're not going to write a creed.
  zh: 所以我们不会写一个信经。
- start: 1098.243
  end: 1100.905
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: But they did need to write something.
  zh: 但他们确实需要写点什么。
- start: 1100.965
  end: 1107.149
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: They needed a definitive answer to the question of the union of the two natures in Christ.
  zh: 他们需要对基督两性结合的问题给出明确的答案。
- start: 1107.35
  end: 1115.455
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: They did need to write some kind of a statement of faith that would refute both Nestorius and Eutyches.
  zh: 他们确实需要写一种信仰声明，以驳斥聂斯脱里和尤提克。
- start: 1116.076
  end: 1121.921
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: And so they read out Leo's Tome, and it was accepted as authoritative.
  zh: 于是他们宣读了良的《书》，并接受其为权威。
- start: 1122.201
  end: 1126.304
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: And then they wrote what is called the Chalcedonian Definition.
  zh: 然后他们写了所谓的迦克墩定义。
- start: 1126.545
  end: 1138.434
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Not a creed, but a definition, which was basically a distillation of the work of Cyril of Alexandria and the Western theologians summarized by Pope Leo the Great.
  zh: 不是信经，而是定义，基本上是亚历山大的区利罗和西方神学家们的工作，由大教宗良总结而成。
- start: 1138.655
  end: 1142.078
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: I'd like to read to you the Chalcedonian Definition.
  zh: 我想为你们读一下迦克墩定义。
- start: 1142.078
  end: 1162.491
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: It's not long at all, and when I read it, listen for how it manages to find that balance of unity and distinction in the hypostatic union, and how the explanation of orthodoxy clarified that middle way, that place of balance between the extremes of Nestorius and Eutyches.
  zh: 它一点也不长，当我读的时候，请注意它如何在位格联合中找到合一与区别的平衡，以及正统的解释如何澄清了那中道，那在聂斯脱里和尤提克极端之间的平衡点。
- start: 1163.091
  end: 1166.213
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Okay, here it is, the Chalcedonian Definition.
  zh: 好了，这就是迦克墩定义。
- start: 1166.954
  end: 1237.783
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: We then, following the Holy Fathers, all with one consent, teach men to confess one and the same Son, our Lord Jesus Christ, the same perfect in Godhead and also perfect in manhood, truly God and truly man, of a rational soul and body, consubstantial with the Father according to the Godhead and consubstantial with us according to the manhood, in all things like unto us without sin, begotten before all ages of the Father according to the Godhead, and in these latter days, for us and for our salvation, born of the Virgin Mary, the Mother of God, according to the manhood, one and the same Christ, Son, Lord, only begotten, to be acknowledged in two natures, unconfusedly, unchangeably, indivisibly, inseparably, the distinction of natures being by no means taken away by the union, but rather the property of each nature being preserved and concurring in one person and one subsistence.
  zh: 所以，我们遵循圣父们的教导，众口一词地教导人承认同一位子，我们的主耶稣基督，他在神性上是完全的，在人性上也是完全的，真正的神，真正的人，有理性的灵魂和身体，按神性与父同体，按人性与我们同体，凡事与我们相同，只是没有罪。按神性，他在万世之前为父所生；按人性，他在末后的日子为我们和我们的救恩，由神的母亲童贞马利亚所生。同一位基督，子，主，独生子，应当在两性中被承认，不混乱，不改变，不分割，不分离。两性的区别绝不因联合而消除，反而各性的特性得以保留，并在一个位格和一个本体中结合。
- start: 1237.963
  end: 1258.309
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Not parted or divided into two persons, but one and the same Son, and only begotten, God the Word, the Lord Jesus Christ, as the prophets from the beginning have declared concerning him, and as the Lord Jesus Christ himself has taught us, and the creed of the Holy Fathers has handed down to us.
  zh: 不分开或分裂为两位格，而是同一位子，独生子，神的道，主耶稣基督，正如先知们从起初所宣告的，主耶稣基督自己所教导的，以及圣父们的信经所传给我们的。
- start: 1260.16
  end: 1261.0
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: That's it.
  zh: 就是这样。
- start: 1261.0
  end: 1263.241
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: That's the Chalcedonian Definition.
  zh: 这就是迦克墩定义。
- start: 1263.541
  end: 1273.603
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: One person in two natures, the natures being neither changed nor mixed up, and yet the union resulting in a single personhood.
  zh: 两性中的一个位格，性既不改变也不混淆，但联合导致一个单一的位格。
- start: 1274.483
  end: 1284.185
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Well, in the end, Eutyches and Dioscorus were excommunicated, and Dioscorus was deposed as bishop from the Sea of Alexandria.
  zh: 最终，尤提克和狄奥斯库罗斯被逐出教会，狄奥斯库罗斯被免去亚历山大主教的职务。
- start: 1284.625
  end: 1290.611
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: And the council again affirmed the orthodoxy of the Marian title, Mother of God.
  zh: 会议再次确认了马利亚称号「神的母亲」的正统性。
- start: 1291.212
  end: 1306.448
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: But sadly, in the aftermath of this fourth ecumenical council, the followers of Nestorius, as well as those of Eutyches and Dioscorus, did not submit to the church and the councils, but left the church in schism.
  zh: 但遗憾的是，在第四次大公会议之后，聂斯脱里的追随者，以及尤提克和狄奥斯库罗斯的追随者，没有顺服教会和会议，而是分裂离开了教会。
- start: 1306.668
  end: 1312.933
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: And this was the first major schism of the church and one which remains to this day.
  zh: 这是教会的第一次重大分裂，至今仍然存在。
- start: 1313.474
  end: 1327.365
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Those communions which are descended from these factions are known today collectively as the non-Chalcedonian communions because they still do not accept the authority of the Fourth Ecumenical Council.
  zh: 这些派别的后裔今天被统称为非迦克墩派，因为他们仍然不接受第四次大公会议的权威。
- start: 1327.425
  end: 1330.067
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: And I'll come back to that point in a moment.
  zh: 我稍后会回到这一点。
- start: 1330.928
  end: 1349.455
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Before we get to that, for those of you who are following the superhero analogies, if Apollinarius' monothelite Christology could be represented by Iron Man and Nestorianism could be represented by the Incredible Hulk, is there a Monophysite superhero?
  zh: 在我们谈到那之前，对于那些跟随超级英雄比喻的人来说，如果亚波里拿留的单意志基督论可以用钢铁侠代表，聂斯脱里主义可以用绿巨人代表，那么有一性论的超级英雄吗？
- start: 1349.775
  end: 1351.176
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Well, maybe.
  zh: 嗯，也许有。
- start: 1351.236
  end: 1354.497
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Perhaps the Silver Surfer or Vision.
  zh: 也许是银影侠或幻视。
- start: 1354.797
  end: 1357.599
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Heroes who never really become human.
  zh: 那些从未真正成为人的英雄。
- start: 1357.859
  end: 1373.15
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Or, for you Doctor Who fans, you could find an analogy for the Monophysite Christ in the Cybermen or the Daleks, beings who once were human, but the union with the superhuman has erased the humanity in them.
  zh: 或者，对于《神秘博士》的粉丝来说，你可以在赛博人或戴立克中找到一性论基督的比喻，这些曾经是人的存在，但与超人的结合抹去了他们的人性。
- start: 1373.911
  end: 1383.497
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: The point being that Monophysite Christology, like Apollinarian and Nestorian, is not really an incarnation.
  zh: 关键是，一性论基督论，像亚波里拿留和聂斯脱里一样，并不是真正的道成肉身。
- start: 1384.278
  end: 1403.563
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: If Apollinarianism was more of an indwelling, the divine word in a skin suit, and Nestorianism was more of a juxtaposition, like oil and vinegar, Monophysite Christology is something like a God who visits us but never really becomes one of us.
  zh: 如果亚波里拿留主义更像是内住，神的道在一个皮囊中，聂斯脱里主义更像是并列，如油和醋，那么一性论基督论就像是一个访问我们的神，但从未真正成为我们中的一员。
- start: 1403.743
  end: 1411.805
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: And as I hinted earlier, this ends up not being very different from a Docetic or even a Gnostic view of Christ.
  zh: 正如我早先暗示的，这最终与幻影说甚至诺斯底派对基督的看法没有太大区别。
- start: 1413.453
  end: 1417.274
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Now, there is an epilogue to all of this that we have to talk about.
  zh: 现在，关于这一切，我们必须谈谈一个结尾。
- start: 1417.714
  end: 1425.737
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Since the 5th century, the non-Chalcedonian factions have coalesced into legitimate ecclesial communions.
  zh: 自五世纪以来，非迦克墩派已经合并为合法的教会共融体。
- start: 1426.297
  end: 1439.221
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: The Nestorians became what is now called the Assyrian Church of the East, and those who broke away in support of Eutyches and Dioscorus are now known as the Oriental Orthodox Churches.
  zh: 聂斯脱里派成为现在所谓的东方亚述教会，而那些支持尤提克和狄奥斯库罗斯而分裂的人，现在被称为东方正统教会。
- start: 1439.775
  end: 1447.1
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: So before we close, I want to say a word about each of these, if you'll bear with me while I presume to speak for them for just a bit.
  zh: 所以在结束之前，我想对这些说几句话，如果你们愿意容忍我稍微代表他们说几句。
- start: 1447.34
  end: 1456.106
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Now, full disclosure, when it comes to the Assyrian Church of the East, I have never had any direct contact with anyone from that communion.
  zh: 现在，坦白说，关于东方亚述教会，我从未与该共融体的任何人有过直接接触。
- start: 1456.426
  end: 1469.795
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Back in the day when I first started teaching this material, I had reached out to both sides of the non-Chalcedonians in the hope that I could invite someone from their communions to come to my classes and speak to my students.
  zh: 当我第一次开始教授这些材料时，我曾联系非迦克墩派的双方，希望能邀请他们共融体中的人来我的课堂对我的学生讲话。
- start: 1470.276
  end: 1477.362
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: But the Assyrians never returned my calls or my emails, so I don't know anyone in that communion personally.
  zh: 但亚述人从未回复我的电话或邮件，所以我个人不认识该共融体中的任何人。
- start: 1477.463
  end: 1479.004
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: But I do know this.
  zh: 但我知道这一点。
- start: 1479.325
  end: 1483.909
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: They seem to have softened their opposition to the Chalcedonian definition.
  zh: 他们似乎已软化了对迦克墩定义的反对。
- start: 1484.21
  end: 1493.218
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Some of them even claim that Nestorius himself had agreed to it, or would have, though he died in 451, the same year as the council.
  zh: 他们中有些人甚至声称聂斯脱里本人已同意，或会同意，虽然他于451年去世，与会议同年。
- start: 1493.859
  end: 1519.45
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: But it seems that in the context of ecumenical dialogue between the Catholic Church and the Assyrian Church of the East, we can agree that there were some things lost in translation, that perhaps Nestorius himself was misunderstood, or that his followers after him took things farther than he did, so that it could be said that Nestorianism went farther than Nestorius.
  zh: 但在天主教会与东方亚述教会的合一对话中，我们似乎可以同意有些东西在翻译中失落了，或许聂斯脱里本人被误解了，或者他的追随者走得比他更远，所以可以说聂斯脱里主义比聂斯脱里本人走得更远。
- start: 1519.97
  end: 1543.977
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Now, whatever the truth of that is, our point is not to excuse Nestorius for heresy, but to say that the Assyrian Church of the East of today has been willing to distance themselves from the specific heresy of Nestorianism, and perhaps even admit that the title Mother of God for the Blessed Virgin Mary is appropriate even if they don't use it much.
  zh: 现在，无论事实如何，我们的重点不是为聂斯脱里的异端开脱，而是说今天的东方亚述教会愿意与聂斯脱里主义的具体异端保持距离，甚至可能承认为圣母马利亚使用「神的母亲」这个称号是合适的，尽管他们不常用。
- start: 1544.458
  end: 1559.814
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: And so, in 1994, the Catholic Church and the Assyrian Church of the East dropped their mutual accusations of heresy, and each affirmed that the other is a valid expression of Christianity.
  zh: 因此，在1994年，天主教会和东方亚述教会放弃了对彼此的异端指控，并各自确认对方是基督教的有效表达。
- start: 1560.075
  end: 1574.247
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: In other words, we don't call them heretics anymore, because through dialogue we've been able to clarify how we may see things slightly differently, but both ways of describing Christ are within the bounds of orthodoxy.
  zh: 换句话说，我们不再称他们为异端，因为通过对话，我们能够澄清我们可能略有不同的看法，但这两种描述基督的方式都在正统的范围内。
- start: 1574.628
  end: 1582.035
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Now, when it comes to the Oriental Orthodox, they did return my phone calls, and I have been blessed to become friends with some of them.
  zh: 现在，谈到东方正统教会，他们确实回了我的电话，我有幸与其中一些人成为朋友。
- start: 1582.295
  end: 1595.507
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: The Oriental Orthodox churches today include the Coptic Church, which is primarily the Egyptian church headquartered at Alexandria, and also the Ethiopian Orthodox Church, with a few other groups.
  zh: 今天的东方正统教会包括科普特教会，主要是以亚历山大为总部的埃及教会，还有埃塞俄比亚正统教会和其他一些团体。
- start: 1595.868
  end: 1599.952
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: My friends are in the Coptic Church, and so I know their situation best.
  zh: 我的朋友在科普特教会，所以我最了解他们的情况。
- start: 1600.712
  end: 1612.661
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Just like the Assyrian Church of the East has distanced itself from Nestorianism, and don't get me wrong, Nestorianism is still a heresy, but they have distanced themselves from it.
  zh: 就像东方亚述教会与聂斯脱里主义保持距离一样，别误会，聂斯脱里主义仍然是异端，但他们与之保持距离。
- start: 1613.041
  end: 1619.145
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Well, like that, the Coptic Christians would also distance themselves from Eutyches.
  zh: 同样，科普特基督徒也会与尤提克保持距离。
- start: 1619.386
  end: 1623.468
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Today they would say that Eutyches was indeed a heretic.
  zh: 今天他们会说尤提克确实是异端。
- start: 1623.529
  end: 1626.411
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Monophysite Christology is still a heresy.
  zh: 一性论基督论仍然是异端。
- start: 1626.891
  end: 1633.874
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: But they see their legacy connected more to Dioscorus, who, they will say, got railroaded for political reasons.
  zh: 但他们认为自己的传承更多地与狄奥斯库罗斯相连，他们会说他因政治原因被冤屈。
- start: 1634.194
  end: 1639.476
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: But really, their hero is Cyril of Alexandria, who was never accused of heresy.
  zh: 但实际上，他们的英雄是亚历山大的区利罗，他从未被指控为异端。
- start: 1640.256
  end: 1658.284
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: In addition, the Coptics don't refer to their Christology as Monophysite, because they agree that Christ must have two natures, and that the human nature can't get cancelled out by the divine, and that the divine nature can't change into some third thing like an alloy.
  zh: 此外，科普特人不称他们的基督论为一性论，因为他们同意基督必须有两性，人性不能被神性取消，神性也不能变成某种合金般的第三种东西。
- start: 1658.964
  end: 1664.526
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: In fact, it doesn't sound to me like they have any objection to the Chalcedonian definition at all.
  zh: 事实上，在我看来，他们似乎对迦克墩定义没有任何异议。
- start: 1664.727
  end: 1675.951
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: What they object to is the authority of the Council of Chalcedon itself on the basis of the political intrigue surrounding it and their feeling that Dioscorus got a raw deal.
  zh: 他们反对的是迦克墩会议本身的权威，基于围绕它的政治阴谋，以及他们觉得狄奥斯库罗斯受到了不公正的待遇。
- start: 1676.912
  end: 1687.756
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Now, to be precise, they still prefer Cyril's language of one person out of two natures over Leo's language of one person in two natures.
  zh: 确切地说，他们仍然更喜欢区利罗的「由两性组成的一个位格」的语言，而不是良的「两性中的一个位格」。
- start: 1688.136
  end: 1699.32
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: But nevertheless, just like with the other side, we can see how they have a slightly different way of describing Christ, yet still stay within the boundaries of orthodoxy.
  zh: 但同样，我们可以看到他们对基督的描述方式略有不同，但仍然在正统的范围内。
- start: 1699.74
  end: 1719.193
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: And so, in 1973, the Catholic Church and the Coptic Church dropped the mutual accusations of heresy, and Pope Paul VI and the Coptic Patriarch issued a joint statement on Christology clarifying the common ground, all of which is orthodox.
  zh: 因此，在1973年，天主教会和科普特教会放弃了对彼此的异端指控，教宗保禄六世和科普特牧首就基督论发表了联合声明，澄清了共同点，所有这些都是正统的。
- start: 1719.714
  end: 1726.298
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: So, if the Coptics don't call their Christology Monophysite, what do they call it?
  zh: 那么，如果科普特人不称他们的基督论为一性论，他们称之为什么？
- start: 1726.699
  end: 1729.24
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: They call it Meaphysite.
  zh: 他们称之为米亚性论。
- start: 1730.162
  end: 1733.924
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: What's the difference between mono and mia?
  zh: 「mono」和「mia」有什么区别？
- start: 1734.305
  end: 1738.728
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: It's like the difference in English between mono and uni.
  zh: 这就像英语中「mono」和「uni」的区别。
- start: 1739.949
  end: 1744.352
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Mia, like uni, means both in one.
  zh: 「mia」，像「uni」，意思是两者合一。
- start: 1744.73
  end: 1750.694
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: So if you go to a unisex hairstylist, they do hair of both men and women.
  zh: 所以如果你去一家男女共用的理发店，他们为男女都理发。
- start: 1751.515
  end: 1758.501
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: So Monophysite Christology means only one nature, and that's still a heresy.
  zh: 所以一性论基督论意味着只有一个性，那仍然是异端。
- start: 1759.081
  end: 1765.106
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Meaphysite Christology means both in one, both natures in one.
  zh: 米亚性论基督论意味着两者合一，两性合一。
- start: 1765.583
  end: 1773.447
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: They will say one composite nature, but it's both in one as opposed to only one.
  zh: 他们会说是一个复合性，但这是两者合一，而不是只有一个。
- start: 1773.828
  end: 1780.372
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Slightly different than the way we say it in the mainstream Catholic Church, but still within the bounds of orthodoxy.
  zh: 与主流天主教会的说法略有不同，但仍在正统的范围内。
- start: 1781.263
  end: 1788.124
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Now, I know that's a very slight distinction, but it does make the difference between heresy and orthodoxy.
  zh: 我知道这是一个非常细微的区别，但它确实区分了异端和正统。
- start: 1788.124
  end: 1789.745
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: And that's not just me talking.
  zh: 这不仅仅是我说的。
- start: 1789.745
  end: 1798.806
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: That's Pope Paul VI and Pope St. John Paul II. So here's another analogy that might help you think about the difference.
  zh: 这是教宗保禄六世和圣若望保禄二世说的。这里有另一个比喻，可能帮助你思考这个区别。
- start: 1799.307
  end: 1806.008
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Think of the two natures of Jesus Christ as singers, two voices singing a song.
  zh: 把耶稣基督的两性想象成歌手，两个声音在唱一首歌。
- start: 1806.968
  end: 1811.772
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Monophysite Christology, the Christology of Eutyches, which is a heresy.
  zh: 一性论基督论，尤提克的基督论，是异端。
- start: 1811.873
  end: 1822.001
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Monophysite Christology is a monotone, like only one voice singing a solo, and that's a heresy because there's only one voice.
  zh: 一性论基督论是单调的，就像只有一个声音在独唱，那是异端，因为只有一个声音。
- start: 1822.001
  end: 1826.204
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: We need two natures, so the analogy has to have two voices.
  zh: 我们需要两性，所以比喻中必须有两个声音。
- start: 1826.645
  end: 1836.551
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Now, Nestorian Christology has two voices, but that would be like two different people singing two different songs, which of course is also a heresy.
  zh: 现在，聂斯脱里基督论有两个声音，但那就像两个人在唱两首不同的歌，这当然也是异端。
- start: 1836.991
  end: 1848.335
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: But Meaphysite Christology is like two voices singing in unison, whereas mainstream Catholic Christology is like two voices singing in harmony.
  zh: 但米亚性论基督论就像两个声音齐唱，而主流天主教基督论就像两个声音和声。
- start: 1848.935
  end: 1853.897
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: So the Coptics have a Jesus who is two natures singing in unison.
  zh: 所以科普特人有一个耶稣，他的两性齐唱。
- start: 1854.058
  end: 1858.039
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: We Catholics have a Jesus who is two natures singing in harmony.
  zh: 我们天主教徒有一个耶稣，他的两性和声。
- start: 1858.34
  end: 1865.043
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Both ways of looking at Christ's two natures are acceptable because they both have two natures.
  zh: 这两种看待基督两性的方式都是可以接受的，因为它们都有两性。
- start: 1865.103
  end: 1879.493
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: The Coptics are just leaning more into Cyril of Alexandria's language and the union of the two natures, and we Catholics are leaning more into the Western way of thinking about it, which is like that marriage analogy.
  zh: 科普特人只是更倾向于亚历山大的区利罗的语言和两性的结合，而我们天主教徒更倾向于西方的思维方式，就像那个婚姻的比喻。
- start: 1880.114
  end: 1888.702
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: The bottom line is that the heresy of Monophysite Christology results in a conception of Christ who is just not human enough.
  zh: 归根结底，一性论基督论的异端导致对基督的理解不够人性化。
- start: 1888.843
  end: 1893.226
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: So he's not really one of us, not consubstantial with us.
  zh: 所以他不是真正的我们中的一员，不与我们同体。
- start: 1894.228
  end: 1908.883
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Meaphysite Christology, as we see in the Oriental Orthodox Communions, doesn't fall into the trap of diminishing Christ's humanity, so their description of Christ is one of us, is consubstantial with us.
  zh: 米亚性论基督论，如我们在东方正统共融体中所见，没有陷入削弱基督人性的陷阱，所以他们对基督的描述是他是我们中的一员，与我们同体。
- start: 1909.163
  end: 1920.386
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Now, of course, when I say that we have dropped the mutual accusations of heresy with the non-Chalcedonian communions, that does not imply that we have Eucharistic unity with them.
  zh: 当然，当我说我们与非迦克墩共融体放弃了相互的异端指控时，并不意味着我们与他们有圣餐的合一。
- start: 1920.386
  end: 1921.426
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: We do not.
  zh: 我们没有。
- start: 1921.426
  end: 1927.768
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: And so we cannot share that ultimate act of unity, which is the sacrament of the Eucharist.
  zh: 所以我们不能分享那最终的合一行动，就是圣餐的圣事。
- start: 1928.188
  end: 1943.616
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: But that Eucharistic unity, however far out in the future it may be, that is the stated goal of the Dicastery for the Promotion of Christian Unity, which is what used to be called the Pontifical Council for the Promotion of Christian Unity.
  zh: 但无论圣餐合一在未来多么遥远，那是促进基督徒合一部的明确目标，过去称为促进基督徒合一委员会。
- start: 1944.598
  end: 1951.065
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: And it is true that dialogue with the Eastern Communions, especially the Coptics, has been strained lately.
  zh: 确实，最近与东方共融体，尤其是科普特人的对话有些紧张。
- start: 1951.581
  end: 1956.864
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: But I hope that you will join me in praying for increasing unity in the near future.
  zh: 但我希望你们能和我一起祈祷，希望在不久的将来能有更大的合一。
- start: 1957.725
  end: 1974.936
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: The point of this whole epilogue is that, in spite of the fact that Nestorianism and Eutyches' Monophysite Christology are both heresies, we no longer think of the Assyrian Church of the East or the Oriental Orthodox Churches as heretics.
  zh: 这整个结尾的重点是，尽管聂斯脱里主义和尤提克的一性论基督论都是异端，我们不再认为东方亚述教会或东方正统教会是异端。
- start: 1975.157
  end: 1980.76
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: We call them our Christian brothers, separated brothers, but still Christians.
  zh: 我们称他们为我们的基督徒兄弟，分离的兄弟，但仍然是基督徒。
- start: 1982.0
  end: 1992.866
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: But now, if you're thinking, hey, wait a minute, how is it that the heretics of Chalcedon are no longer heretics, but the heretics of Nicaea still are?
  zh: 但现在，如果你在想，嘿，等等，为什么迦克墩的异端不再是异端，而尼西亚的异端仍然是？
- start: 1993.786
  end: 2000.45
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Well, I'm going to get into that question in the concluding episode to this series on the heresies.
  zh: 好吧，我将在本系列异端的最后一集中讨论这个问题。
- start: 2000.57
  end: 2010.535
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: At this point, it looks like that will be episode 18, just after the next one, which will be the heresy of Iconoclasm.
  zh: 目前看来，那将是第18集，就在下一集之后，下一集将是破坏圣像的异端。
- start: 2010.556
  end: 2011.716
  speaker: SPEAKER_01
  en: Thanks for listening.
  zh: 感谢收听。
- start: 2042.065
  end: 2045.367
  speaker: SPEAKER_00
  en: Way of the Fathers is a production of CatholicCulture.org.
  zh: 《教父之道》由CatholicCulture.org制作。
- start: 2045.367
  end: 2061.235
  speaker: SPEAKER_00
  en: Check out our other podcasts, including Catholic Culture Audiobooks, bringing to life classic Catholic writings, Criteria, the Catholic Film Podcast, featuring deep analysis of great films from a Catholic perspective, and the Catholic Culture Podcast, an interview show exploring Catholic arts, culture, and issues.
  zh: 请查看我们的其他播客，包括《天主教文化有声书》，让经典天主教著作栩栩如生；《标准》，天主教电影播客，从天主教视角深入分析伟大电影；以及《天主教文化播客》，一个探索天主教艺术、文化和问题的访谈节目。
- start: 2061.235
  end: 2067.018
  speaker: SPEAKER_00
  en: You'll find all of this, as well as Catholic news, commentary, liturgical year resources, and much more at CatholicCulture.org.
  zh: 你可以在CatholicCulture.org找到所有这些，以及天主教新闻、评论、礼仪年资源等更多内容。
